Septa Lemore identity (and why it matters) v.2

[ViserionsFire]

You are correct, it could have been Illyrio slowing Barristan down, but we never hear about Barristan talking about Illyrio. If he chilled at Illyrio's house for two months, he should known him better and know not to trust him.

The only way Barristan would know anything about Illyrio is because he attended the Small Council meetings and heard of Illyrio sheltering Viserys and Dany. With Jorah spying for Illyrio and Varys, he would have told about events concerning Viserys and later about Drogo and the hatching of Dragons. Word would have gone out that Jhaqo became the leader of Drogos's kalasar and that Dany was not with him. So, Illyrio may have thought that Dany couldn't survive the Red Waste and convinced Barristan that Dany was on the way to Qarth in order to get Barristan out of the way.

But if Varys and Illyrio are working together, why would Varys even mention Illyrio to the Small Council? Illyrio's protecting and aiding the Targaryen heir would have put Illyrio in the crosshairs of Robert's vengeance if Lancel hadn't offed him. Why Varys informs the Small Council about Illyrio is a mystery to me.

[Skinchanging Sweetrobin]

The only way Barristan would know anything about Illyrio is because he attended the Small Council meetings and heard of Illyrio sheltering Viserys and Dany. With Jorah spying for Illyrio and Varys, he would have told about events concerning Viserys and later about Drogo and the hatching of Dragons. Word would have gone out that Jhaqo became the leader of Drogos's kalasar and that Dany was not with him. So, Illyrio may have thought that Dany couldn't survive the Red Waste and convinced Barristan that Dany was on the way to Qarth in order to get Barristan out of the way.

But if Varys and Illyrio are working together, why would Varys even mention Illyrio to the Small Council? Illyrio's protecting and aiding the Targaryen heir would have put Illyrio in the crosshairs of Robert's vengeance if Lancel hadn't offed him. Why Varys informs the Small Council about Illyrio is a mystery to me.

At some point in AGOT, Robert mentions that he can't get to Viserys because he is at Illyrio's house. So, at some point Varys did mention it to the small council.

Varys seems to balance "doing his job" with undermining his boss.

So, I guess from the small council, Barristan figured out where Viserys was and went knocking on Illyrio's door. But the timeline remains funny as do Barristan's motives. Barristan wants to serve Viserys who he knows is crazy, but is reluctant to serve Damy who only might be crazy.

[SerKurt]

Is there any way Lemore might be Lyanna?

[Urien the Ragged]

Is there any way Lemore might be Lyanna?

I've thought the same thing. I doubt it, what tells me no is that Lyanna worshiped the old gods and Lemore appears to be genuinely devout in the faith of the 7.

[SerKurt]

I've thought the same thing. I doubt it, what tells me no is that Lyanna worshiped the old gods and Lemore appears to be genuinely devout in the faith of the 7.

[SerKurt]

Yeh i guess... Could easily be a cover though? Plus she doesnt exactly follow the whole Septa thing too strictly

[Ygrain]

Is there any way Lemore might be Lyanna?

Ned recalls Lyanna dying while he was holding her hand, so, no.

[Giant of Tarth]

There is a Septa mentioned who had a child-a Sand Snake child.

[corbon]

There is a Septa mentioned who had a child-a Sand Snake child.

The child, Tyene is a blue-eyed blonde. Oberyn Martell has black hair and eyes. Septa Lemore has dark hair. That makes it unlikely, though not impossible.

Further, Arianne Martell remembers visiting Tyene's mother in Westeros (crossing the Mander). Again, its not impossible, but unlikely. Lemore seems to have been around for a while, possibly even longer than JonCon, who didn't met fAegon until he was 5 years or so old.

Most importantly, there is nothing in such a 'mystery' of any real interest or import that anyone has been able to come up with.

[Hippocras]

My current, but not rigid list of favorite contenders:

1. Ashara. If she is ever going to be significant, and worth being in the books in the first place, this is how it makes by far the most sense for her to appear. I know people dispute this and claim it is impossible for various reasons, but seriously...how else is Ashara ever going to be relevant?

