New Series High

[Stonehearted Snake]

I have nothing to back this up other than anecdotes - but I also wonder if people are more inclined to binge-watch a show towards the end of the season as well. If people thought episode 1 and 2 were slow, well, it doesn't matter as much when you can immediately watch several of the episodes that follow. But like I said - no evidence, just wondering.

[Faint]

Well, if the ratings do not recover for the fifth episode, then the show has definitively plateaued.

[boojam]

I have nothing to back this up other than anecdotes - but I also wonder if people are more inclined to binge-watch a show towards the end of the season as well. If people thought episode 1 and 2 were slow, well, it doesn't matter as much when you can immediately watch several of the episodes that follow. But like I said - no evidence, just wondering.

I thought I read that HBO could capture DVR viewings , I know they don't like binge watching during the season but can they capture 'binges'?

[toffeejay]

I think after ep5 it will creep up again. By the end of the season it could be as high as 8.5 but I doubt it and have the feeling it will be a around the 8.0 mark at best.

Next week may even be lower. Certainly the leaks have had an impact:

1. It was only announced a couple of hours before the first screening, a lot of people may not have know before ep 1 - hence it affecting ep 2 and 3.

2. I think even those who did know may have thought no I won't download but then watched ep 1 and couldn't resist. Probably regretting it now then having to wait another 4 weeks for a new one!

[Faint]

It looks like I was wrong. The ratings actually decreased somewhat this week. I overestimated the effects of piracy on episodes two through four. It seems the television show has actually peaked. It will be interesting to see whether it ever reaches eight million initial viewers again or whether that represents the high water mark.

[Noelle Snow]

I don't know how much they're taking in DVR viewings and such but I assume that's all in there. But let's also keep in mind that Sunday was Mother's Day.

[marsyao]

It looks like I was wrong. The ratings actually decreased somewhat this week. I overestimated the effects of piracy on episodes two through four. It seems the television show has actually peaked. It will be interesting to see whether it ever reaches eight million initial viewers again or whether that represents the high water mark.

I guess that is because the last episode "The sons of Harpy" is the worst episode ever in the game of thrones series, its effect makes it to last Sunday

[Cas Stark]

It looks like I was wrong. The ratings actually decreased somewhat this week. I overestimated the effects of piracy on episodes two through four. It seems the television show has actually peaked. It will be interesting to see whether it ever reaches eight million initial viewers again or whether that represents the high water mark.

I'd say it has peaked for this season, there are no big events coming that I can imagine would bring back a million viewers. Maybe if the HBO hype machine goes into full over drive or Winds finally comes out next year they can get that viewership back for the opener of season 6.

I think we might even see more decline by the end, possibly an uptick for the last two episodes. We'll see.

It's their own fault, the first episode was terrible. IMO

[Faint]

I don't know how much they're taking in DVR viewings and such but I assume that's all in there. But let's also keep in mind that Sunday was Mother's Day.

This is strictly initial television viewers. DVR, streaming and other types of viewers are reported later.

I am a little hesitant to attribute any sort of drop off to Mother's Day. The episode airs at night and I am not remembering there being any such effect in earlier seasons.

[AryaNymeriaVisenya]

I'd say it has peaked for this season, there are no big events coming that I can imagine would bring back a million viewers. Maybe if the HBO hype machine goes into full over drive or Winds finally comes out next year they can get that viewership back for the opener of season 6.

I think we might even see more decline by the end, possibly an uptick for the last two episodes. We'll see.

It's their own fault, the first episode was terrible. IMO

I think last season was really well balanced, having the premiere, then Joffrey's demise, then keeping the momentum up throughout the 10 episodes. In comparison these 5 have been really quite seriously boring. But then, I'm an Arya fan and she has only been in 2 of them in which she did some brushing up, pest control and undertaking. So maybe I would find them boring. Maybe Cersei fans are having a hoot and a half. Stannis, Jon and Shireen have really been holding episodes for me.

[Cas Stark]

I think last season was really well balanced, having the premiere, then Joffrey's demise, then keeping the momentum up throughout the 10 episodes. In comparison these 5 have been really quite seriously boring. But then, I'm an Arya fan and she has only been in 2 of them in which she did some brushing up, pest control and undertaking. So maybe I would find them boring. Maybe Cersei fans are having a hoot and a half. Stannis, Jon and Shireen have really been holding episodes for me.

