Did Theon Greyjoy betray House Stark?

[Lee-Sensei]

That's not what I said he said though.

I agree he never swore to serve house Stark.

He did agree to fight beside Robb like a brother, and he did promise to bring his father's fleet. The first he did do for quite a while. The second he did not do, but broke his word and took Robb's home from him instead.

No. I can't remember him ever doing that.

Yeah the cat part, but it is stated from the first chapter ever in agot that Bran hated Theon, it's around the beheading of the deserter, and Jon kida agrees there, and then later, at least in ADWD and ASOS that Jon thinks to himself, he never liked Theon, and whatnot, sorry have no quotes at hand. And Cat certainly was quite open about it with her lovely looks towards him and how she constantly tells not to trust him. He was after all their hostage, not their guest. And he was constantly reminded of that. You could even call it a slave. He had to work for the, He had to stay with them was not allowed to leave, he did not get paid by them and had practically no rights. I would say Robb was the only one who cared about him as a human being, perhaps Jon with some sympathy(but he would never admit it to himself) but that's it.

I don't know where you're getting this. The Starks (aside from Robb), didn't like or trust Theon, but he wasn't hated. I'd even say that they were right to not trust Theon, just like Theon was right to go with his family against the Starks.

Well they obviously did give him some money because he was easily able to buy himself whores and fancy clothes for his visit to Pyke.

I think you are exaggerating. Not liking is not the same thing as hating. Bran's attitude is understandable considering he was much younger and Theon went around with a smirk and attitude of superiority over the younger kids. He as not a particularly likable person. Jon didn't like him because of his personality, not because he was a hostage. Cat seemed mostly indifferent, but she has memories of the rebellion and did not grow up with him. That is not hate. It is just not "like".

I don't remember Theon sleeping with whores and does the money come from the Starks or the Greyjoys?

[Hippocras]

1. No. I can't remember him ever doing that.

2. I don't remember Theon sleeping with whores and does the money come from the Starks or the Greyjoys?

1. Well it is there. Find the chapter before he leaves for Pyke. It will be a Catelyn POV, since Theon's first POV was his time on the boat and arrival in the Iron Islands. The discussion of Robb calling his banners, with Theon on side was a Catelyn POV. Same for the King of the North.

2. The TV character Ros was based on a minor moment in the books where Theon thinks about or mentions a red-headed whore he liked in Winterfell. Her role was clearly expanded and sexed up for the TV show, but she is based on a character in the books. I could not tell you where it is, though because it either was mentioned in a flashback or was mentioned in someone else's POV.

[Metopheles]

Well, okay no hate,

but what's that for a life, living surrounded by people who do not trust you by default, even if you never did anything to make them untrustworthy up to this moment,

being constantly mocked and smiled upon as being hostage..

Oh yeah, he totally should thank the Starks and hope for their forgiveness.

I would totally stab them in the back. Not Robb perhaps, because he was your friend despite all telling him more or less not to be, but the others, I would have no scruples about that.

[Lee-Sensei]

1. Well it is there. Find the chapter before he leaves for Pyke. It will be a Catelyn POV, since Theon's first POV was his time on the boat and arrival in the Iron Islands. The discussion of Robb calling his banners, with Theon on side was a Catelyn POV. Same for the King of the North.

2. The TV character Ros was based on a minor moment in the books where Theon thinks about or mentions a red-headed whore he liked in Winterfell. Her role was clearly expanded and sexed up for the TV show, but she is based on a character in the books. I could not tell you where it is, though because it either was mentioned in a flashback or was mentioned in someone else's POV.

1. No. It really isn't there. I've read those chapters.

2. She is based on a red haired whore, but not one Theon was with. In fact, Theon doesn't seem to like whores in the books. Saying that he'd have to beat Wex if he caught him with one of the whores in Pyke and referring to camp followers as "filthy maggots".

