Casting Outrage Hypocrasy

[Obebb]

Pedro is perfect. End of story.

[Hangover of the Morning]

I too find the "political correctness" hypocritical, racist, idiotic and contra-productive. It is one thing to be deliberately portraying certain group of people in a negative light on the news in order to sway peoples opinion for political gain or something but this is fiction. Nobody should be drawing their morals from that. I hate this: "We can't have a strong female character to do an immoral act because she is an inspiration for teenage girls".

BBC is especially ridiculous in that sense. In order to fulfil their quota we had black Guinevere, Porthos and so on. If Downton Abbey wasn't on ITV but BBC, Matthew Crawley would probably be Asian :-)

I remember few months ago catching a promotional trailer for new upcoming shows on BBC. Next day I read an article in the newspaper where some journalist was outraged by the lack of female characters portrayed in said trailer. I distinctly remembered women being in it and just couldn't understand. Who does that? Who actually sits in front of the TV and counts the number of women, black, white, Asian people etc?

[Queen Sansa Stark]

BBC is especially ridiculous in that sense. In order to fulfil their quota we had black Guinevere, Porthos and so on. If Downton Abbey wasn't on ITV but BBC, Matthew Crawley would probably be Asian :-)

Yes how dare they try break the status quo when it comes to casting -_-

[OrangeStallion]

Except it is kind of obvious that the Dornish people aren't white. For one they eat Pita and hummus which both of things come from the middle-east. Plus it said they have olive skin, brown eyes and black hair. You could easily cast them as brown people. In fact a lot of people envisioned them as South-asian.

Well if we're going to talk about race in a biological sense, middle-eastern and indian. people are identical to European people. There are biologically different races of people, none inferior to any other, but I guess you're talking ethnicity.

Pedro is a great choice.

[Queen Sansa Stark]

Well if we're going to talk about race in a biological sense, middle-eastern and indian. people are identical to European people. There are biologically different races of people, none inferior to any other, but I guess you're talking ethnicity.

Pedro is a great choice.

Say what? Middle-eastern and South-asian people look completely different from European people since they have significant darker skin color. Pedro is a terrible casting. He is a white latino man. Completely unsuitable.

[Valor_Rorghulis]

He looks dark enough to me. I'd imagined salty dornish as a spanish/arab looking type, certainly not south asian.

My only real complaint about pascal would be I expected someone about 5-10 years older. Pedro doesn't look like he has a 25 year old daughter.

doesn't matter much, if he can portray the character that's all that counts!

[AdelinaZ]

Plus it said they have olive skin, brown eyes and black hair. You could easily cast them as brown people. In fact a lot of people envisioned them as South-asian.

I've always pictured them as Mediterranean, even before reading what GRRM said.

[Ser Tahu]

Say what? Middle-eastern and South-asian people look completely different from European people since they have significant darker skin color. Pedro is a terrible casting. He is a white latino man. Completely unsuitable.

I know! How dare they give an olive-skinned role to a guy with olive skin! Completely unsuitable...

[Queen Sansa Stark]

He looks dark enough to me. I'd imagined salty dornish as a spanish/arab looking type, certainly not south asian.

My only real complaint about pascal would be I expected someone about 5-10 years older. Pedro doesn't look like he has a 25 year old daughter.

doesn't matter much, if he can portray the character that's all that counts!

Really? I have an hypothetical question for you. If Ned Stark was casted as an East-Asian man would you only care about his "acting abilities"?

[myhousigilisthehousecat]

Isn't counting the number of people of different races in the show racist in itself? I loved the casting decision, I could see your guy being him as well. The point of the OP was people only care about race going in one direction, and caring about race at all is racist on its own.

I strongly disagree that caring about racial representation in casting is racist, it's being considerate about how people will react. In the series, non-white people are mostly portrayed as brutal dothraki or summer islanders with their wacky wine and sex gods. In other words, they aren't like the "normal" white main characters, they are their culture first, and a character second. I'd be really put off by a show where everyone who looked like me was portrayed so one-dimensionally. Dorne is a huge breath of fresh air because suddenly there are non-white characters who are defined by more than their culture, they are unique and well-rounded individuals.

[Ravi Seaworth]

Really? I have an hypothetical question for you. If Ned Stark was casted as an East-Asian man would you only care about his "acting abilities"?

How do you go from the Northern African,Arab/Spanish comparison to the European/Asian comparison? It's ridiculous. I am a mediterranean guy and I know pretty well how similar people from Southern Europe, Africa, and Middle East can be. There were admixtures throughout history and yes, people from North Africa are white, in the sense that they are Caucasian. Pedro Pascal is a mediterranean guy who could almost pass as a Northern African, I can assure you. This is especially true for Spanish, Portuguese, and southern Italians, regions that were once occupied by the moors.

