Jaxom 1974 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Continue.Not a bad episode. Hourly Sarah sticks around for a while. Likes a flashback that had nothing to do with the island. I'm now predicting Laurel doesn't survive the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Good episode. I really liked Katrina Law. I hope she gets a few more episodes. I liked her in Spartacus and I really like her here. The Laurel stuff is annoying but I think she's justified in her feelings. She wasn't wrong with what she said to Sara though she knows absolutely nothing what Sara went through which would probably make her feel like shit. On the other side, I can't stand the Moira storyline and Oliver getting upset over Malcolm is idiotic. He knows she had an affair with him so not sure why this is such a surprise and automatically changes the relationship. What did he want her to do? Kill the baby? Tell them earlier and destroy everything? Additionally, as others have said, Felicity going to Moira was stupid. It served no real purpose and honestly, it's none of her business. A few other random observations.Laurel is getting really really thin and it's making her look terrible. Her face looks like a triangle at the moment. Caity Lotz on the salmon ladder was pretty badass. She's as ripped as Amell.Katrina Law was supposedly a finalist for Shado but they chose Celina Jade because she'd be sharing scenes with Manu Bennett and they didn't want it to be Spartacus overload.Ollie/Felicity shippers are going to be so mad I'm now predicting Laurel doesn't survive the season. I'd be absolutely shocked. I still think they're setting her up to be Black Canary by end of season. I really hope not though. Even though I'm not a huge fan of Lotz's acting, her physicality fits the role so well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Some really lazy writing and biology fail aside (Sara gets up and stumbles away from her parents to dramatically collapse near Nyssa and Oliver during their fight; there actually is a difference between poison and venom...) that was enjoyable. Apart from the writing for Laurel, that is. What the fuck are they even thinking when it comes to her character? Now she's back in full all-about-me mode, no hint that she's glad her sister is still alive. She forgave Oliver easier than this! I guess the difference is that she wants to sleep with him...How are we supposed to root for this character? Literally everybody else on the show is more sympathetic than her, even the villains. Do the writers simply hate Katie Cassidy? Good episode. I really liked Katrina Law. I hope she gets a few more episodes. I liked her in Spartacus and I really like her here. The Laurel stuff is annoying but I think she's justified in her feelings. She wasn't wrong with what she said to Sara though she knows absolutely nothing what Sara went through which would probably make her feel like shit. But she has some concept of what Sara went through: it was terrible enough to keep her away from home for six years and it involved mystical ninja assassins. And she's processed most of the knock-on effects already with Oliver's return.Now it looks like she's upset her planned out life isn't playing out the way she imagined. I took the "move in together, be engaged for a year, get married" bit in the flashback as a bit of a self-aware joke on her part, but apparently she's deadly serious about this stuff. Too bad she's not on a daytime soap but on a show where most of the deadly serious stuff is literally deadly (like snake venom that kills even when ingested...). On the other side, I can't stand the Moira storyline and Oliver getting upset over Malcolm is idiotic. He knows she had an affair with him so not sure why this is such a surprise and automatically changes the relationship. What did he want her to do? Kill the baby? Tell them earlier and destroy everything? Additionally, as others have said, Felicity going to Moira was stupid. It served no real purpose and honestly, it's none of her business. I guess he's upset because he now has to lie to Thea because "it's not his place" to tell her? Yeah, this is just bad melodrama. I'd be absolutely shocked. I still think they're setting her up to be Black Canary by end of season. I really hope not though. Even though I'm not a huge fan of Lotz's acting, her physicality fits the role so well. Lotz is a really good fit, and it's not like Cassidy is blowing anybody away with her portrayal (of an admittedly terribly written character). I get the impression she's generally very well liked by viewers and critics. Random aside: can we please get some hints that detective Lance knows exactly who the Arrow is? It's just so unbelievable and makes him look bad if he doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Enjoyed the episode. Lots of parts moving in the overall story and pleased they don't feel like everyone needs screen time every episode (no Roy). Didn't realise Nessa was from Spartacus but it makes sense why I was watching with a "where have I seen her before" feeling. I'm guessing it's going to be Malcolm Merlin who brings the league down on the city now as there's no way that's the end of them. Laurel was just being a bitch for the sake of it. She's really turned into a brat who blames all of her problems (most self-inflicted) on everyone