Daenerys Targaryen: Mad, Stupid or Inexperienced?

[The King Of Cooked Steak]

The way I see it, Daenerys is probably the most conflicted character amongst fans in ASOIAF. People either absolutely love her, or really despise her. I've heard people call her mad, and say that the traits of the Targaryen madness are very apparent in her. Others come to her defense almost using the same excuse she does; she is not experienced in the way of war. Or she is just stupid.

Here's what I think:

I like Dany. She doesn't want to really do any harm to the world and wants to bring justice to Slaver's Bay by freeing all the slaves. So, she's fighting for a good cause. Also, unlike the Starks, she makes decisions with her brain not her heart, like when she decides to finally marry Hizdahr zo Loraq to make Meereen a better place.

But... She is so... dumb! Why? Because she can't decide whether to return to Westeros, or stay in Slaver's Bay.

The way I see it, the best course would be to go to Westeros first, conquer it and sit on the Iron Throne (if she can of course). When she does, and when she has gained enough allies in court, has married a lord that supports her cause (or Aegon VI)(and certainly not Daario or Hizdahr!) and receives PROPER counsel, then she can campaign over to Slaver's Bay and leave her Hand (Which could be a Martell, Doran preferably if he can come to KL, or even Tyrion if they actually ever meet) to rule there until she's done. When she arrives at SB, she would have enough of an army that is more than just Unsullied, and by then she will have way more power and when eventually she wins this campaign, declares a group of trustworthy and able people to be the rulers of Meereen, Qarth, Astapor and Yunkai, she will end slavery, kill the Sons of the Harpy, then go back to Westeros happy.

Now, I know it's not that simple, and I don't "have a mind for war", but I think it would work this way for her, if she would succed without any treachery.

And you know what? Who really cares? The place is called SLAVER'S Bay. The cities there profit from slaves, and how do you know if these slaves would even want to be freed?

And why the hell would she refuse Xaro Xhoan Daxos' gift? 13 ships? That is not enough? This guy is giving you such a valuable gift and you refuse it? You moron! At least then Groleo wouldn't be complaining about how he has no ships to work with.

Oh, and by the way Ser Barristan, tell her how Ned Stark pleaded for her life, when King Robert wanted to send Ser Jorah to kill her. Tell her how he defied Robert and almost resigned from his position as Hand. Let's see if she calls him the "Usurper's dog" then. I'm pretty sure you were present at those council meetings, and even you protested with Ned.

I might have missed something from the books and I might have been completely wrong in some respects. If so, feel free to correct me.

So it comes down to this: Is Daenerys Targaryen dumb, inexperienced, or just mad?

[Guess who's back]

Oh, and by the way Ser Barristan, tell her how Ned Stark pleaded for her life, when King Robert wanted to send Ser Jorah to kill her. Tell her how he defied Robert and almost resigned from his position as Hand. Let's see if she calls him the "Usurper's dog" then. I'm pretty sure you were present at those council meetings, and even you protested with Ned.

Please, Barristan, tell her about the trial of Brandon and Rickard Stark. I seriously cant wait for that.

[Ziggy Targdust]

People think conquering Westeros is so easy just because you have some wild dragons.

Aegon spent years planning his invasion, and he was already right there on Dragonstone with 3 full grown and properly trained dragons.

Free Unsullied? Bad move Dany, should have planned that out. But now just hop on some ships and go to Westeros and take it, no big deal, planning is overrated.

[Night's_King]

People think conquering Westeros is so easy just because you have some wild dragons.

Aegon spent years planning his invasion, and he was already right there on Dragonstone with 3 full grown and properly trained dragons.

Free Unsullied? Bad move Dany, should have planned that out. But now just hop on some ships and go to Westeros and take it, no big deal, planning is overrated.

I really like those scenes where she is discussing her invasion on Westeros! She really seems eager to learn about the Westerosi customs or about which westerosi lords will support her and which are the greater problems!

Oh and all the plans of how she wants to rule and what things she wants to improve in Westeros!

She is a great plan-maker!

[Chatty Duelist]

All three.