[Hippocras]

1. No. It really isn't there. I've read those chapters.

2. She is based on a red haired whore, but not one Theon was with. In fact, Theon doesn't seem to like whores in the books. Saying that he'd have to beat Wex if he caught him with one of the whores in Pyke and referring to camp followers as "filthy maggots".

1. He was there. He encouraged Robb to go to war. He said he would fight with him. He convinced Robb to send him to Pyke to get his father's fleet. This was not Robb's idea, it was Theon's. Clearly you have not read very carefully.

2.Prove that. You demand quotes from me but provide none of your own. As for calling them filthy maggots - first of all, the vast majority of people who use whores do not respect them. That is the general horrid sad thing about prostitution. Second, he said that after returning to Pyke and being reminded of Iron Islands "Iron Price" values.

[Lee-Sensei]

1. He was there. He encouraged Robb to go to war. He said he would fight with him. He convinced Robb to send him to Pyke to get his father's fleet. This was not Robb's idea, it was Theon's. Clearly you have not read very carefully.

2.Prove that. You demand quotes from me but provide none of your own. As for calling them filthy maggots - first of all, the vast majority of people who use whores do not respect them. That is the general horrid sad thing about prostitution. Second, he said that after returning to Pyke and being reminded of Iron Islands "Iron Price" values.

1) No. I've read it very carefully. In fact, we don't even see Robb and Theon's conversation about him going to Pyke. You're getting the show and the book mixed up.

2) He had told Wex to wait at the inn. The common room was so crowded that Theon had to push his way through the door. Not a seat was to be had at bench nor table. Nor did he see his squire. “Wex,” he shouted over the din and clatter. If he’s up with one of those poxy whores, I’ll strip the hide off him , he was thinking when he finally spied the boy, dicing near the hearth . . . and winning too, by the look of the pile of coins before him.

Even here in this half-frozen lichyard of a castle, surrounded by snow and ice and death, there were women. Washerwoman. That was the polite way of saying camp follower, which was the polite way of saying whore.

Where they came from Theon could not say. They just seemed to appear, like maggots on a corpse or ravens after a battle. Every army drew them. Some where hardened whores who could fuck twenty men in a night and drink them all blind. Others looked as innocent as maids, but that was just a trick of their trade. Some where camp brides, bound to soldiers they followed with words whispered to one god or another but doomed to be forgotten once the war was done. They would warm a man’s bed by night, patch holes in his boots at morning, cook his supper come dusk, and loot his corpse after the battle. Some even did a bit of washing. With them, oft as not, came bastard children, wretched, filthy creatures born in one camp or the other.

[Hippocras]

Look, why did Theon go to Pyke? Can we agree on that much?

I think we agree he went to Pyke to get his father to fight for Robb.

He went there with Robb's consent, on a mission he was happy to do. Robb gave him his consent because he promised something in return: to bring his father's support. He was proud of fighting for Robb.

I am DEFINITELY not wrong that Theon was with Robb in Winterfell, encouraging him to fight and promising to fight with him. It was not a vow, and I never said it was. But it was a promise and he broke it.

What you need to prove is the part where you claimed the red-headed whore was someone else's thing, and Theon was never with whores.

Not liking the particular whores in particular places is not the same thing as being against ever going to a whore.

Find the part about the red-headed whore. Prove that Theon had no part of that.

[Lee-Sensei]

Look, why did Theon go to Pyke? Can we agree on that much?

I think we agree he went to Pyke to get his father to fight for Robb.

He went there with Robb's consent, on a mission he was happy to do. Robb gave him his consent because he promised something in return: to bring his father's support. He was proud of fighting for Robb.

I am DEFINITELY not wrong that Theon was with Robb in Winterfell, encouraging him to fight and promising to fight with him. It was not a vow, and I never said it was. But it was a promise and he broke it.

What you need to prove is the part where you claimed the red-headed whore was someone else's thing, and Theon was never with whores.

Not liking the particular whores in particular places is not the same thing as being against ever going to a whore.

