Role in WoW: Sansa Stark (Spoilers)

[Ours if the Fury]

Okay this is just like the thread on Jon Snow.

The five most likely outcomes i can see occurring are these.

A. Sansa marries Harry the Heir, and then with some smart moves by Littlefinger, the Vale declares for her and they go to war, first striking out against the Lannisters. the only question is do the river lords and northern lords declare for her or not?

B. Sansa marries Harry the Heir, and gets the support of the Vale lords, but then little finger has Harry killed, but with the support already in sansa's favour the Vale lords still go to war, Sansa and Littlefinger become close and he teaches her how to play the game, and they enter the war a team.

C. The same as B, but just when Sansa is good enough to outsmart little finger, she fools him and pushes him out the moon door, killing him? Does this sound possible?

D. Sansa, is married to sweet robin, who dies very soon after the marriage, this causes uproar and to take advantage of the opportunity Littlefinger marries sansa and then reveals her true identity, and this causes the vale lords to go to war for her, but soon into the marriage little finger abuses sansa, and she turns on him and kills him taking the mental herself.

E. Much like the others except that the Vale lords kill little finger after they get fed up with his games…

What are you opinions and insights?

I hope to get a few replies !!!

[Nictarion]

Well hers and LF's first priority should be to get her marriage to Tyrion annulled. Which shouldn't be to hard since it was a forced marriage, and never consummated. I personally suspect Sweet Robin to die early on in WoW, and Sansa to marry Harry. It will be interesting what happens if Davos brings Rickon back, all of a sudden there's a couple Starks back in the game. I would say A is most likely.

[Ours if the Fury]

Well hers and LF's first priority should be to get her marriage to Tyrion annulled. Which shouldn't be to hard since it was a forced marriage, and never consummated. I personally suspect Sweet Robin to die early on in WoW, and Sansa to marry Harry. It will be interesting what happens if Davos brings Rickon back, all of a sudden there's a couple Starks back in the game. I would say A is most likely.

Like the insight !!!, but what happens to your LF in your opinion ?

[Nictarion]

Like the insight !!!, but what happens to your LF in your opinion ?

I actually am not really sold on the idea he will die anytime soon. I definitely don't think Sansa would be the one to kill him if he does. It would probably be pissed off Vale lords, maybe Harry himself.

[Ours if the Fury]

I actually am not really sold on the idea he will die anytime soon. I definitely don't think Sansa would be the one to kill him if he does. It would probably be pissed off Vale lords, maybe Harry himself.

Yeh it seems that there are only three realistic options currently for his death…

Sansa

Vale lords

or Varys (although thats a stretch i would love it)

[Nictarion]

Yeh it seems that there are only three realistic options currently for his death

Sansa

Vale lords

or Varys (although thats a stretch i would love it)

I'm conflicted over Sansa killing him. On one hand it would be awesome, on the other I kind of want her to keep her hands clean. She's one of the only characters without blood on her hands.

[Pod The Impaler]

F - Harry the Heir is groomed as Sweetrobin's heir and future leader of the Vale. Sansa is betrothed to HTH, possibly still known as Alayne Stone to all but HTH and a few select lords. Then Sweetrobin dies or is going to be killed, and Sansa flees from the whole situation.

G - Sansa is betrothed to Harry The Heir, but carried off by the Mountain Clans, "in the name of the Halfman". Littlefinger set this up, and intends for Harry and the Vale lords to go off looking for her and get killed. Instead, Jaime Lannister shows up because he thinks Tyrion is with the tribesmen, and ends up rescuing her instead. After a lot of back and forth exchange of information, he returns her to her mother to fulfill his oath.

[bloodofwinterfell]

I feel like Sansa is actually NOT going to end up marrying Harry the Heir. Littlefinger's plan on marrying her to him is contingent upon Tyrion dying and, well, that's doesn't seem like it's going to happen anytime soon. She can't get her marriage annulled either because she is wanted for regicide. Some have speculated that her marriage to Tyrion is a plot device to prevent her from unwanted marriages, and that's certainly possible.

