Winterfell Resident Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 After reading all of the books in "A Song Of Ice And Fire", I've come to the conclusion that a united Westeros could never be conquered from the outside unless there was a HEAVY DOSE of Magic or Dragons involved. Could all of the combined forces of Essos such as the Dothraki, Volantenes, Yunkai, Astapor, Mereen, FreeCities, etc, can they actually pull off an invasion of Westeros and establish a new Rule? Without a Heavy Dose of Magic or Dragons involved, I say no. Please, share your thoughts on the matter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Absolutely not.If Stannis, Robb, Tywin, Tarly and Victarion are on the same side they'll smash Essosies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightstar_ Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Well that depends, if all of Essos were to unite, all the free cities, sellsword companies and dothraki, then certainly yes. Seeing as Essos is much larger and much more populous, and if all the free cities would unite, they could build siege weapons along with the sellsword companies to take the castles, and with the huge dothraki hordes at their back they'd be unstoppable in the field. Definitely yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Well that depends, if all of Essos were to unite, all the free cities, sellsword companies and dothraki, then certainly yes. Seeing as Essos is much larger and much more populous, and if all the free cities would unite, they could build siege weapons along with the sellsword companies to take the castles, and with the huge dothraki hordes at their back they'd be unstoppable in the field. Definitely yes.They wouldn't be allowed to land on westerosi soil and even if they land they'll bloodied enough to be taken out by westerosies armies. Stannis, Paxter, Victarion combining their experience at sea battles will smash Essosi fleets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronn Urgandy Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Well that depends, if all of Essos were to unite, all the free cities, sellsword companies and dothraki, then certainly yes. Seeing as Essos is much larger and much more populous, and if all the free cities would unite, they could build siege weapons along with the sellsword companies to take the castles, and with the huge dothraki hordes at their back they'd be unstoppable in the field. Definitely yes. Their numbers could easily be negated, they've got to land, establish a foothold, deploy their troops and then march over an entire continent, Islands are very difficult to conquer, which is why armies that have swept over Europe fall short at a more modern, but more importantly United England. Westeros could defeat their enemies at sea before they even landed, and if that fails, they can meet them on the shore and throw them back into the sea. Not saying it couldn't be done, but I'd rather be on the side of the united defenders, as opposed to the invaders, which in this scenario would be far from united. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Braavos. That is all. What do you mean by that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronn Urgandy Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 What do you mean by that? They have, by their own boasting at least, the finest fleet in the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
House Pintur Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 With 250,000 soldiers 2,000 ships and the right leadership they got a shot. It would not even be worth it, If they won Westeros would be a ruin. The amount of epicness that would happen is unreal to think of. Robb, Tywin, Tarly, Stannis, Barrastan and Jamie all on the same side in a war :drool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightstar_ Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I'm not too sure that Westeros could defeat Essos at sea before they landed like everyone seems to be saying, if all the free cities were to combine, they'd have a VERY large fleet, I think it'd be even bigger than westeros' fleet. Who has ships in Westeros remind me. Of course the Greyjoys, the redwyne's, fleet, the Royal KL fleet, the Stormlands... I'm fairly certain that I'm missing a whole lot of ships for westeros, but still, I'd say Essos in total has the larger fleet.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrax Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Well, if they invented canons and guns, they could. Those aren't magic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightstar_ Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I even forgot about the supposedly finest fleet of Braavos, before Leap reminded me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 By that, I mean that the Free Cities and the Eastern cities are richer by far than Westeros, and Braavos has the means to build a warship every day. With the wealth of the Essos, they could quickly make that two. Even if they didn't, this far exceeds the capabilities of any port in Westeros. But they cannot continue the invasion at massive expenses. I am pretty sure naval experience counts in a naval battle. Westerosies as far as we know are darn good at it. Mix the lot of Naval commanders in Westeros and you get a formidable command. No matter how much ships they keep on piling they'll be smashed by westerosi navy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LuisDantas Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 It takes considerable imagination to even describe a situation that would make such an united Westeros a reality. It goes quite against the grain of human nature. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightstar_ Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 . I am pretty sure naval experience counts in a naval battle. Westerosies as far as we know are darn good at it. Mix the lot of Naval commanders in Westeros and you get a formidable command. How are Westerosi "damn good" at naval warfare? Almost all of their battles are on land, the only ones we know of who are of course darn good at it are the Greyjoys. And they didn't loose their naval battle (Victarion's iron fleet) during their rebellion because Robert and co, were better at it, just because they were outnumbered 10 to 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 How are Westerosi "damn good" at naval warfare? Almost all of their battles are on land, the only ones we know of who are of course darn good at it are the Greyjoys. And they didn't loose their naval battle (Victarion's iron fleet) during their rebellion because Robert and co, were better at it, just because they were outnumbered 10 to 1. Stannis and Paxter Redwyne are also pretty good. Stannis was Master of Ships during Robert's reign and played a pivotal role in Greyjoy Rebellion. Paxter Redwyne is the current of Master of Ships and not to mention he is also the Lord of Arbor. With Greyjoy's included among them they will boast a formidable command. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronn Urgandy Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Westeros could not defeat their armies at sea. Then they'll defeat their armies on land, you have seen the shite that the Free Cities consider soldiers, haven't you? Plus, they've actually got to establish a foothold. Besides, Island's historically are better at sea than their continental counterparts. It takes considerable imagination to even describe a situation that would make such an united Westeros a reality. It goes quite against the grain of human nature. A Westeros united under one King, a Westeros that would team up with people they hate and fight simply because the invaders are foriegn. How are Westerosi "damn good" at naval warfare? Almost all of their battles are on land, the only ones we know of who are of course darn good at it are the Greyjoys. And they didn't loose their naval battle (Victarion's iron fleet) during their rebellion because Robert and co, were better at it, just because they were outnumbered 10 to 1. Pretty sure the numbers aren't stated, and the Ironborn seem to raid wherever they want. Westeros is an ISLAND! Island's historically are better at sea than their continental counterparts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Oh, and the Braavosi have a formidable fleet and fleet building capabilities but no-one with any experience? It's purely dumb logic to say that Westeros has these great leaders whilst Essos, a vastly more populated area, has none. And it's pretty dumb to not read other people's post properly. Look what i stated, " Westerosies as far as we know are darn good at it." I am commenting here on the basis of the information we have here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brightstar_ Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Even if with their supposedly formidable command of naval forces the westerosi could hold off an Essos invasion via sea, I'm pretty sure their fleet would stil be outnumbered to such an extent that the Essosi ( is that a word?) could still mount a second fleet to invade at another point whilst the westerosi fleet is busy with their primary fleet. IMO Essos is just too rich, too big and too populous for westeros to handle, even supposing that their commanders are sooo much smarter than those of Essos, which we honestly will never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Actually, I did read your post but I declined to comment on that because in case you didn't notice, this is a hypothetical thread. I And calling me dumb goes with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stan the Man Baratheon Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 I didn't call you dumb, I said your argument was dumb. There's no need to take it personally. Well you are the one who is making it personal. Even if with their supposedly formidable command of naval forces the westerosi could hold off an Essos invasion via sea, I'm pretty sure their fleet would stil be outnumbered to such an extent that the Essosi ( is that a word?) could still mount a second fleet to invade at another point whilst the westerosi fleet is busy with their primary fleet. IMO Essos is just too rich, too big and too populous for westeros to handle, even supposing that their commanders are sooo much smarter than those of Essos, which we honestly will never know. Well here is the thing about smart commanders, they negate the superior numbers the opposition has to a certain extent. Better commanders know how to operate with less forces and how to inflict most possible damage on the army with superior numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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