[OrangeStallion]

Could it have occurred to anyone that maybe they auditioned a darker man, but Pedro was a better actor? Instead of the "white CEOs are out to get all the minorities?"

[Queen Sansa Stark]

I've always pictured them as Mediterranean, even before reading what GRRM said.

Except GRRM also said he based their culture on Palestina. I would hardly call them Mediterranean.

[Hangover of the Morning]

Yes how dare they try break the status quo when it comes to casting -_-

I am sorry I just think it is ridiculous to bend history or credibility of a story in order to have a racially more diverse cast. If TV is to be used to educate us on racial equality, I think it is much more productive to actually have more diversity within the presenters (such as the national news) and in contemporary stories where it makes sense.

Will people be more tolerant of other races because you put a black guy into a medieval drama or Victorian England where they clearly stand out?

[OrangeStallion]

I strongly disagree that caring about racial representation in casting is racist, it's being considerate about how people will react. In the series, non-white people are mostly portrayed as brutal dothraki or summer islanders with their wacky wine and sex gods. In other words, they aren't like the "normal" white main characters, they are their culture first, and a character second. I'd be really put off by a show where everyone who looked like me was portrayed so one-dimensionally. Dorne is a huge breath of fresh air because suddenly there are non-white characters who are defined by more than their culture, they are unique and well-rounded individuals.

I'd say the most barbaric culture are the Wildlings, and they're white

[AdelinaZ]

How do you go from the Northern African,Arab/Spanish comparison to the European/Asian comparison? It's ridiculous. I am a mediterranean guy and I know pretty well how similar people from Southern Europe, Africa, and Middle East can be.

This. I come from a Mediterranean countrry as well, by the way. Palestine is Mediterranean too.

Guys, may I ask where does this whole "Dornish as South Asians" thing come from?

[Hangover of the Morning]

I strongly disagree that caring about racial representation in casting is racist, it's being considerate about how people will react. In the series, non-white people are mostly portrayed as brutal dothraki or summer islanders with their wacky wine and sex gods. In other words, they aren't like the "normal" white main characters, they are their culture first, and a character second. I'd be really put off by a show where everyone who looked like me was portrayed so one-dimensionally. Dorne is a huge breath of fresh air because suddenly there are non-white characters who are defined by more than their culture, they are unique and well-rounded individuals.

I have never even noticed that because I don't specifically pay attention to those things. I don't really distinguish between colours so I don't really get the message that one race is somehow portrayed better than other on this show. And even if I did, I would take it as a representation of this (fictional world) not as a moral message to how I should be behaving in real life.

[Mad Monkey]

I too find the "political correctness" hypocritical, racist, idiotic and contra-productive. It is one thing to be deliberately portraying certain group of people in a negative light on the news in order to sway peoples opinion for political gain or something but this is fiction. Nobody should be drawing their morals from that. I hate this: "We can't have a strong female character to do an immoral act because she is an inspiration for teenage girls".

BBC is especially ridiculous in that sense. In order to fulfil their quota we had black Guinevere, Porthos and so on. If Downton Abbey wasn't on ITV but BBC, Matthew Crawley would probably be Asian :-)

I remember few months ago catching a promotional trailer for new upcoming shows on BBC. Next day I read an article in the newspaper where some journalist was outraged by the lack of female characters portrayed in said trailer. I distinctly remembered women being in it and just couldn't understand. Who does that? Who actually sits in front of the TV and counts the number of women, black, white, Asian people etc?

While I agree with what your'e generally saying about political correctness, it's kind of interesting that in the second paragraph you complain about characters like Guinevere and Porthos being shown as black but in the third paragraph you complain about people who "sit in front of the TV and count the number of women, black..." If it really doesn't matter at all, you shouldn't care if the network decided to make any characters black (or Asian) for any reason, right?

[Ran]

George was speaking in terms of geography and climate, rather than culture. Culture-wise, he referred to the Moorish influence in Spain. But as he notes in the LJ comment noted above, he thinks of the salty Dornish as "mediterranean", and by Mediterranean he largely thinks of southern Europeans, like the Greeks (the inventors of pita bread!)

[OrangeStallion]

Again, back to the spirit of the OP that its seemingly OK for the viewers to substitute a black guy for a European-esque guy, but get a European-esque white guy in the place of what many believed to be a darker man and all hell breaks loose. Its entirely hyprocritical, and the argument is that if you're going to cry racist, you better cry it every single way. If not, you're just as racist as the people who judge other based on the color of their skin.