Mad Men Season 7: Once a hobo, always a hobo (Spoilers) (Now including part 2)

[Hugorfonics]

You make a good argument for Pete, but I think your just high off this last season filled with redemptive Pete moments (an abundance of which were in this latest episode) by differentiating him from the other "bad guys" on your list.

Joan is a good-ish guy. But I don't see her as so very far apart from the others. She's been motivated by greed in a big way these past two seasons. And Betty? Pshh. I ain't even...

Your right. They're all scum. Morality is a sham, like long term relationships and change for the better. This is what I've learned

Thaat's were I knew him from. Thank you.

Thanks for the confirmation

[RumHam]

Thanks for the confirmation

Oh actually I was taking your word for it, the guy just looked really familiar. Looking at the IMDB page for the guy from Malcom in the Middle I'm less sure it was him

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0557733/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t3

Edit: looks like it was this guy

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0626069/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t26

[drawkcabi]

Oh actually I was taking your word for it, the guy just looked really familiar. Looking at the IMDB page for the guy from Malcom in the Middle I'm less sure it was him

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0557733/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t3

Edit: looks like it was this guy

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0626069/?ref_=ttfc_fc_cl_t26

Pretty sure that's who they meant. He was in Malcolm, was one of the military school cadets and moved to Alaska.

[RumHam]

Oooh ok. I don't remember the show that well, I was thinking of Francis for some reason.

Edit: oh shit and he was captain america in Generation Kill. That's actually where I remembered him from.

[Blaine]

I wrote an amazing (and overly long) comment last week, but the board went all fl00b-y and I totally lost it. Anyway, you can all just imagine it was full of real world ad wisdom.

Twice in my career I've left a plucky upstart agency to go work at a big one. It's a weird shift. No, I've never been marginalized and completely creeped on like Joan. But I've felt the way I think Don does in this episode (and to some degree Peggy). At a little shop you can be the brightest talent in the room. The longer you stay, the more important you are. The more people automatically respect you. Because you're the only one there who can do what you do.

And then you go to a place where there are 10 or 20 people just like you. Each one was wooed and told how special they are. Some of them even still believe it. Invariably, someone there actually IS better than you.

For Don, I think it's the last straw. He literally created Don Draper to be exceptional. To be more than just another Dick Whitman. And pretty much taught everyone else at SC&P to go along with it. They were special and scrappy. And now they have to redefine themselves like Peggy or just go away.

I guess I shouldn't be surprised Don is off on yet another soul search. I just wish it had a better fake reason for it than boring-ass Diana or Diane or whoever she is.

And for the record, once you get in the water at the big agency, it can be great. Depending on the agency. But then again, this is 2015. And I've never worked anywhere on the scale of McCann.

[Ran]

Does AdAge or anywhere have any information on all the McCann-Erickson stuff they have on the show? As PLF noted, they sure do paint a very ugly picture of the place, and one wonders how much is based on stories of how it was like.

[smegma]

I can't speak for advertising world, but the show did amazingly accurate depiction of the automotive business, where I was subjected to a lot of the disgusting and outlandish behavior that recalled Joan and Ken's time working within the industry. No, I never got shot AT, but I did have to go on a turkey hunt - and this was only ten years ago. From trying to get contracts signed while handing over expensive gifts, end-of-the world partying every night, or having to fight back tears due to sexual harassment and objectification - getting offered big deals if I slept with them, or trying to maneuver negotiations while they insist they'll only sign if I sit on their lap. I can only imagine how much crazier and sleazier it was in the 60's and looked like Joan or trying to fit in like Kenny.

My point is, that while it SEEMED ridiculous in the show, I think its accuracy in this instance gives me confidence that the depictions of McCann were pretty spot on as well.

[Blaine]

Does AdAge or anywhere have any information on all the McCann-Erickson stuff they have on the show? As PLF noted, they sure do paint a very ugly picture of the place, and one wonders how much is based on stories of how it was like.

There was a pretty good article here in the WSJ about how 2015 McCann is basically rolling with the punches on Twitter.

Basically, to my understanding, McCann isn't known for being exceptionally worse (or better) in terms of misogynist ad agencies of the 60s/70s. They've long since been part of the huuuuuuuuuge international conglomerate Interpublic and their rep now is basically being like any of the other major shops like Ogilvy or BBDO.

I think the bigger issue is that the "real life" Mad Men (and Jane Maas, the only Mad Woman I've ever met - who was insanely candid in a talk she gave that I saw) say that things were legitimately nuts back then. And as Smegma pointed out - it wasn't just Advertising. All the old boys clubs businesses of the era had to go through some tough adjustment periods to end up where we are today (which still isn't where we're going to be in a decade, I'm sure).