Find the part about the red-headed whore. Prove that Theon had no part of that.

Correction. He went to Pyke to get his father to form an alliance with Robb. Fight for suggests subordination.

Did he promise? Do you have a quote. He went there to propose an alliance and he expected Balon to agree, but there's no proof that he promised Robb Balon would agree.

No. He never broke any promises. He did fight for Robb.

That's something you need to prove. You made the claim. The burden of proof is on you. Theon mentions or is seen with several women. The Captain's daughter, two millers wifes, Kyra and the Brewers wife, but no whores. He also expresses a disliking of whores on more then one occasion.

[Hippocras]

Robb would never have sent him to Pyke at all without his assurances that he would bring his father's help. It was therefore a betrayal.

As for the whore - it was you who claimed he was never with one. So I disagree. If you are going to play the game of demanding quotes, you had better be prepared on your end.

[Lee-Sensei]

Robb would never have sent him to Pyke at all without his assurances that he would bring his father's help. It was therefore a betrayal.

As for the whore - it was you who claimed he was never with one. So I disagree. If you are going to play the game of demanding quotes, you had better be prepared on your end.

Yes he would. Robb was a great military commander, but a poor politician. Theon was his best friend and he never considered the fact that Balon might still be holding a grudge for his defeat in the last Rebellion.

No. You claimed that Theon remembered a red headed whore he was with. You made the claim. You need to back it up.

[Hippocras]

Yes he would. Robb was a great military commander, but a poor politician. Theon was his best friend and he never considered the fact that Balon might still be holding a grudge for the failure of his last Rebellion.

No. You claimed that Theon remembered a red headed whore he was with. You made the claim. You need to back it up.

You started the back and forth about proving it earlier in the thread with an unnecessarily snide comment that I could not find a quote because it was not there. If you want to play that game, go ahead. I am not playing.

[Lee-Sensei]

You started the back and forth about proving it earlier in the thread with an unnecessarily snide comment that I could not find a quote because it was not there. If you want to play that game, go ahead. I am not playing.

You made a mistake. It's not in the books. It was in the show.

I'm not playing a game. You can't find the quote, because it doesn't exist. If you can find it, I'll readily admit that I was wrong. If you can find it.

[Hippocras]

You made a mistake. It's not in the books. It was in the show.

I'm not playing a game. You can't find the quote, because it doesn't exist. If you can find it, I'll readily admit that I was wrong. If you can find it.

You are playing a game: You are demanding quotes while unwilling to provide any yourself. If you don't want to provide any fine, but don't demand them from others.

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

You are playing a game: You are demanding quotes while unwilling to provide any yourself. If you don't want to provide any fine, but don't demand them from others.

Lee-Senei is correct, there is no evidence that Theon vowed. And you can't prove a negative. So, it's a little different from claiming Theon did make a vow, which can be proven with text.

Could Theon have made a vow? Maybe, but there is no evidence of it. Could Theon be romantic pen pals with Khal Drogo? Maybe, but there is no evidence of it.

But, I find the whole argument ridiculous anyway. Theon was a prisoner. Any vow he made would be under duress. He didn't betray the Starks.

Now, he may have commited treason by fighting for the Iron Isles' independence movement. No matter who the monarch is, he is commiting treason against the Iron Throne. But his crime is no worse than Asha's crimes and Stannis let her off. Stannis is executing Theon purely to please the North.

Theon is probably a kinslayer, though. And the gods have severely punished him for that.

[Skagosi High Chef]

He was in a tough and conflicting position. However, he felt like he betrayed them, so if he felt that way then he did. Had he felt no guilt and justified in what he did, then you can argue he did not. He also disobeyed his father's orders which is both treason and betrayal. He had a habit of doing what he wanted regardless of allegiance. He paid a high price for his actions, guilt the least of all.