Think back on that killer premier episode last year. And then compare it to this year's lame effort.

Also, it's hard to explain but last year's story arcs were more clear in terms of where they were going. Joff's creating mayhem and he's going to get married, and you see how the Tyrells are strategizing. Arya and the Hound are trying to get to the Vale. Tyrion was in jail for several episodes, that story went all the way through the season. You had the great intro of Pedro Pascal. Dany stuff was moving along.

This year, what do we have? Jamie is supposed to be going to get Mycella, but hasn't done anything much and we're halfway through. There is no tension in Dany story. Cersei is going nowhere...there's no sense of any strategy she has or even that she's ruling or making mistakes...she shows up here and there, cat fights w/Marg or whatever, there is no sense of story. Arya went to Braavos and disappeared.

The only stories that seem to be moving 1,2,3 are the Wall and the hellish Sansa story, everything else is just random stuff that occurs here and there w/no sense of purpose.

[boojam]

It looks like I was wrong. The ratings actually decreased somewhat this week. I overestimated the effects of piracy on episodes two through four. It seems the television show has actually peaked. It will be interesting to see whether it ever reaches eight million initial viewers again or whether that represents the high water mark.

Set a new piracy record tho, if HBO could only capture those!

What about HBO's own totaling system? Never saw the final final one of those, and the one for Ep2 should have been done by now.

[El Guapo]

Set a new piracy record tho, if HBO could only capture those!

What about HBO's own totaling system? Never saw the final final one of those, and the one for Ep2 should have been done by now.

Yeah I have been waiting for those as well as that will give a better idea where the show is at this point. The piracy record for last episode is pretty telling as well.

[Cas Stark]

The audience numbers for viewing the first run episode is measuring apples to apples, it's a consistent measurement and it shows that the leaked episodes were not the cause of the drop off, because the predicted resurgence in numbers did not materialize, instead, slightly fewer people watched ep. 5 than ep. 4. GOT has always been heavily pirated, yet the number of viewers watching the first run episodes has continually climbed.

[El Guapo]

The audience numbers for viewing the first run episode is measuring apples to apples, it's a consistent measurement and it shows that the leaked episodes were not the cause of the drop off, because the predicted resurgence in numbers did not materialize, instead, slightly fewer people watched ep. 5 than ep. 4. GOT has always been heavily pirated, yet the number of viewers watching the first run episodes has continually climbed.

No shit. Nobody is arguing that the first run episode rating are down. But that doesn't tell the full ratings story for that you need the final numbers. As far as piracy goes, yes it has always been heavily pirated but the fact of the matter episode 5 shattered the old record and was the most pirated show in the history of television. That to me is interesting.

[toffeejay]

Shocked at how bad that figure is (yeah I know 6 and a half million is amazing for HBO and still in the top ten ratings for GOT!) to lose 1 and a half million on the first episode?

Thought it would have been much higher than the eps 2, 3 and 4. Very surprised by that.

[Faint]

The show was always likely to reach saturation point. The list of shows that kept on rising until the end is so small it is almost mythical, although there are a few notable examples (i.e, Breaking Bad).

[Kairos]

I also believe that the show has reached saturation point, but I would like to point out that there was always a drop in viewers for the episodes broadcast around the second weekend of May.

Season 3:

3x06 The Climb (May 5, 2013) -> 5.50 million viewers

3x07 The Bear and the Maiden Fair (May 12, 2013) -> 4.84 million viewers

Season 4:

4x05 First of His Name (May 4, 2014) -> 7.16 million viewers

4x06 The Laws of Gods and Men (May 11, 2014) -> 6.40 million viewers

In both instances the ratings went up again after the drop. So maybe this will also be the case for season 5.

[Mr Fixit]

Think back on that killer premier episode last year. And then compare it to this year's lame effort.

Also, it's hard to explain but last year's story arcs were more clear in terms of where they were going. Joff's creating mayhem and he's going to get married, and you see how the Tyrells are strategizing. Arya and the Hound are trying to get to the Vale. Tyrion was in jail for several episodes, that story went all the way through the season. You had the great intro of Pedro Pascal. Dany stuff was moving along.