Ultimately, I've never believed that advertising was any more sexist than anywhere else. But the rampant drinking can't have helped the behavior. In fact, there's significant evidence that industry was one of the first to evolve with the times. Advertising from the 60's onward was so "youth-focused" that it was imperative for agencies to hire younger, more progressive people. In Mary Lawrence's bio, she credits some of her success to a very forward-thinking boss (the legend Bill Bernbach, who wrote the classic VW ads like "Lemon") but also to clients who demanded women in key roles on their accounts, because they too, saw the world changing very quickly and wanted to be a part of it.

Anyway, the depiction of McCann on Mad Men is brutal, but probably not untrue. But I guess my larger point it's not representative of all 60s/70s agencies. Bernbach's DDB was one of the best agencies in the world, and far more progressive than any incarnation of Sterling Cooper. But the writers have chosen McCann to be their heavy, most likely because they were so mammoth at the time and the most unlike SC&P.

[Rockroi]

So, a little late with my Mad Men Commentary.

- Overall, I think this was the best, but paradoxically least surprising, episode of Mad Men maybe ever. We knew that, one day, McCann would squeeze SCP and want what it wanted and discard the rest IT was a matter of time. The method it took was equal parts viciousness and also “inevitability;” the idea that it could and would just wear down the SCD peeps. The transition was well done, strangely human, strangely ludicrous. I liked of Hobart showed both those elements- killing them with kindness, until he just wants to kill them. The actor was perfect.

-Obviously, the major point here was Joan’s departure; how Joan has the instinct to fight, but the wisdom to know its pointless. Joan does what Joan ALWAYS does- she did things the right way; she prepared the junior guy, when he did not work out she tried turning to the “devil she knew” (Pete) before being reminded by Ferg that Pete was a VP; then she got Ferg and TRIED to handle him. When Ferg proved incorrigible, she turned to Hobart whop was too much Palpatine, not enough Yoda.

Here is where I think the show cashed in the last of its “Suspension-of-Disbelief” Chips. While I have no doubt stuff LIKE this happened to women in 1970, this was so brutally fast, swift and about as subtle as a hammer to the side of your head. FErg’s come-ons were DESIGNED so that Joan’s response would be “no choice;” and Hobart’s anger and evil were in character, they seemed horribly forced. I think the show, though – ONCE AGAIN – painted themselves into this corner. They are pressed for time and therefore had to put Joan’s story on warp-speed. That was unfortunate, and the finish product suffered. But at the same time… at least we GOT a finished product.

Which brings me back to Joan. Sure, she can listen to men “mansplain” to her how to do this- from the boyfriend’s “I know a guy” to, ultimately Rodger-, but it was so clear that she wanted to fight; even if she lost she wanted to “burn the place.” To me, I feel that part of Joan very acutely; as an attorney, I will sometimes be involved in long, drawn out fights with the opposing side when I have to remind myself that sometimes I am just fighting for the sake of fighting Not a noble endeavor. With Joan, she wanted to make them fight; wanted them to be hurt, she wanted to fight and maybe lose. So that at the very least they MAY have taken her money, but it would have been “over her dead body.”

Which brings us back to Hobart- a man who rarely takes “No” for an answer, but you can tell gives it an awful lot. Hobart tells Joanie what so many men have told so many women over the years- that THEY are the problem because “women love it here” – an amazing line rich with both willful ignorance and certainty. And just when Joan thinks she has him on the ropes, Hobart … out Joan’s Joan. In the end, its ultimately Hobart who would rather risk everything and give his money to the lawyers rather than Joan. This makes Joan have to make that hard calculus – would it be better to risk everything or take her payday?

-Which brings us to Rodger. To Rodger- much like Don – the money means more than anyone is willing to admit. Rodger- the fantasy induced character; the one least prone to sense and practicality; most apt to do LSD and drink and forget how hard it is to actually EARN anything, reminds Joan of the most sensible course of action: tap out. Take the money, claim victory and depart the field. Hobart gets what he wants- peace and quiet; and Joan gets what’s important- the money.

And you can tell, the whole time, that FOR THAT ONE MOMENT, Joan wishes she was somebody else. I swear, Joan wishes she WAS NOT the practical one; Joan wishes she WAS NOT the sensible one; for that one moment, Joan seems like she wants to be something she has never been- the rebel; the cigarette-smoking, eye-glasses-wearing, octopus-violating-painting-holding rebel, who would rather fight and lose than submit and “win.” But not Joan. Joan has always had one thing – wisdom.

A blessing. A curse.

Joan is my favorite character on Mad Men.