[Daeron's Black Boots]

" It is flame the Drowned God brought from the sea and it proclaims a rising tide. It is time to hoist our sails and go forth into the world with fire and sword, as he did." COK Theon 11

" For a thousand thousand years sea and sky had been at war. From the sea had come the iron born..." AFFC Prophet 1

" Tell me true, nephew. Do you pray to the wolf god's now? Theon seldom prayed at all, but that was not something you confessed to a priest, even your father's own brother. Ned Stark prayed to a tree. No, I care nothing for Stark's gods." COK Theon 11

" Or do you want me dead? Is that it Luwin? the truth now. The small grey man was unafraid. My order serves. Yes but whom, The realm, Maester Luwin said, and Winterfell. So long as you hold Winterfell I am bound to give you counsel." COK Theon 66

" I took this castle and I mean to hold it, to live or die as Prince of Winterfell." COK Theon 66

" I am a Greyjoy of Pyke, Theon reminded him. The cloak my father swaddled me in bore a Kraken, not a Direwolf." COK Theon 66

" Robb will never look on Winterfell again, Theon promised. He will break himself on Moat Cailin, as every southern army has done for ten thousand years." COK Theon 66

" Reek stepped close. Strip off their skins, he urged his thick lips glistening. Lord Bolton, he used to say a naked man has few secrets, but a flayed man's go none. The Flayed man was the sigil of House Bolton, Theon knew; ages past, certain of their lords had gone so far as to cloak themselves in the skins of dead enemies. A number of Starks had ended thus. Supposedly all that had stopped a thousand years, ago when the Boltons had bent their knees to winterfell. Or say they say, but old ways die hard, as well I know." COK 50

" The Sky was a gloom of cloud, the woods dead and frozen. Roots grabbed at Theon's feet as he ran, and bare branches lashed his face, leaving thin stripes of blood across his cheeks. He crashed through heedless, breathless, icicles flying to pieces before him. Mercy,he sobbed. From behind him came a shuddering howl that curdled his blood. Mercy, Mercy. When he glanced back over his shoulder he saw them coming, great wolves the size of horses with the heads of small children. Oh, mercy, mercy. Blood dripped from their mouths black as pitch, burning holes in the snow where it fell. Every stride brought them closer. Theon tried to run faster, but his legs would not obey. The trees all had faces, and they were laughing at him, laughing and then the howl came again. He could smell the hot breath of the beasts behind him..." COK Theon 56

" The night before, it had been the miller's wife. Theon had forgotten her name, but he remembered her body, soft pillowy breasts and stretch marks on her belly, the way she clawed his back when he fucked her. Last night in his dream he had been in bed with her once again but this time she had teeth above and below, and she tore out his throat even as she was gnawing off his manhood. It was madness..." COK Theon 56

" Only Maester Luwin had the stomach to come near. Stone-faced, the small grey man had begged leave to se the boy's heads back on to their shoulders, so they might be laid in the crypts below with the other Stark dead. No, theon had told him. Not the crypts. But why my lord? Surely they cannot harm you now. It is where they belong. All the bones of the Starks..." COK Theon 56

" I said no, He needed the heads on the wall, but he burned the headless bodies that very day, in all their finery. Afterward he had knelt amongst the bones and ashes to retrieve a slag of melted silver and cracked jet, all that remained of the wolf's head brooch that had once been Bran's. He had it still..." COK Theon 56

" You'd like that wouldn't you? To see my prize reduced to ruins and ashes. Your prize will be the doom of you. Krakens rise from the sea, Theon, or did you forget that during you years among the wolves?" COK Theon 56

" No, Theon adjusted his crown. I took this castle and I mean to hold it. his sister looked at him a long time. The hold it you shall, she said, for the rest of your life. She sighed, It tastes of folly but what would a shy maid know of such things. At the door she gave him one last mocking smile. You ought to know that is the ugliest crown I've ever laid eyes on. Did you make it yourself?"COK Theon 56