else around her, Surely her parents would have walked out the door with Sara after that kind of outburst or at least put her in her place? Moira's storyline still bugs me. Honestly, I'd rather have Blood in charge - so far he doesn't appear to have a "destroy the city" plan and he was correct in his assessment of taking her down. She can't be fragile and in charge. As to those wondering why Ollie is pissed at her, it's because of all the lies. The amount of times she's covered things up (usually to protect herself) finally has Ollie thinking "maybe she was trying to destroy the city/kill his father". I just hope Felicity didn't mention the emotional blackmail Moira dropped on her. Thank god Felicity just told him - could do without that soap drama. Although saying that I can't be the only one who was getting ready to roll their eyes at Felicity walking in on the vigilante-get-together. Random aside: can we please get some hints that detective Lance knows exactly who the Arrow is? It's just so unbelievable and makes him look bad if he doesn't. Definitely. Didn't she even say to him this episode "we met at vigilante school" when he asked how she met Arrow (or was that Nessa he was asking about). Now she's back though and I assume active as Black Canary - I'd suspect a lot of Ollie's social circle should start wondering.I do think they've left enough room for Lance to already know. It's been a long time since he had anything bad to say about Ollie and they can always claim he's trying not to officially know for some kind of deniability as a police officer (tenuous) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jory Cassel Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 This week's episode was alright, but I want to see Slade fighting again. Also, could Olliver not dramatically grab his bow when he's moving out before he has even put on his fight suit? It's really starting to bug me.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JaimeLannister_13 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 It was a pretty decent episode though could have been better. Katrina Law was pretty cool (or Nyssa) especially the first part. Not bad though I am starting to dislike Laurel more and more and I want more of Roy and the continuation of Barry :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Some really lazy writing and biology fail aside (Sara gets up and stumbles away from her parents to dramatically collapse near Nyssa and Oliver during their fight; there actually is a difference between poison and venom...) that was enjoyable. Apart from the writing for Laurel, that is. What the fuck are they even thinking when it comes to her character? Now she's back in full all-about-me mode, no hint that she's glad her sister is still alive. She forgave Oliver easier than this! I guess the difference is that she wants to sleep with him... How are we supposed to root for this character? Literally everybody else on the show is more sympathetic than her, even the villains. Do the writers simply hate Katie Cassidy? But she has some concept of what Sara went through: it was terrible enough to keep her away from home for six years and it involved mystical ninja assassins. And she's processed most of the knock-on effects already with Oliver's return. Now it looks like she's upset her planned out life isn't playing out the way she imagined. I took the "move in together, be engaged for a year, get married" bit in the flashback as a bit of a self-aware joke on her part, but apparently she's deadly serious about this stuff. Too bad she's not on a daytime soap but on a show where most of the deadly serious stuff is literally deadly (like snake venom that kills even when ingested...). Why would she be glad that her sister was alive at that point? She just found out that her sister has been alive for the past 6 years, brought a crazy assassin to town that kidnapped her mother and put her father in danger. At what point would you be perfectly happy to see your sister? I get that she processed her anger with Ollie but she never had the opportunity to process it with her sister. You forgive your ex-boyfriend after months of him being back and a lot of conversations to clear the air, fine. But your sister who was sleeping with your boyfriend that you were going to move in with and was the cause of your mother getting kidnapped and you getting poisoned? Yea, that might need a little more time than one confrontation, especially when it's clear that everyone seemed to know she was alive but Laurel. Add in the fact that she really doesn't have a clue what happened to Sara and I get Laurel being pissed. Knowing that your sister has been alive for 6 years and it has to do with a mystical assassin is one thing but knowing that your sister was left for dead, caught by a crazy scientist and cutthroat pirates, chased around the island by said crazy scientist and almost killed multiple times, forced to deal with a insane soldier with superpowers, then left for dead again only to be found by a insane terrorist assassin group and forced to kill loads of people. Oh yea, and she was in a lesbian relationship with one of the most dangerous man in the world's daughter, who is also fucking dangerous. Yea, Laurel has a real clue on what she's been through... Ultimately, I get Laurel's issue. It sucks that we have to watch it because none of us really want to, but it's not a reaction that's out of character for Laurel. She constantly jumps to conclusions and lashes out before understanding what's going on. This isn't new. It's poor writing to an extent but it's consistent writing at least. Random aside: can we please get some hints that detective Lance knows exactly who the Arrow is? It's just so unbelievable and makes him look bad if he doesn't. I'm just assuming he knows but given this is based on a comic book, a mask and hood = full facial transformation. It doesn't really matter to me whether he says he knows or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxom 1974 Posted February 6, 2014 Author Share Posted February 6, 2014 Why would she be glad that her sister was alive at that point? She just found out that her sister has been alive for the past 6 years, brought a crazy assassin to town that kidnapped her mother and put her father in danger. At what point would you be perfectly happy to see your sister? I get that she processed her anger with Ollie but she never had the opportunity to process it with her sister. You forgive your ex-boyfriend after months of him being back and a lot of conversations to clear the air, fine. But your sister who was sleeping with your boyfriend that you were going to move in with and was the cause of your mother getting kidnapped and you getting poisoned? Yea, that might need a little more time than one confrontation, especially when it's clear that everyone seemed to know she was alive but Laurel. Add in the fact that she really doesn't have a clue what happened to Sara and I get Laurel being pissed. Knowing that your sister has been alive for 6 years and it has to do with a mystical assassin is one thing but knowing that your sister was left for dead, caught by a crazy scientist and cutthroat pirates, chased around the island by said crazy scientist and almost killed multiple times, forced to deal with a insane soldier with superpowers, then left for dead again only to be found by a insane terrorist assassin group and forced to kill loads of people. Oh yea, and she was in a lesbian relationship with one of the most dangerous man in the world's daughter, who is also fucking dangerous. Yea, Laurel has a real clue on what she's been through... Ultimately, I get Laurel's issue. It sucks that we have to watch it because none of us really want to, but it's not a reaction that's out of character for Laurel. She constantly jumps to conclusions and lashes out before understanding what's going on. This isn't new. It's poor writing to an extent but it's consistent writing at least. I had a slightly different take on the whole thing. (Oh I agree in principal with everything that was just said.) It goes to why I used "marginalized". Yes it turned out she was poisoned and wasn't an overdose that put her in the hospital, but it did bring her mother back. And what happened? Going through the experience and her long lost sister is returned and her parents rush to her. They're hugging her. They're gushing over her. It makes sense in a lot of respects, but then when they're all back in Laurel's apartment, her parents still essentially fawning, Laurel walks up to the table, grabs the wine, chugs one glass, pours another, and not a word is said other than, "being angry is okay, but you gotta forgive her!". That was a long winded way of trying to say it wasn't just about any residual anger of Sarah leaving with Oliver, but also the fact that it is the realization she doesn't hold the primary spot in her parents affections. (Something that seemed to be evident to me through the flashback interaction with her parents also.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red snow Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 It was definitely her timing that sucked. I think if they had been alone it would have been more acceptable. Also the fact she glugs back a couple glasses of wine before being pissy did not help. They should use Mexal's synopsis of Sarah lance as the voice-over intro for a Black Canary Spin-off :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 It was definitely her timing that sucked. I think if they had been alone it would have been more acceptable. Also the fact she glugs back a couple glasses of wine before being pissy did not help. Oh I agree. Timing was definitely a huge part of her reaction. If Sara came to Laurel the first time she was in Starling City to make her presence known, Laurel's reaction might have been a lot different. I also agree with your marginalized comments above and I think that adds to her reaction. Wanting Sara back is fine when Sara is dead but when the reality is she's alive, a badass, a cause of family members, including yourself, getting hurt and still in the forefront of her parents eyes, I get the reaction. I don't want to watch it because I don't give a shit about Laurel, but it's fairly consistent with Laurel's reactions all throughout the show. Her life totally sucks and I'm really tired of the constant downward spiral. I wish they'd just kill her and her triangle face off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxom 1974 Posted February 6, 2014 Author Share Posted February 6, 2014 I think you'll get your wish by the end of the season, Mex... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I think you'll get your wish by the end of the season, Mex... I already told you what I thought about that. Still, after reading an interview with one of the producers, they have a very clear story in mind for Sara that they developed in the break between season 1 and 2. They aren't making it up as they go which is good but could potentially be bad if they decided prior to this season that Sara should meet a spectacular end. I, personally, think Slade will kill Sara because Ollie chose her over Shado. To kill off Laurel, they'll have to do some serious salvaging with her character. Not sure how they'll do that but have to believe it has something to do with Blood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Oh I agree. Timing was definitely a huge part of her reaction. If Sara came to Laurel the first time she was in Starling City to make her presence known, Laurel's reaction might have been a lot different. I also agree with your marginalized comments above and I think that adds to her reaction. Wanting Sara back is fine when Sara is dead but when the reality is she's alive, a badass, a cause of family members, including yourself, getting hurt and still in the forefront of her parents eyes, I get the reaction. I don't want to watch it because I don't give a shit about Laurel, but it's fairly consistent with Laurel's reactions all throughout the show. Her life totally sucks and I'm really tired of the constant downward spiral. I wish they'd just kill her and her triangle face off. The problem isn't so much that one can't justify Laurel's reaction, but that it makes her even more unlikeable. Her parents, just as much victims of the events resulting from Sara's supposed death (and her mother even more so, having just been kidnapped), are happy to have Sara back. Laurel's reaction is the polar opposite, not a shred of sympathy or gladness, just vicious attacks, including throwing a glass after her. Sara's murderous ninja ex-girlfriend showed more empathy when she saw her reunited with her family. Why would the writers decide to write Laurel this way? We as viewers have been given absolutely no reason to root for Laurel. Pity her? Sure, but that's not exactly the emotional resonance you want to go for on an action show about superheroes. Literally every other major character on the show has displayed more admirable qualities than her. It's important to keep these presentation issues in mind when writing. Laurel's actions in this episode are most immediately contrasted with Sara's here, and while Laurel is whining and throwing hissy fits, Sara is willing to die to protect her family. And every episode they spend making Laurel look bad means more work if they truly want to follow through with the idea of turning her into a heroic character. I simply have no idea what the hell they are thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Human Abstract Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I give the episode a meh+. Laurel is an infuriating presence to me right now and they do need to do something interesting with her. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sci-2 Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 And every episode they spend making Laurel look bad means more work if they truly want to follow through with the idea of turning her into a heroic character. I simply have no idea what the hell they are thinking. Sara's death is the catalyst for Laurel's big change? Though she'll also be vindicated by Blood revealing himself as evil. We know she ends up being Black Canary eventually, barring the showrunner totally surprising us with her death. In a weird feeling of real life sympathy, at least training to be Black Canary would demand Cassidy put on more weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
White Walker Texas Ranger Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I stopped watching the show around when Slade Wilson was introduced. It wasn't because I didn't like it, just I haven't been watching nearly as much TV. Is the show worth picking up again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MisterOJ Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I stopped watching the show around when Slade Wilson was introduced. It wasn't because I didn't like it, just I haven't been watching nearly as much TV. Is the show worth picking up again? Yes. IMO, it's one of the two or three best shows on network TV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 I stopped watching the show around when Slade Wilson was introduced. It wasn't because I didn't like it, just I haven't been watching nearly as much TV. Is the show worth picking up again? Good god yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon AS Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 In a weird feeling of real life sympathy, at least training to be Black Canary would demand Cassidy put on more weight. Pfh, that's what stuntpeople are there for.;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mexal Posted February 6, 2014 Share Posted February 6, 2014 Pfh, that's what stuntpeople are there for. ;) That's why Caity Lotz is so awesome. She has legitimate training in martial arts and parkour. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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