-Another great moment was that, at long last, Rodger and Peggy got to have some back and forth. Peggy is doing a “You Can’t Hire Me, I Still Have Another Job” thing with McCann; I did not like it THAT much only because- I don’t care how Neanderthal McCann is, THEY WOULD KNOW PEGGY WAS NOT A SECRETARY! That was needless. But that she did not have an office gave her the ability to stay out on the perimeter of the episode.

And there she finds free-wheeling Rodger; not the guy who will eventually tell Joan to throw in the towel, but the one who says everyone needs a little push. Those scenes would have been awkward because those two characters never interact on any good level.

Until now.

Rodger and Peggy share a lot in those scenes- war stories, alcohol (though … who really drinks sweet vermouth?); and solid advice- don’t try to go along to get along, says Rodger; the same man who was willing to continue World War II into the SCDP board room. And he tells Peggy that she sould not ever do that; make them think you are unpredictable, formidable and willing to take risks. They will be at a loss to figure you out.

So that way, when you roller-skate around the hollowed-out halls of SCP, everything seems perfectly normal.

Fantastic scene.

Honorable Mention To the last office boy who, before departing Peggy’s Office, puts on, of course, a Mets cap. Because, well…. We all know whose office it USED to be…

-In the end, the character I was, once again, most disappointed with was Don. It’s the same old same old with Don; inability to face the present; desire to escape; going off to a very unknown known location. I really thought his escape from the board room was in character- Don has always hated the part of advertising married to the stats; the one that old German woman was pressing with Lucky Strike and that Pete foolishly tied his star to. No, Don is always looking for that Horizon.

Which made the episode seem so lost. Don out of the office is old. But here? Unforgivable as well. Hobart has gotten some flack because he is such a hard-ass, but COME ON! Where is Don? He just left and missed major meetings. And why?

Well, so he could … try to track down that waitress? Why? Why do we care? I don’t? And as STUPID as that scene was… the ex-Husband’s reaction was classic! HE said that Don was not the first guy to show up like this…. WHAAAA?!?!?!?!?!? Are middle-aged men from across the contiguous 48 states driving up to this guy’s house because his ex-wife gave them the best blow job ever? That’s some talent right there; if that is true, maybe Don SHOULD risk it all for her.

I did sort – of like the scene with Bert; the consciousness of something deeper in Don that can be expressed externally through Cooper. But to what end? To know that Don hates authority? Rules? Roast Beef Sandwiches? That he longs to be “way out there in the blue?” So he can chase hot pieces of waitress tail? So he can drive hippies out West?

This has always represented my biggest enthusiasm for Don- his “Anything is Possible” earnestness – and my biggest dislike: his total inability to adapt to what is around him. Don MUSt make the same mistakes over and over and sees his only way out as “Going West.” As vapid, predictable and boring as that is.

But in there lies Richard Nixon. So much so that Nixon could never adapt; could never re-invent himself. So much so that when Ferg does that AWFUL impersonation of Don, we know, full well, that he’s doing an INCREDIBLE impersonation of Richard Nixon.

I hated Don’s story line, but must admit- it was so predictable, I could have set my watch by it.

I think things are setting up well; I think next week will be more Betty and Pete- two hopeless souls lost in the new times. And then, well, lets see how this ends.

[NestorMakhnosLovechild]

-Which brings us to Rodger. To Rodger- much like Don – the money means more than anyone is willing to admit. Rodger- the fantasy induced character; the one least prone to sense and practicality; most apt to do LSD and drink and forget how hard it is to actually EARN anything, reminds Joan of the most sensible course of action: tap out. Take the money, claim victory and depart the field. Hobart gets what he wants- peace and quiet; and Joan gets what’s important- the money.

Obviously, the money means so much to Don that he's willing to leave in the middle of a meeting, disappear from his new job and imperil his payout (unlike Joan, they wouldn't have to give anything else to Don if he simply disappears), and at the end of the episode, decides to head even further west and even further away from all that money he's leaving on the table.

[Spring Bass]

Great post, Blaine. I read Jane Maas' book, and holy shit does some of the stuff she describe make anything that happened on Mad Men seem mild by comparison. I remember her describing a boat that (I think) Ogilvy's people would rent every year, and the party on board was a total fuck-fest.

Kind of makes me wonder what the show would have been like on HBO.

[Knight of Ashes]

There was a pretty good article here in the WSJ about how 2015 McCann is basically rolling with the punches on Twitter.

Basically, to my understanding, McCann isn't known for being exceptionally worse (or better) in terms of misogynist ad agencies of the 60s/70s. They've long since been part of the huuuuuuuuuge international conglomerate Interpublic and their rep now is basically being like any of the other major shops like Ogilvy or BBDO.