" But there were others with face's he had never known in life, faces he had only seen in stone. The slim, sad girl who wore a crown of pale blue roses and a white gown spattered with gore could only be Lyanna. Her brother Brandon stood beside her, and their father Lord Rickard just behind. Along the walls figures half seen moved through the shadows, pale shades with long grim faces. The sight of them sent fear shivering through Theon as sharp as a knife. And then the tall doors open with a crash, and a freezing gale blew down the hall, and Robb came walking out of the night. Grey Wind stalked beside, eyes burning, and man and wolf alike bled from a hundred savage wounds." COK Theon 56

"The red leaves of the weirwood were a blaze of flame among the green. Ned Stark's tree, he thought, and Stark's wood, and Stark's castle, Stark's sword, Stark's gods. This is their place, not mine. I am a Greyjoy of Pyke, born to paint a kraken on my shield and sail the great salt sea." COK Theon 56

" Maester Luwin said there was nothing in dreams a mad need fear. There is. What? The past, the future and the truth." COK Bran 50

" I'm Prince Theon now. We're both princes, Bran. Who would have dreamed it? But I've taken your castle, my prince. Winterfell? bran shook his head. No you couldn't. You and I are going to speak to them. You'll tell them how you've yielded Winterfell to me, and command them to serve and obey their new lord as they did the old." COK Bran 50

" You must look princely. Theon wants me to yield the castle, Bran said as the maester was fastening the cloak with his favorite wolf's head clasp of silver and jet. There is no shame in that. A lord must protect his smallfolk. Cruel places breed cruel peoples, remember that you deal with these ironmen. Your lord father did what he could to gentle Theon, but I fear it as too little and too late." COK Bran

" Theon Greyjoy was seated in the high seat of the Starks. He had taken off his cloak. Over a shirt of fine mail he wore a black surcoat emblazoned with the golden, Kraken of his House. His hands rested on the wolves' heads carved at the ends of the wide stone arms. Theon's sitting in Robb's chair, Rickon said." COK Bran

" I've yielded Winterfell to Theon. Louder Bran, and call me prince. He raised his voice. I've yielded Winterfell to Prince Theon. All of you should do as he commands you." COK Bran

" My father has donned the ancient crown of salt and rock, and declared himself King of the Iron Islands. He claims the north as well, by right of conquest. You are all his subjects.' COK Theon

" One of the ironmen handed Reek a sword, and he laid it at Theon's feet and swore obedience to House Greyjoy and King Balon. Bran could not look. The green dream had come true." COK Theon

" The ironmen will tell you what is dead may never die, but rises again, harder and stronger. Like Reek. He smells of the grave, though, I grant you that." ADWD Reek

"As he climbed a wide flight of wooden steps to the hall, Reek's legs began to shake. He had to stop to steady them, staring up at the grassy slopes of the Great Barrow. Some claimed it was the grave of the First King, who had led men First Men to Westeros. Others argued that it must be some King of Giants who was buried there, to account for its size." ADWD Reek

" Unless the gods were good, and Stannis descended on Winterfell and put all them to the sword, himself included. That was the best he could hope for." ADWD Reek

" The bride was garbed in white and grey, the colors the true Arya would have worn had she lived long enough to wed. Theon wore black and gold, his cloak pinned to his shoulder by a crude iron kraken that a smith in Barrowtown had hammered together for him. A Stark at last, he thought. Arm in arm, the bride and he passed through an arched stone door, as wisps of fog stirred round their legs. The drum was tremulous as a maiden's heart, the pipes high and sweet and beckoning. Up above the treetops, a crescent moon was floating in a dark sky half obscrued by mist, like an eye peering through a veil of silk." ADWD The Prince of Winterfell