[Nictarion]

The way I see it, Daenerys is probably the most conflicted character amongst fans in ASOIAF. People either absolutely love her, or really despise her. I've heard people call her mad, and say that the traits of the Targaryen madness are very apparent in her. Others come to her defense almost using the same excuse she does; she is not experienced in the way of war. Or she is just stupid.

Here's what I think:

I like Dany. She doesn't want to really do any harm to the world and wants to bring justice to Slaver's Bay by freeing all the slaves. So, she's fighting for a good cause. Also, unlike the Starks, she makes decisions with her brain not her heart, like when she decides to finally marry Hizdahr zo Loraq to make Meereen a better place.

But... She is so... dumb! Why? Because she can't decide whether to return to Westeros, or stay in Slaver's Bay.

The way I see it, the best course would be to go to Westeros first, conquer it and sit on the Iron Throne (if she can of course). When she does, and when she has gained enough allies in court, has married a lord that supports her cause (or Aegon VI)(and certainly not Daario or Hizdahr!) and receives PROPER counsel, then she can campaign over to Slaver's Bay and leave her Hand (Which could be a Martell, Doran preferably if he can come to KL, or even Tyrion if they actually ever meet) to rule there until she's done. When she arrives at SB, she would have enough of an army that is more than just Unsullied, and by then she will have way more power and when eventually she wins this campaign, declares a group of trustworthy and able people to be the rulers of Meereen, Qarth, Astapor and Yunkai, she will end slavery, kill the Sons of the Harpy, then go back to Westeros happy.

Now, I know it's not that simple, and I don't "have a mind for war", but I think it would work this way for her, if she would succed without any treachery.

And you know what? Who really cares? The place is called SLAVER'S Bay. The cities there profit from slaves, and how do you know if these slaves would even want to be freed?

And why the hell would she refuse Xaro Xhoan Daxos' gift? 13 ships? That is not enough? This guy is giving you such a valuable gift and you refuse it? You moron! At least then Groleo wouldn't be complaining about how he has no ships to work with.

Oh, and by the way Ser Barristan, tell her how Ned Stark pleaded for her life, when King Robert wanted to send Ser Jorah to kill her. Tell her how he defied Robert and almost resigned from his position as Hand. Let's see if she calls him the "Usurper's dog" then. I'm pretty sure you were present at those council meetings, and even you protested with Ned.

I might have missed something from the books and I might have been completely wrong in some respects. If so, feel free to correct me.

So it comes down to this: Is Daenerys Targaryen dumb, inexperienced, or just mad?

Well, she's definitely not stupid or mad, so if I have to choose, I'd say inexperienced.

Also, what good would 13 ships do her when at the very least she has 8,000 Unsullied to transport. That's not even counting her freed men and sellswords.

IIRC, Barristan did tell Dany about Ned being a good man, and that he spoke against having her killed.

[Ziggy Targdust]

I really like those scenes where she is discussing her invasion on Westeros! She really seems eager to learn about the Westerosi customs and or which westerosi lords will support her and which are the greater problems!

Oh and all the plans od how she wants to rule and what things she wants to improve in Westeros!

She is a great plan-maker!

What's your point here? That's she should be actively planning a Westeros invasion just because you think she should? There's quite a bit of other things on her plate at the moment.

Aside from the false accusations of people saying she does nothing but sit in the pyramid all day eating snacks.

[ovis alba]

I think she is naive and idealistic and she probably starts to notice that she is

[Stan the Man Baratheon]

All three.

Bingo.

[Night's_King]

Barristan's ongoing lack of explanation of the events in Westeros are pretty irritating, I won't deny. They both have a very busy schedule, but taking 10 minutes each night to have a little chat over tea can't be that hard. His reason's are probably along the lines of it not being currently relevant; he wants to protect her from the truth that would hurt her; there's not enough time to fully explain or that he doesn't want to distract her.

IIRC she didn't want to hear much about Westeros. She always stopped Barristand and said that she hasn't got the time for that.

[David Selig]

What are the odds this thread will turn ugly? 95%?