I think the bigger issue is that the "real life" Mad Men (and Jane Maas, the only Mad Woman I've ever met - who was insanely candid in a talk she gave that I saw) say that things were legitimately nuts back then. And as Smegma pointed out - it wasn't just Advertising. All the old boys clubs businesses of the era had to go through some tough adjustment periods to end up where we are today (which still isn't where we're going to be in a decade, I'm sure).

Ultimately, I've never believed that advertising was any more sexist than anywhere else. But the rampant drinking can't have helped the behavior. In fact, there's significant evidence that industry was one of the first to evolve with the times. Advertising from the 60's onward was so "youth-focused" that it was imperative for agencies to hire younger, more progressive people. In Mary Lawrence's bio, she credits some of her success to a very forward-thinking boss (the legend Bill Bernbach, who wrote the classic VW ads like "Lemon") but also to clients who demanded women in key roles on their accounts, because they too, saw the world changing very quickly and wanted to be a part of it.

Anyway, the depiction of McCann on Mad Men is brutal, but probably not untrue. But I guess my larger point it's not representative of all 60s/70s agencies. Bernbach's DDB was one of the best agencies in the world, and far more progressive than any incarnation of Sterling Cooper. But the writers have chosen McCann to be their heavy, most likely because they were so mammoth at the time and the most unlike SC&P.

Thanks for your posts, Blaine. It gives me a better idea of a road not taken.

[Rockroi]

Obviously, the money means so much to Don that he's willing to leave in the middle of a meeting, disappear from his new job and imperil his payout (unlike Joan, they wouldn't have to give anything else to Don if he simply disappears), and at the end of the episode, decides to head even further west and even further away from all that money he's leaving on the table.

Again, you are confusing Don's relationship with money with his distaste for responsibility. Don hates being beholden to others.

[Blaine]

Great post, Blaine. I read Jane Maas' book, and holy shit does some of the stuff she describe make anything that happened on Mad Men seem mild by comparison. I remember her describing a boat that (I think) Ogilvy's people would rent every year, and the party on board was a total fuck-fest.

Kind of makes me wonder what the show would have been like on HBO.

Jane Maas is even more racy in real life. Which is hilarious because she's basically a little old lady now. She spoke to my local ad club and I was lucky enough to have dinner with her and some other board members. In person, she's even more candid, basically naming names about some big time old legends and their notorious drug habits, sexual peculiarities and just out and out debauchery. Hilarious. About 50 times during that dinner I wished I had the stories on camera.

It was a little bit like what I imagine having dinner with Olenna Tyrell would be like.

[Raja]

Obviously, the money means so much to Don that he's willing to leave in the middle of a meeting,

Yeah, I've got to agree with Nestor. In my mind, both Don and Roger don't really care about the money.

[Winterfell is Burning]

Yeah, I've got to agree with Nestor. In my mind, both Don and Roger don't really care about the money.

Roger does, at least to the extent it can pay his martinis and expensive suits and high-class prostitutes and whatnot. Don, not so much.

[RumHam]

Do Roger or Don really need this money? Roger inherited wealth and Don seemed to be pretty well set, giving Megan a million dollar parting gift.

[OnionAhaiReborn]

Don has been remarkably cavalier about money on several occasions. But his most notable association with money is giving it to women- Midge, Alison, Peggy (very aggressively throwing it at her), Sylvia, most recently Megan. Clearly the idea is that he's treating women like prostitutes, out of some kind of Oedipal impulse (as his mother was a prostitute) plus the imprint of his whorehouse upbringing plus his first sexual experience, which was forced on him (thus after divorce one he pays a prostitue to slap him). Notably, Diana the mystical waitress actually believes Roger's exorbitant tip was down payment from Don for sex, making Don's infatuation a final on-the-nose example of his pathology- which I think is exactly the point of her vague and even bland characterization.

[Arbor Gold]

The Matthew Weiner interview on the May 6 ep of The Nerdist podcast is phenomenal if you're into that sort of thing.

ETA: As a person who has gone through four biotech acquisitions from 2006-2010, I laughed at how much I could relate despite the different time periods. I went from a small privately-owned company to being owned by a giant biotech conglomerate and I totally related our heroes. The increase of paperwork to get simple things done was hilarious. It's amazing how things haven't really changed.

[Raja]

There's also the time where he paid for Pete's share at SCDP, though I can't remember why they had to put that money up. Also, I'm pretty sure he would have paid Lane's debt if Lane had ever asked.

I haven't listened to The Nerdist podcast before, but I'll give it a try. Thanks Arbor Gold!