" Theon Greyjoy was no stranger to this godswood. He had played here as a boy, skipping stones across the cold black pool beneath the weirwood, hiding his treasures in the bole of an ancient oak, stalking squirrels with a bow he made himself. Later, older, he had soaked his bruises in the hot springs after many a session in the yard with Robb and Jory and Jon Snow. In amongst these chestnuts and elms and soldier pines he had found secret places where he could hide he wanted to be alone. The first time he had ever kissed a girl had been here. Later, a different girl had made a man of him upon a ragged quilt in the shade of that tall grey-green sentinel. He had never seen the godswood like this, though grey and ghostly filled with warm mists and floating lights and whispered voices that seemed to come from everywhere and nowhere." ADWD The Prince of Winterfell

" Theon stepped back, and Ramsay and his bride joined hands and knelt before the heart tree, bowing their heads in token of submission. The weirwood's carved red eyes stared down at them, its great red mouth open as if to laugh. In the branches overhead a raven quorked." ADWD The Prince of Winterfell

" The musicians began to play again, and the bard Abel began to sing " Two hearts That Beat as One. Two of his women joined their voices to his own to make a sweet harmony. Theon found himself wondering if he should say a prayer. Will the old gods hear me if i do? They were not his gods, had never been his gods. He was ironborn, a son of Pyke, his god was the Drowned God of the islands... but Winterfell was long leagues from the sea. It had been a lifetime since any god had heard him. He did not know who he was, or what he was, why he was alive, why he had ever been born. Theon, a voice seemed to whisper." ADWD The Prince of Winterfell

" You could pay me with a smile. I've never seen you smile, not even during your sister's wedding feast. If you have no smile for me, tell me how you captured Winterfell. Abel will put you in a song and you will live forever. As a betrayer. As Theon Turncloak... Why not Theon the Clever? It was a daring feat, the way we heard it." ADWD The Turncloak

" Im crying because we never found the Horn of Winter. We opened half a hundrend graves and let all those shades loose in the world, and never found the Horn of Joramun to bring this cold thing down!" SOS Jon

" He is not what i expected. What did you bastard do to him? Removed some skin, i would imagine, and a few small parts. Nothing to essential. Is he mad? He may be. Does it matter? " ADWD Reek

" You know this castle? Once. Somewhere beneath us are the crypts where the old Stark Kings sit in darkness. My men have not been able to find the way down into them. The have been through all the undercrofts and cellars, even the dungeons, but.... The crypts can't be accessed from the dungeons my lady. Can you show me the way down? There's nothing down there but.. dead Starks? aye and all my favorite starks are dead, as it happens. Do you know the way or not? I do. He did not like the crypts, had never liked the crypts, but he was no stranger to them." ADWD The Turncloak

" Streaks of rust remained where a longsword should have been. The sight disquieted him. He had always heard that the iron in the sword kept the spirits of the dead locked within their tombs." ADWD The Turncloak

" I'm crying because we never found the Horn of Winter. We opened half a hundred graves and let all those shades loose in the world, and never found the Horn of Joramun to bring this cold thing down!" SOS Jon

" Whenever Sam thought of the cache Jon buried beneath the Fist it made same want to cry. an old broken horn..." SOS Samwell

" Holly the whore. Once he might have laughed and pulled her onto his lap. What do you want? To see the crypts..." ADWD Ghost in Winterfell

" under the ruined keep, my lord replied big walder. The one with the old gargoyles. The boys gloves were caked with his cousins blood. I told him not to go alone, but said he had to find a man who owed him silver." ADWD Theon

" Mance never found the horn though, that's something. The Horn of Winter, that's what he was digging up along the Milkwater. Maester Aemon paused washcloth in hand. The Horn of Winter is an ancient legend. Does the King-beyond-the-Wall truly believe that such a thing exists? They all do. Ygritte said they opended a hundred graves of king and heroes..." SOS