Anyway, OP's suggestions seem pretty terrible to me. For example if she conquers Westeros, but leaves for Slaver's Bay, she would lose Westeros immediately, she can't hold power there from half the world away.

And you know what? Who really cares? The place is called SLAVER'S Bay. The cities there profit from slaves, and how do you know if these slaves would even want to be freed?

LOL. Yeah, I am sure the slaves just love being tortured, whipped, worked to death, castrated, turned into a robotic killing machines, why would anyone think they want to be freed?

[Stan the Man Baratheon]

What are the odds this thread will turn ugly? 95%?

You are being modest here. Dany fans will drive in and start to moan and bitch about it. I say 100%.

[unSonofStannis]

The Westerosi lords would never support Dany in a campaign to go and conquore slavers bay because it is simply too far, she would get the same reaction as Euron did from his men...no.

[Night's_King]

What's your point here? That's she should be actively planning a Westeros invasion just because you think she should?

No. Your argument was that invading needs planning and she can't just walk on a ship and conquer Westeros. But no one ever said that she shouldn't plan the invasion. No one said "Just go to Westeros and conquer it without planning first!".

It would be great if she starts planning her invasion, yes. Or at least she should try to learn more about Westeros and not turn Barristan away everytime he wants to tell her something.

[Ziggy Targdust]

No. Your argument was that invading needs planning and she can't just walk on a ship and conquer Westeros. But no one ever said that she shouldn't plan the invasion. No one said "Just go to Westeros and conquer it without planning first!".

It would be great if she starts planning her invasion, yes.

Uh, yeh a whole lot of people did and do say she should just go to Westeros right now.

[ovis alba]

LOL. Yeah, I am sure the slaves just love being tortured, whipped, worked to death, castrated, turned into a robotic killing machines, why would anyone think they want to be freed?

That's actually exactly Dany's problem. She expects things to be that easiy: slavery=bad, freeing the slaves=good and we're done. She fails to see that a society that is based on these principles needs time to change. Just by crushing something it will not rebuild itself in a better way. And that's what she is learning right now and what she probably has to learn in regards to Westeros.

Her having a claim on the throne does not automatically mean that it will just happen that people will support her. Because even if in her mind it's the "right" thing to do, it will not abolish the fact that other structures have grown for years that will make people reluctant to it.

[Night's_King]

Uh, yeh a whole lot of people did and do say she should just go to Westeros right now.

Well, I think you are right there. But that doesn't mean that she shouldn't do some planning.

Its shorter to say "Just go to Westeros!" than "Just plan your invasion and go to Westeros!"

When I say "I'm going to the grocery." it does not mean that I don't make a list of the things I need, before.

[Sylva Santagar]

Since Danny is a major POV character we know that she is not dumb and not mad. Is she inexperienced, sure... she is a young girl about to do something that nobody has done before... how can she not be inexperienced???

Please, Barristan, tell her about the trial of Brandon and Rickard Stark. I seriously cant wait for that.

Yes, and don't forget to tell her how Brandon showed up in KL threatening to kill the crown prince... We want her to get the whole picture, right?

[Ziggy Targdust]

Well, I think you are right there. But that doesn't mean that she shouldn't do some planning.

Its shorter to say "Just go to Westeros!" than "Just plan your invasion and go to Westeros!"

I guess if that's what you want it's cool, I love the slavers bay and essos stuff. I'm in no rush to see her leave. But you will probably get your wish in the next book, or at least half of it. The going to Westeros part, probably won't get any planning though.

[Rinso]

I don't really think she's mad, and she's stupid only in certain aspects, and there is no realistic way for her to be anything but inexperienced. I think that with her the problem isn't so much a matter of sanity or intelligence, as it is about pride, combined incredibly with naivety and pig-headedness. She is almost Stannis-like in her "my way or the highway" mentality, but due to her lack for experience - not only as a ruler, but at a basic human level - she's capable of brewing disasters of epical proportions. The worst thing is that, at her core, she's really not a bad person but at this point she's frighteningly incompetent and when a person like that gets a lot of power things like the Meereenese Knot happen.