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Stannis and the bastards


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#1 Victarion the Awesome

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:16 AM

If Shireen were to die, would Stannis legitimize one of Robert's bastards to carry on the Baratheon line? If so which one?

 

It's been theorized that Mel will burn Shireen to resurrect Jon, thus fulfilling the prophecy of a dragon (Jon Targ) being woken from stone (Greyscale Shireen.) If this happens, the legitimate Baratheon line will be finished. 

 

Robert still has a few bastards left, even after Cercei's purge.

 

If Stannis legitimized one of Robert's bastards, Edric Storm would seem to be the logical choice. He was recognized by Robert, grew up in a Baratheon household, and has been raised and tutored as befits the son of a king. However, Stannis has always resented him because of the manner of his conception, and at one point was ready to put him to death.

 

Stannis might pick Gendry instead. We know he visited him at Tobho Mott's forge with Jon Arryn, and it's possible the BWB in the neck could meet up with Stannis' forces. It's become trendy in Westeros to believe that hard living, such as sleeping under hedges and poling boats, can make a boy a better king. Would Stannis choose the boy who's worked hard his whole life?

 

What about Mya Stone? Does Stannis even know about her?

 

What do you think?



#2 Stan the Man Baratheon

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:19 AM

I prefer Gendry over Edric Storm any day.



#3 Gneisenau

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:20 AM

Stannis would let Mel kill his daughter ?

#4 Stan the Man Baratheon

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:22 AM

Stannis would let Mel kill his daughter ?

He wouldn't know about it until shes dead, once she dies, Mel dies too.



#5 Gneisenau

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:29 AM

He wouldn't know about it until shes dead, once she dies, Mel dies too.


Stannis knows that Mel can see her death (or the possibility of it happening), so he wouldn't be able to kill her.

Edited by Gneisenau, 10 December 2013 - 03:29 AM.


#6 Nictarion

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:30 AM

I don't think he would legitimize any of Robert's bastards. More likely he would suck it up, and do the deed with queen mustache again to make another heir. Although if Selyse lets Mel burn Shireen, he should kill both of them.

#7 Stan the Man Baratheon

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:37 AM

I don't think he would legitimize any of Robert's bastards. More likely he would suck it up, and do the deed with queen mustache again to make another heir. Although if Selyse lets Mel burn Shireen, he should kill both of them.

Trust me man, he will kill both of them if anything happens to Queen Shireen Baratheon. Lol at queen mustache joke.



#8 The Drunkard

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:39 AM

There might be some "Harry the Heir" type running around the Stormlands that no one has made note of, that Stannis would turn to if Shireen died. I think it'd probably make more sense to legitimize a bastard of the king than rely on a noble really distantly related that doesn't even carry the Baratheon name, but you never know.

 

If I had to guess I'd say he would send for Edric and legitimize him.



#9 ( Bloodraven )

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:54 AM

For all her faults, Selyse is a protective mother so I like to think she wouldnt let Mel burn her daughter :(

Re: bastards, idk what Stannis would do if Shireen died. I prefer Gendry over Edric, but the latter is more educated and a well-known Baratheon bastard so maybe Stan would choose him.

#10 Mikkel

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 03:59 AM

It might actually be interesting to see Selyse having to choose between Red Rollo and her daughter. Except Shireen seems a good kid despite the screwed up circumstances she's in, and I don't fancy even the risk of Selyse choosing wrong.



#11 Catastrophe

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 04:00 AM

I firmly believe that when everything's said and done, Edric Storm Baratheon will end up taking the Iron Throne and reigning as the undisputed King of Westeros.



#12 Petyr Patter

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 04:01 AM

Legitimizing one of Robert's bastards is a chicken and egg legal dilemma.  The sons of a man's body always come before his brothers in matters of inheritance.  Which means, if Stannis legitimizes one of Robert's bastards, they would come before Stannis (and Shireen) as Robert's heir, cutting in front of Stannis in line of succession.  Hence, Stannis wouldn't be kings... which means the bastard was never legitimized.

 

Which means it isn't something Stannis is going to rush to do, even though the legal implications can certainly be handwaved away.  Plus, Stannis appears to have a strong bias against bastards.

 

Regardless, this thread sort of summarizes my feelings on Stannis's heir: http://asoiaf.wester...-the-shaggydog/

 

 



It's been theorized that Mel will burn Shireen to resurrect Jon, thus fulfilling the prophecy of a dragon (Jon Targ) being woken from stone (Greyscale Shireen.) If this happens, the legitimate Baratheon line will be finished. 