" Get her up Turncloak. And if she screams, said Rowan. We are all dead, Theon thought. I told them this was folly, but none of them would listen. Abel had doomed them. All singers were half mad. In songs, the hero always saved the maiden from the monster's castle, but life was not a song, no more than Jeyne was Arya Stark. And there are no heroes here, only whores. Even so, he knelt beside her, pulled down the furs, touched her cheek. You know me. I'm Theon, you remember. I know you too. I know your name. Come with us. With me. We will take you away from here. Away from him. Theon slipped his hand through hers. The stumps of his lost fingers tingled as he drew the girl to her feet." ADWD Theon

"Then do the deed yourself, Your Grace. The chill in Asha's voice made Theon shiver in his chains. "Take him out across the lake to the islet where the weirwood grows, and strike his head off with that sorcerous sword you bear. That is how Eddard Stark would have done it. Theon slew Lord Eddard's sons. Give him to Lord Eddard's gods. The old gods of the north. Give him to the tree. And suddenly there came a wild thumping, as the maester's ravens hopped and flapped inside their cages, their black feathers flying as they beat against the bars with loud and raucous caws. "The tree," one squawked, "the tree, the tree," whilst the second screamed only, "Theon, Theon, Theon.Theon Greyjoy smiled. They know my name, he thought." Winds of Winter

" In those days, the iron born did not work mines that was a labor for the captives brought back from the hostings, and so too the sorry business of farming and tending goats and sheep. War was an iron man's proper trade. The Drowned God had made them to reave and rape, carve out kingdoms and write their names in fire and blood and song." COK Theon 11

" They say the red comet is a herald of a new age. A messenger from the gods. A sign it is, the priest agreed, but from our god not theirs. A burning brand it is, such as our people carried of old." COK Theon 11

to answer the OP.

No Theon Greyjoy did not betray house stark. Technically he is still Lord of Winterfell per bran's orders. All he wants is to become a Stark. if the first chapter of Winds of Winter is any hint Stannis is about to find out Theon Turncloak is a true son of Winterfell.

[Metopheles]

Lee-Senei is correct, there is no evidence that Theon vowed. And you can't prove a negative. So, it's a little different from claiming Theon did make a vow, which can be proven with text.

Could Theon have made a vow? Maybe, but there is no evidence of it. Could Theon be romantic pen pals with Khal Drogo? Maybe, but there is no evidence of it.

But, I find the whole argument ridiculous anyway. Theon was a prisoner. Any vow he made would be under duress. He didn't betray the Starks.

Now, he may have commited treason by fighting for the Iron Isles' independence movement. No matter who the monarch is, he is commiting treason against the Iron Throne. But his crime is no worse than Asha's crimes and Stannis let her off. Stannis is executing Theon purely to please the North.

Theon is probably a kinslayer, though. And the gods have severely punished him for that.

Agree with nearly all

But who did he kill to make him a kinslayer ?

And the gods do not exist, only Ramsay. And he didn't punish him, he plays with him. It's like saying Cersei had to walk because of killing people and all her evil, but it was only for fucking Lancel and Osmund.

[Metopheles]

No Theon Greyjoy did not betray house stark. Technically he is still Lord of Winterfell per bran's orders. All he wants is to become a Stark. if the first chapter of Winds of Winter is any hint Stannis is about to find out Theon Turncloak is a true son of Winterfell.

How so ?

[Daeron's Black Boots]

How so ?

so eddard stark has 5 children a bastard and a ward. ( he raised 7 children ) might be imporant to the numerology aspect of GRRM.

i think his ward can technically be counted as his " son " because he was raised by wolves and follows the old gods and not the drowned god.

i hope in the winds of winter bran sends a message to he people that Prince Theon is still Lord of Winterfell...

maybe a certain " wolfpack " shows up out of the neck and surrounds him just as his head is about to come off...

[Daeron's Black Boots]

Agree with nearly all

But who did he kill to make him a kinslayer ?

And the gods do not exist, only Ramsay. And he didn't punish him, he plays with him. It's like saying Cersei had to walk because of killing people and all her evil, but it was only for fucking Lancel and Osmund.

its possible his son was one of the two he and ramsay killed to pass off as Bran and Rickon...