Honestly, I can't even predict where her storyline is going. She and Arya - but even more so Arya - have the hardest story lines to predict. I can't think of anything specific but I do think she will start to become a player and be Littlefinger's downfall in some way. (I'm personally hopeful that Sansa will somehow get the Vale finally involved in the war by supporting the North and Riverlands, but I don't know how this is possible unless she's married to Harry the Heir. One can dream, though!)

And then there are some wildcards. What role will Shadrich play? Has Myranda figured out who she is - and what about the rest of the Lords Declarant? Is the Blackfish going to show up in the Vale? Will Sweetrobin die? Will the mountain clans become more important? Is Dany going to land in the Vale? And so on...

I'm really looking forward to her chapters in TWOW. From what we know:

• the first two chapters were originally supposed to be in ADWD but they kicked off a new storyline so they were saved for TWOW
  
• there's something "lemon cake fans" will like
  
• a chapter will include something that might be controversial with some fans
  

Conclusion: I don't know what this means, but I'm excited! :D (And of course we probably won't get any Sansa previews before the book is released...)

[Ours if the Fury]

F - Harry the Heir is groomed as Sweetrobin's heir and future leader of the Vale. Sansa is betrothed to HTH, possibly still known as Alayne Stone to all but HTH and a few select lords. Then Sweetrobin dies or is going to be killed, and Sansa flees from the whole situation.

G - Sansa is betrothed to Harry The Heir, but carried off by the Mountain Clans, "in the name of the Halfman". Littlefinger set this up, and intends for Harry and the Vale lords to go off looking for her and get killed. Instead, Jaime Lannister shows up because he thinks Tyrion is with the tribesmen, and ends up rescuing her instead. After a lot of back and forth exchange of information, he returns her to her mother to fulfill his oath.

Thanks for the two new ones!

[The Iron Banker]

I think Sansa will play a big role in the next books, too much of a buildup with not a lot of happenings.

The Vale has been built up over 5 books but has done nothing

[ache]

I don't believe that Littlefingers plan involves the things he has told Sansa. I don't think he intends her to know his real plans until they're happening. All the Harry stuff etc seems like it might be something he thinks she would want or that she would at least find non-threatening enough to keep her quiet and compliant. Nobody Littlefinger has ever "helped" seemed to end up in a better position, except Littlefinger, in fact most of them ended up dead. He would be going against his own "clean hands" policy if it was ever revealed he was behind Sansa's disappearance, particularly considering she was aided in her escape the same night Joffrey was murdered.

BTW, what are "lemoncakes fans". Is it just a name for Sansa fans or something else?

[Facebookless Man]

H) sansa will ride north on a giant firebreathing lemoncake and slay the great other with her bare hands

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

H) sansa will ride north on a giant firebreathing lemoncake and slay the great other with her bare hands

:bowdown:

[Ours if the Fury]

I think Sansa will play a big role in the next books, too much of a buildup with not a lot of happenings.

The Vale has been built up over 5 books but has done nothing

Yeh i assume this too, because i think her story will mostly finish up in WoW, and she will only be minor in DoS

[The Iron Banker]

Yeh i assume this too, because i think her story will mostly finish up in WoW, and she will only be minor in DoS

I agree, I think Sansa will play a major role in (at least trying to) restoring the North with her arc wrapping up in TWOW, I dont think she dies btw

[Ladylance]

I don't think Littlefinger's plans are exactly what he told Sansa, and even if they are, I don't think she's actually going to marry Harry the Heir. I don't think GRRM would just tell us Littlefinger's plans and have them play out perfectly, that would be boring! Plus of course there are several factors Littlefinger has not taken into account, such as Daenerys, the Others, (f)Aegon, the mountain men or some person recognising/rescuing Sansa before he is ready to reveal her.