This year, what do we have? Jamie is supposed to be going to get Mycella, but hasn't done anything much and we're halfway through. There is no tension in Dany story. Cersei is going nowhere...there's no sense of any strategy she has or even that she's ruling or making mistakes...she shows up here and there, cat fights w/Marg or whatever, there is no sense of story. Arya went to Braavos and disappeared.

The only stories that seem to be moving 1,2,3 are the Wall and the hellish Sansa story, everything else is just random stuff that occurs here and there w/no sense of purpose.

Well, to be honest, the show is constrained by the pacing of the source material here. Take a look at the first half of AFfC/ADwD and you'll see that almost nothing of consequence happens: Tyrion is enjoying his boat ride, Sam is enjoying his boat ride, Quentyn is enjoying his boat ride, Cersei is, well... Cersei, Jon is making sure there's enough meat'n'potatoes for the coming Winter, Dany is embroiled in what is probably the most disliked storyline of the books, Jaime is wandering the Riverlands, Brienne is wandering the Riverlands, Sansa is chilling in the Vale, Sand Snakes are busy being campy as hell, Ironborn are busy being even more campy as hell, etc, etc, etc ad nauseam.

Jokes aside, for the majority of the last two books virtually nothing happens in something like 80-90% of storylines. Pace only picks up towards the end of the books. You said it yourself: what, in your opinion, are the only storylines that show definite forward plot movement? The Wall and Sansa? Sansa is completely reworked from the books and even Jon had added material that wasn't in ADwD - Stannis's offer and LC election that was in ASoS.

In short, the show is slow and uneventful because the source material is slow and uneventful. In fact, all these deviations we have in the current season have prevented the show from being even more interminably slow and uneventful!

That said, with the exception of Episode 1, which really was overly plodding, I found the rest of the season to be of surprisingly good quality. A slow burn, sure, but a very well crafted slow burn. I don't think it is in any way weaker than previous seasons (once we take into account the narrative problems with Feast and Dance).

[Cas Stark]

Well, to be honest, the show is constrained by the pacing of the source material here. Take a look at the first half of AFfC/ADwD and you'll see that almost nothing of consequence happens: Tyrion is enjoying his boat ride, Sam is enjoying his boat ride, Quentyn is enjoying his boat ride, Cersei is, well... Cersei, Jon is making sure there's enough meat'n'potatoes for the coming Winter, Dany is embroiled in what is probably the most disliked storyline of the books, Jaime is wandering the Riverlands, Brienne is wandering the Riverlands, Sansa is chilling in the Vale, Sand Snakes are busy being campy as hell, Ironborn are busy being even more campy as hell, etc, etc, etc ad nauseam.

Jokes aside, for the majority of the last two books virtually nothing happens in something like 80-90% of storylines. Pace only picks up towards the end of the books. You said it yourself: what, in your opinion, are the only storylines that show definite forward plot movement? The Wall and Sansa? Sansa is completely reworked from the books and even Jon had added material that wasn't in ADwD - Stannis's offer and LC election that was in ASoS.

In short, the show is slow and uneventful because the source material is slow and uneventful. In fact, all these deviations we have in the current season have prevented the show from being even more interminably slow and uneventful!

That said, with the exception of Episode 1, which really was overly plodding, I found the rest of the season to be of surprisingly good quality. A slow burn, sure, but a very well crafted slow burn. I don't think it is in any way weaker than previous seasons (once we take into account the narrative problems with Feast and Dance).

The show is not constrained by the pacing of the source material. It's TV. The two books have plenty enough action for 10 hours of TV. The problem with pacing is a show problem, and the show is free to also borrow ahead beyond the books to bring some plots to closure, so there really is no excuse for the plodding, unfocused season we have seen so far, especially with the massive cuts of several stories.

Cersei's story should work very, very well for TV, but it's a mess of invented stupidity and random dialogue.

They're doing okay with Jon and Dany's stories, but still, pacing is off, lack of tension, some things are rushed and lack of set up.

They can move Arya's story forward however they want to.

They did a huge build up of Dorne and so far, nothing really.

The Sansa story may work for TV only viewers, but it is so stupid I have trouble relating to it.

I thought really all of the episodes were sub par, ep 3 was okay, and the last one, ep. 5 was much better than the others. 1 & 4 were pretty bad. 1 atrocious.