 

What do you think?

 

Me, from the same thread...

 

 

  1. Melissandre wanted to sacrifice Edric in order to "wake the stone dragons" of Dragonstone.  There are no stone dragons on the Wall.  Furthermore, she didn't want to sacrifice "stone" to wake a dragon, she wanted to wake "stone dragons."  The two strike me as almost completely different.  If anything, Mel would want to sacrifice Jon (king's blood) to wake the dormant Targaryen blood in Shireen.
  2. Then, the link between Shireen and "stone" is incredibly tenuous.  She has scars of the greyscale disease, and people in Essos with a highly advanced occurrence of the disease are called "stone men."  I don't think the same naming exists in Westeros, and Shireen with a dormant case of grey scale would not be a "stone women."  Skagos means "stone" in the old tongue as well, hence its people see themselves as "stone men."  I still wouldn't read to much into it.
  3. We've never seen Melissandre resurrect anyone.  We have seen Thoros and Beric resurrect others, and they did so with a "kiss of fire," not a fiery blood sacrifice. 
  4. Despite being a POV character, there is no evidence that Mel has wavered from her firm belief that Stannis is Azor Ahai.  She might consider Jon an important soldier in the fight against the Others/Great Other, being that he leads the Wall.  However, even when she asks for visions of Azor Ahai, and sees Jon Snow, she finds herself disappointed that the flames deny her visions of Azor Ahai.  With such faith in Stannis, she won't kill his only daughter, except to possibly save Stannis himself.  She is, I'll grant you, fanatic.
  5. Finally, we've already seen Dragons raised from Stone: Khal Drogo's funeral pyre.  We have the stone eggs, you have the fire, and you have king's blood, either Khal Drogo himself, or Daenerys.  Plus, the blood of innocents in Mirri.  It resulted in Dragons.  I think Mel is misinterpretting her visions again, thinking she is the one to make wake them, while whatever Daenerys did already woke them.

So, I think the "sacrifice Shireen" thread is totally unsupported.

 

However, I've stated elsewhere that I think Stannis gives Highgarden to Edric Storm


Edited by Petyr Patter, 10 December 2013 - 04:02 AM.


#13 Victarion the Awesome

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 08:41 AM

However, I've stated elsewhere that I think Stannis gives Highgarden to Edric Storm

Highgarden? Do you mean Storm's End?



#14 Feliciano69

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 09:05 AM

Stannis knows that Mel can see her death (or the possibility of it happening), so he wouldn't be able to kill her.

 

Her visions aren't exactly High Definition, she interprets what she sees.



#15 rodrik Cassel

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 10:05 AM

 
Her visions aren't exactly High Definition, she interprets what she sees.

Badly.

#16 E-Ro

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 10:10 AM

Yeah, shireen getting killed would be horrible, and I do feel that Stannis would kill mel if she did it. As to wether selsye would let it happen, I cant say.

As for the matter of bastards, I think he would be most likely to legitimize edric storm.

#17 Petyr Patter

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 01:33 PM

Highgarden? Do you mean Storm's End?

 

Nope, Highgarden. 

 

Remember, Edric Storm is Florent by his mother, and the Florents can trace their lineage to the old kings of the Reach better than the Tyrells.  Meanwhile, the Tyrells are probably the most treacherous house in all of Westeros, by Stannis's reckoning.  Some knights and lords fought for Joffrey thinking him the rightful king.  They same might be said of the men who fought for Robb.  Yet, the Tyrells knew what they were doing was plain old usurpation but didn't care.  Then, they turn around and ally themselves with the king they once sought to overthrow.

 

For their "twice treachery," Garth Tyrell was awarded Brightwater Keep, the seat of House Florent.  If Stannis has any sort of success, he will strip the Tyrells of their seat, and to complete the insult, give it to a bastard.  Perhaps.



#18 Thucydides

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 01:39 PM

If Selyse and Shireen died, Stannis could marry Margaery Tyrell. Just kidding.



#19 The Red Melli

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 01:47 PM

I honestly don't think Melisandre would burn Shireen. If I recall Melisandre hasn't mentioned a thing about the dragon prophecy and kingsblood sice ASOS.
Jon Snow's body would probably be burned if he's dead and will be reborn admidst salt and smoke if he's AA.

#20 Ser Leftwich

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Posted 10 December 2013 - 01:51 PM

Noble bastard > peasant bastard