John will have an ice dragon?

[Jesse17Renee]

Okay, so I am listening to the audio book of ASOS and it is on a Bran Chapter. Bran and the Reeds have not yet gotten to the wall and they are discussing Mountains and Jojen (who is a green seer) is discussing mountains with Bran. They are using the "ice dragon" in the sky (a constellation) like we would use the North Star to navigate. Jojen says "If ice can burn then love and hate can mate, mountain or marsh it makes no matter the land is one". I know this may be a stretch, but I believe this is a direct reference to Jon Snow and R+L=J. A Targ (fire) and a Stark (winter or ice) mate. I don't know a lot about the theories surrounding the "ice dragon", only that I believe Summer/Bran sees the dragon rising up from the destruction in Winterfell. I've always thought that someone else will have to awaken or find a dragon besides Dany. I also think that one of Dany's dragons will be killed by GRRM at some point for dramatic purposes, but that the only way for anyone to be a threat to Dany (whether they end up as her ally or not, they have to be just as powerful as her) is if they also awaken or find a dragon and make it theirs. The logical choice (if my theory proves true) would be Jon Snow as AA or TPTWP. He would need to conquer an ice dragon and who better to conquer/control an ice dragon than a Targ/Stark mix. I also began to wonder how the Wall was really built. Maybe it was built with the help of an ice dragon... And maybe it will take another ice dragon to re-build it when the horn of joramund is blown and the wall falls or any other such thing that GRRM pulls out of his hat to compromise the wall; because right now the wights cannot easily pass the magic that protects the wall and all of the free folk are heading to the South side of the wall. The wall will have to be compromised to make the wights a real threat. I also have a less logical theory that I am contemplating because of GRRM's story about the Ice Dragon. This makes me think that Arya might end up riding the ice dragon. She is the less logical choice, but at the same time she is a Stark through and through and is also more in touch with her warging side. I know some would then argue that Bran is the best choice, but I just don't see him as a "dragon" in the same way I can see Arya or Jon. What do yall think??? Any comments on Ice Dragon theories?

**And on a side note: I absolutely loved watching Joffrey turn purple on HBO Sunday night. Very well done. Can't wait to see all of the non-readers reactions to Tyrions actions in the next few episodes. And I will be extremely upset if Shae has actually left Kings Landing.

[Tyryan Lannister]

My thoughts on it are not the Jon will ride an ice dragon, but rather that he is the Ice Dragon--it is simply a metaphor, just like Dragon has Three heads will not apply to three Dragonriders, but instead to three rulers in unity, which would in this case be Dany as Queen, Tyrion as her Hand, and ____________ as Dany's Prince-Consort (and this blank eould not be filled in by Jon).

Jon's importance as the Ice Dragon is that it pins him as the analog to the Jormungandr, the World Serpent who in Norse myth is sometimes referred to as an Ice Serpent and who, when he unclenches his tail from his mouth, starts the Ragnarok--Jon, in being stabbed and thus losing all control of mind and body, has now "unclenched his tail", and the Ragnarok that is the Winds of Winter will unfold.

[Jesse17Renee]

I'd like to hear more on you opinion of the role Jon plays and what he symbolizes... Me thinks you leave out much!

[Masha]

My thoughts on it are not the Jon will ride an ice dragon, but rather that he is the Ice Dragon--it is simply a metaphor, just like Dragon has Three heads will not apply to three Dragonriders, but instead to three rulers in unity, which would in this case be Dany as Queen, Tyrion as her Hand, and ____________ as Dany's Prince-Consort (and this blank eould not be filled in by Jon).

Jon's importance as the Ice Dragon is that it pins him as the analog to the Jormungandr, the World Serpent who in Norse myth is sometimes referred to as an Ice Serpent and who, when he unclenches his tail from his mouth, starts the Ragnarok--Jon, in being stabbed and thus losing all control of mind and body, has now "unclenched his tail", and the Ragnarok that is the Winds of Winter will unfold.

I am unsure that Tyrion will end up as Dany's Hand, he'll be lucky to live thru the end of the last book. GRRM so far has been very good as keeping deeds and punishments going that the capital crime in Westeros - killing his kin, especially father - will not go unpunished. Either way, unless it is revealed that Tywin is NOT Tyrion's father, and proven without any doubt to general Westeros public, Westeros will NOT accept Tyrion in any position of power - whether its by faith, old gods and the new. Dany might be able to use Tyrion as secret "shadow" hand (aka Bloodraven), but not officially, and neither can she gift Tyrion the Casterly Rock.

In ALL aSoIaF novels and stories, kinslayers do not survive nor have happy endings. None of the Targaryens who killed their kin from a Dance of Dragons did (the one who inherited the Iron Throne was Rhaenara's little boy), Rob Stark didn't (killing his distant relative Karstark) and neither will Tyrion. He will NOT have a happy ending - whether reuniting with his lost wife (and her not rejecting him instantly), inheriting Casterly Rock, nor becoming a Dragon Rider.

He will have a long and interesting journey (because GRRM and most fans consider him the favourite character) but he will not have a good resolution unless a MAJOR reveal that Tywin is not his father happens.

[The Great Cornholio!]

I'm not aware of a character named John. Mayhaps you speak of Jon?

[espresso]

Jon will have a shadow dragon beget on Melisandre. The beast from stone tower that Dany sees in house of undying. Mel seems very intend on mating with Jon. I hate her succeeding, but that's a possibility.