Some things that could throw a spanner in the works:

I) Bronze Yohn Royce (Miranda's dad) presumably saw Sansa when he visited Winterfell with his son (Waymar Royce, who died in the prologue of GoT). She would have probably been about 10-11, but there is every posibility that he knows who she is, even with her hair dyed, and this is why he has sent Miranda to befriend her. If he can reveal her to the Vale before Littlefinger does, I think that would mess up Littlefinger's plans a lot, and some of the Knights of the Vale might even declare for her in her own right, rather than Littlefinger. Equally, some might want to turn her over to King's Landing, so in this scenario, Sansa might end up leaving the Vale sharpish! Littlefinger might leave too, meaning there is a power vacuum in the Vale (potentially just as Dany arrives?)

J) Sansa is found and recognised by Brienne or some other person realises who she is (e.g. Ser Shadrick). It's probably not going to happen, especially as Brienne's story arc seems to have changed, but it could. In this case, Littlefinger probably dies and what happens to Sansa would probably be a bit uncertain. This story arc could easily see the Vale destabilised, and the Knights of the Vale may declare for some other force.

K) Sansa escapes of her own volition. I think this is possible (although as the Vale is shut off for Winter, we won't get any poetic justice of pushing Littlefinger out of the moon door), especially if, for example, she realises Littlefinger has poisoned Robin Arryn. She also has her hairnet from King's Landing, which she could use to poison something. However, I find this unlikely unless Sansa is presented with a clear escape plan, after all, she thinks her whole family is dead, the country is in chaos, and winter is coming. Sansa has survived so far by making the best of the situation she is in, rather than acting rashly. I do think the murder of one of her last surviving relatives might push her over the edge though.

I think there is a reason the Knights of the Vale have been preserved as one of the final fighting forces in Westeros. The only other fighting force to really stay out of all conflict in such a way is the Dornish, and they will probably declare for (f)Aegon in TWOW (or possibly Dany if she turns up soon enough). There are only three reasons I can think of for this-

1) They will serve as an army for either Aegon or Dany in a "dance of the dragons" style conflict. For example, if Dany leaves large numbers of her forces in Essos, which is likely due to either a lack of ships, and the fact that many of them (apart from the unsullied, some of the sellswords, and a few Dothraki) probably won't want to leave slaver's bay, she is going to need more forces in Westeros, especially if she doesn't want to ally with Aegon and Dorne. She does have some support from the Iron Islanders (although they are divided among themselves) but ideally she would need a land force too, which the Knights of the Vale will serve as.

2) Sansa (or at least someone working through Sansa) will take them to the North. This will initially be to regain Winterfell, but ultimately they could end up as part of the fight against the Others. Perhaps Waymar Royce dying in the prologue is forshaddowing of this. I sort of think this is the most likely possibility, but I'm not 100% sure exactly how it will happen.

3) We are being set up for some conflict between the clansmen and the Vale nobility. Whilst this is possible, and has argueably been set up since the first book, I think that this is unlikely to happen in TWOW as we don't need more conflict (seperate from the main plot arc) in that book. However, it could happen after the main battles, or possibly before them- if the clansmen win, the Vale nobility may be forced out of the vale, which would serve as a catalyst for other action.

[ebevan91]

F - Harry the Heir is groomed as Sweetrobin's heir and future leader of the Vale. Sansa is betrothed to HTH, possibly still known as Alayne Stone to all but HTH and a few select lords. Then Sweetrobin dies or is going to be killed, and Sansa flees from the whole situation.

G - Sansa is betrothed to Harry The Heir, but carried off by the Mountain Clans, "in the name of the Halfman". Littlefinger set this up, and intends for Harry and the Vale lords to go off looking for her and get killed. Instead, Jaime Lannister shows up because he thinks Tyrion is with the tribesmen, and ends up rescuing her instead. After a lot of back and forth exchange of information, he returns her to her mother to fulfill his oath.

"G" is highly plausible, IMO.