2. Jeyne Swann's septa, rescued by Barristan Selmy from the Kingswood Brotherhood. If not Ashara, this identity for Lemore ALSO provides a plausible reason why Varys and Illyrio sent BS to Daenerys instead of Aegon. No other proposed identities for Lemore achieve this.

3. Wylla the wetnurse. Much less interesting as a candidate than Ashara, but at least she is connected to the story in some way. She may even have been Daenerys's wetnurse as well.

4. Mellario, Tyene's mom, and any other candidates I would rank as big disappointments because they centre too much on ONLY the Dornish storyline and no other.

[Endymion I Targaryen]

Ashara seems possible to me.Varys and Illyrio have chosen Jon Connighton and Ashara Dayne to raise Aegon so as to prove others he is real(If people from Rhaegar & Elia's environment believe Aegon is real then it easier for others to believe it).But Lemore's eyes are not described at all so as to know if they are purple like Ashara's.

[Jay21]

If Aegon isn't really Faegon then I think Lenore has to be Asmara Dane. I don't buy the her and Howland Reed theories just because that would have been a wedge between H and Ned and clearly none existed.

If he's Faegon though, whsts Ashara's interest? More likely she's Jon's mom in that case I think.

[Hippocras]

If Aegon isn't really Faegon then I think Lenore has to be Asmara Dane. I don't buy the her and Howland Reed theories just because that would have been a wedge between H and Ned and clearly none existed.If he's Faegon though, whsts Ashara's interest? More likely she's Jon's mom in that case I think.

If he is fAegon he may be her own son, or a Dayne relative. She is not Jon's mom.

[Jay21]

If he is fAegon he may be her own son, or a Dayne relative. She is not Jon's mom.

I'm sure she's not too. At the same time though if I was an author and I saw 15years of R+L=J posted in various places online, I would probably change that even if it was my original intent.

[Urien the Ragged]

Nothing is mentioned on the fate of Wenda. She's my favorite at this point. Does Lemore have big breasteses?

[Hippocras]

I don't get the Wenda thing. Why is Wenda the least bit relevant to current events?

[JonBranRickon]

Ashara seems the likely but he would have to be the real Aegon.

[Hippocras]

Ashara seems the likely but he would have to be the real Aegon.

Not true. See above.

And even if he is no relation Ashara is Dornish and if Aegon is actually part of a Dornish conspiracy she could be doing what she is out of the same desire for revenge as the Martells.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

I'm sure she's not too. At the same time though if I was an author and I saw 15years of R+L=J posted in various places online, I would probably change that even if it was my original intent.

He has said that he isn't going to do it.

However, now, those 10.000 people use the Internet and read the right theories. They say: “Oh God, the butler did it!”, to use an example of a mystery novel. Then, you think: “I have to change the ending! The maiden would be the criminal!” To my mind that way is a disaster because if you are doing well you work, the books are full of clues that point to the butler doing it and help you to figure up the butler did it, but if you change the ending to point the maiden, the clues make no sense anymore; they are wrong or are lies, and I am not a liar. http://www.adriasnews.com/2012/10/george-r-r-martin-interview.html

[bent branch]

Ashara seems the likely but he would have to be the real Aegon.

I agree with you. I hadn't given a lot of thought to who Septa Lemore might be although it is obvious she is someone. Having been convinced by several different threads that Lemore is indeed Ashara, I realize that it answers several questions. One of these is why did JonCon believe that Aegon was Rhaegar's son based solely on the word of Varys and Illyrio, two men he obvious distrusts and despises. If Lemore is Ashara, it is probably she who convinced JonCon of Aegon's legitimacy. This also strongly suggests that Lemore has been with Aegon longer than JonCon, perhaps since the beginning. Although some people think that it Lemore can be Ashara and Aegon not be Rhaegar's son, this scenario is incredibly unlikely.

The one thing that too few people take into account when speculating about Lemore is JonCon's trust of these people. He absolutely trusts the loyalty of Lemore, Haldon and Duck (even while doubting their competency). Why would JonCon trust Mellario, Tyene's mother or Wenda? None of these people have a loyalty to the Targaryens.