Russellstiltskin Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 It just recently occurred to me that Jon Snow and Danaerys both came into the world through violent births that led to their mother's deaths. I happened across a theory that mentioned the similarities between the two characters, but didn't mention that one. It got me thinking about how Moqorro (IIRC) told Tyrion he figured prominently in his dragon dream. Tywin tells him "...since I cannot prove you are not mine," and Selmy tells Danaerys about the "liberties" Aerys took during the bedding ceremony at Tywin's wedding. THIS DOES NOT MEAN I THINK TYRION WAS SIRED BY AERYS AT TYWIN'S WEDDING. I wondered about Tyrion's dragonriding potential and thought about whether a dragonrider had to be a Targ, and if so, what are similarities between him and the two that seem to be most likely to hop aboard a dragon. It occurred to me that if Tyrion is a Targ bastard, as some have suggested (saw the theory title but didn't read it) he also came into the world the same way as Jon and Dany. Maybe the post-Targaryen dynasty dragonriders must be born this way, through sacrifice of one or both of their parents...though all three of their fathers were murdered as well (even if Tywin is Tyrion's sire.) If Aegon is legitimate, I suppose his mother died somewhat shortly after childbirth as well though obviously under different circumstances; though if Aegon is legitimate there's really no reason to argue that Tyrion may be one of the Three Heads. Obviously just a guess, but I'm bored and it occurred to me, so go easy on a noob :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 If Aegon is legitimate, his mother died one year after his birth. Maybe the post-Targaryen dynasty dragonriders must be born this way, through sacrifice of one or both of their parents...though all three of their fathers were murdered as well (even if Tywin is Tyrion's sire.) TBH, doesn't make much sense to me. We have seen Targaryen riders and some of their mothers were alive and well. As for why some mothers died during childbirth, well (1) medieval setting and (2) plot reasons Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russellstiltskin Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 Really? lol Admitted, admitted. However, I've been theorizing about the three heads for awhile and I felt like I was on to something with these three, and some kind of hereditary blood magic. But I barely slept and didn't even remember about Aegon being one. I knew that! I swear...but as far as he goes I've wondered for awhile how Varys would get his hands on Aegon during such a perilous time, and I've often wondered if it was an idea he had after RR. I need WoW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jojen Lebowski Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Why Tyrion, or Targaryens at all? Dany doesn't seem to feel that she needs Targaryens, just people she can trust... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Greg of House House Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Yes, I've said that a lot of times. I'm not saying I'm sure that Tyrion is a Targ bastard, but I feel most people underestimate the fact that the mothers of three of arguably the most important characters died exactly in the same way. And we know that blood magic, apparently necessary to bring dragons/magic/whatever back to the world, relies a lot on blood sacrifice. People say it's just a fantasy cliché to deprive the (anti)heroic outcasts of their mothers. That's ok. But they could've died in other ways. That Jon, Dany and Tyrion are connected like that should make us at least suspicious (specially since the first two are confirmerd targs). I mean... Tyrion is even going to the dragons now. But it doesn't matter. Most people hate the Tyrion is a Targ idea, it's not a popular theory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russellstiltskin Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 No, he was born after the Lannister twins, but it gives an indication of both Aerys' feelings towards Joanna and the lengths he will go through to act on them. I never would have thought so (about Tyrion dragonriding,) and I admit there's hardly overwhelming evidence, but the dragon dream and the death of the all three mothers in the same way got me thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jojen Lebowski Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 So, I guess Tyrion should probably start designing a special saddle with a high back so he can safely go dragonriding, eh? :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russellstiltskin Posted May 10, 2014 Author Share Posted May 10, 2014 A dragonsaddle with a goblet-holder, preferably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 Why Tyrion, or Targaryens at all? Dany doesn't seem to feel that she needs Targaryens, just people she can trust... GRRM said the third head doesn't have to be a Targaryen. Kind of implies that the other two both are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Barristan the Badass Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 I really don't want Tyrion to be a Targaryen, I think it would be too ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oursisthefury69 Posted May 10, 2014 Share Posted May 10, 2014 LMAO @Leap "When I say I don't think Tyrion is a head of the dragon, I mean I dont think he's one of the three protagonists, not that he wont ride a dragon" Wow, just wow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted May 11, 2014 Share Posted May 11, 2014 Tyrion is like the deuteragonist of a classical play. The deuteragonist would bounce between the protagonist, Daenerys in this second Dance, and the antagonist, Aegon. But Jon is the third head, not Tyrion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thezhgguy Posted May 14, 2014 Share Posted May 14, 2014 The "liberties" Aegon took with Joanna couldn't have produced Tyrion because he was not the first born and that happened on Tywin and Joanna's wedding night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melisandros Megas Posted May 14, 2014 Share Posted May 14, 2014 GRRM said the third head doesn't have to be a Targaryen. Kind of implies that the other two both are.Implied means nothing in grrmish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Russellstiltskin Posted May 16, 2014 Author Share Posted May 16, 2014 I get when the incident Ser Barristan is referring to happened, but it's still indicative of his desire and his self-control. In writing this, I was thinking about if the dragonriders do have to be Targ, then how can Tyrion fit in? It always seemd an odd mention by Selmy as well, and it hadn't previously occurred to me that both Dany's and Jon Snow's (as well as Tyrion's) mothers had died after giving birth to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady Blizzardborn Posted May 18, 2014 Share Posted May 18, 2014 I get when the incident Ser Barristan is referring to happened, but it's still indicative of his desire and his self-control. In writing this, I was thinking about if the dragonriders do have to be Targ, then how can Tyrion fit in? It always seemd an odd mention by Selmy as well, and it hadn't previously occurred to me that both Dany's and Jon Snow's (as well as Tyrion's) mothers had died after giving birth to them. Whether Tyrion is half-Targ/one-third-Targ or not, he could have Targ blood through a Plumm ancestor. The other Lannisters aren't bookish so they likely wouldn't even realize that a Plumm ancestor would have Targ blood. I don't think anyone has ever claimed that Aerys' "liberties" included sleeping with the bride. If he'd tried that the groom would have killed him. But it leaves the door open to the idea that Aerys might have tried something with Joanna years later. Clearly Aerys wanted her and had no problem letting even Tywin know it. Care to explain what's so amusing? Maybe the fact that you don't think the guy with the most POV chapters is one of the protagonists? Or that you don't equate being a head of the dragon with riding one. Personally I agree that the dragons can be ridden by "non-head of the dragon" people. Dragons can have more than one rider in their lifetime. Chances are high that at least one dragonrider will die, leaving his or her dragon open for a new rider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingOfTheRock Posted May 18, 2014 Share Posted May 18, 2014 The Dragonriders don't have to be Targaryens, so I hope Tyrion remains a Lannister but is still a Dragonrider. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kinkslayer Posted May 18, 2014 Share Posted May 18, 2014 The only multiple headed Dragon was Maelys the monstrous, and that didn't end well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallTyrionLannister Posted May 18, 2014 Share Posted May 18, 2014 Tyrion is quite a bit younger than Cersei and Jamie, so it doesn't make sense for him to be born as the result of anything that would have happened on Tywin's wedding night. I think Aegon is legit, tbh. Sorry, kiddos, but the writing is on the wall. Martin loves to fuck with us, but there's no way he's going to pull a "What's that!? Another Targ! LOL JK HES A FAKE". That's just bad writing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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