[AtomixIGN]

Sansa meets Harry the Heir and dreads the marriage because she sees it as parallel to Cersei and Robert's marriage. Harry is a whore-monger and n love with a lowborn woman or has a passion for whores. She plots against Harry and Littlefinger behind the scenes while pretending to be gleeful about the match. Robin dies and she marries Harry and uses her knowledge of LFs players to turn them against him and gets Harry killed - Out-playing the Best Players in the game and setting herself up as the Lady of the Vale and the Trident.

[The Iron Banker]

Sansa will marry Theon and rule over the world, it is known

[TheBastardofMichaelBolton]

G - Sansa is betrothed to Harry The Heir, but carried off by the Mountain Clans, "in the name of the Halfman". Littlefinger set this up, and intends for Harry and the Vale lords to go off looking for her and get killed. Instead, Jaime Lannister shows up because he thinks Tyrion is with the tribesmen, and ends up rescuing her instead. After a lot of back and forth exchange of information, he returns her to her mother to fulfill his oath.

This is something that I hadn't considered before, but I like it, or some variation of it. It also adds some twists to what seems like an otherwise straightforward kind of arc.

The other thing to consider is that Sansa doesn't have to kill Littlefinger to kill Littlefinger. Because she's his one weakness, he's revealed to her that he's manipulating the Vale lords, including the entire situation with the Lords Declarent, to his own ends. He has more support than he lets on, even with them, in Gulltown and, presumably, the Fingers, but it isn't the powerful support that he needs from them. His endgame, whatever it may be, is going to have a lot to do with how the lords shake out.

Because Sansa, as much as he's obsessed with her, is still just a pawn in his power game. The only difference is that she's wise to what he's doing and, as she grows into a woman, will begin to make independent decisions about her fate. He sees an object, a beautiful girl who reminds him of her mother, with whom he was completely besotted. That means there are two options: He's either trying to win her favor as Cat Jr., or he has her close out of some genuine desire to do something good with "Cat," and anything that involves her actual fate is tangential to his own goals. Maybe he sees them as tied up together. Maybe, in his brain, they're the same thing.

But it kind of doesn't matter. Sansa spent all that time in the Red Keep, being tortured and abused by the Lannisters. She wanted to be a princess, maybe even a queen, but it all turned to ashes in her mouth. Now she's with a master manipulator (who she'll begin to see through) who can't keep his mouth shut around her. She learned from Cersei, and now she's learning from Littlefinger. She also presumably learned from Tyrion (their relationship wasn't completely terrible), and of course will remember her own father and mother.

If Sansa has been paying attention, and assuming that she hasn't been turned into a complete cynic (her care for Sweetrobin shows that she still has her gentle side), she'll be able to see through Littlefinger's machinations. All of her lessons to date SHOULD have a) hate cruelty and b) see that the only way to get what you want is to outmaneuver others for it.

I have no idea what Sansa wants now or will want, but I can see her flip the script on Petyr: Not long into WoW, Sweetrobin "dies." She may sense or even be aware that her guardian played a role in that. Maybe even Harry did, at Petyr's suggestion. Now plays out Littlefinger's marriage scenario, with the end goal being to swing the Vale into the war for Winterfell and the Iron Throne by declaring for Cat's daughter. Or is Petyr's real goal ... Casterly Rock? He knows that Tyrion is Tywin's rightful heir, and here's his wife. The Imp may be gone and likely dead, but the real deal is here, a claimant to the Eyrie, Winterfell and the Rock. Why, an ambitious man might see that as an opportunity to tie together a new grand alliance against Stannis to the north and whatever the hell happens in the South, possibly strong enough to challenge for the Iron Throne (especially with the river lords to tie it all together).

Whether such a thing becomes reality, though, will depend on the promises made to Sansa, Harry's actual disposition, whether Rickon reappears in time ... and whether Sansa allows herself to continue to be used. I can see a scenario in which Petyr/Harry go/es a step too far, forcing our young maiden to make an important decision about herself and her fate. I can see the "controversial chapter" involving anything from the Tears of Lys to the moon door to a knife. But, either way, Sansa's making it to the end of this thing, and she's going to have to do some ugly things to get there.

Or Pod's thing above. That's good, too. :cool4: