Lets crank up the exitement, compare Drogo vs Robert as men

[Universal Sword Donor]

No, your argument is invalid and slightly racist. so only white feudal society takes skills to lead? Yeah, good luck with that outlook. Plus, Robert was shit king with no skills in politics or economics.

What exactly did Drogo do to lead his horde? He pointed them the direction they were going to go and led them in fights.

He didn't codify laws. Precedent was "the strongest takes he wants, unless my wife says otherwise."

He does have to deal with economic issues. Need money? Kill a bunch of people and take their money.

He doesn't have to deal with food issues. See above and the women handle the food distribution and cooking

It's a pretty simple comparison. Robert might be a shit king, but let's just swap the two for a second.

Is Robert, in fighting condition, going to be a capable leader of Drogo's horde? It's pretty safe to say yes. In fact, if you just described characters personalities, he would sound exactly like Drogo but on the wrong continent.

If Drogo was king of Westeros, how well do you think he'd rule? He can't read or write. He knows nothing of agriculture, economics, or politics. His closest allies are the exact same. He would be far worse.

[The Traveler]

The second half of this statement is exactly what you suggested the first time so I'm not going to respond to the actual contradictory points you're putting forth.

Nope, what I suggested the first time (and that you did not seem to understand) was what I later explained in the first half of that statement (which you preferred not to mention): What I said is both lack such subtle skills, but unlike Robert, Drogo didn't need them.

So if you read really really carefully, and try not to read words that were never written, you might notice that I never suggested that. I never said that some ruling system was better than the others nor that some ruling system was proper to some race. But i know someone who did suggest that feudal societies were white (and thus, tribal societies are for the non white):

so only white feudal society takes skills to lead?

Also would you please point out the part in my first comment where i suggested "exactly" the second half of the second comment. I tried really hard to find the contradictory points I am putting forth, but i failed each time :(

[Wavey Sauce]

What exactly did Drogo do to lead his horde? He pointed them the direction they were going to go and led them in fights.

He didn't codify laws. Precedent was "the strongest takes he wants, unless my wife says otherwise."

He does have to deal with economic issues. Need money? Kill a bunch of people and take their money.

He doesn't have to deal with food issues. See above and the women handle the food distribution and cooking

It's a pretty simple comparison. Robert might be a shit king, but let's just swap the two for a second.

Is Robert, in fighting condition, going to be a capable leader of Drogo's horde? It's pretty safe to say yes. In fact, if you just described characters personalities, he would sound exactly like Drogo but on the wrong continent.

If Drogo was king of Westeros, how well do you think he'd rule? He can't read or write. He knows nothing of agriculture, economics, or politics. His closest allies are the exact same. He would be far worse.

This.

Shit majority of the stuff Drogo has was because he fought people with no weapons or went to a city and took gifts to prevent a fight.

Rob would whoop his ass to, Rob still commanded respect as a fatass, the second Drogo couldnt ride a horse he was looked at as less a man (tradition or not)

[Queen.Sansa.Lannister]

Honestly I don't see much difference between either of them. Drogo at least respected his wife (after a while).

[LordStoneheart]

Ifs and buts...

Drogo wasn't king of Westeros and Robert wasn't a Khal. Hypotheticals tell us nothing substantial. If I wanted hypotheticals I'd go to fanfic.net.

Fact. Drogo was a good Khal. Fact Robert was a terrible king. In their respective societies, Drogo was much more successful than that joke Robert.That was my point.

Robert was a king. Drogo lead a tribe. You do not need skills in politics or economics to lead Dothrakis; so your argument is invalid.

I am taking issue with this. The suggestion that tribal society takes no skills in politics or economics. this reeks of a western-centric view on society, which is why I called your post slightly racist. Did I offend you? Sorry. But you did suggest that Robert merely being a king was better than Drogo leading a tribe with no context. Context is important.

For example, di I just imagine that a big wedding took place at Pentos with no big war destroying and pillaging of said city? No. Obviously there is a certain amount of diplomacy that Drogo employed, or else the marriage to Daenerys probably wouldn't have taken place.

[The Traveler]

Honestly I don't see much difference between either of them. Drogo at least respected his wife (after a while).

That's because he did not marry Cersei :p

[Sir Lee knot]

By modern standards of course Robert. Not even a question.

By Westerosi standards it's still Robert easily. But that's the problem. It depends who's society you are asking. If you ask the Dothraki or Ghiscari culture they'll probably tell you that it's Drogo.

This is is like asking who is a faster runner a dog or a snake. Or who is a faster swimmer a Polar Bear or a shark.

What exactly did Drogo do to lead his horde? He pointed them the direction they were going to go and led them in fights.

He didn't codify laws. Precedent was "the strongest takes he wants, unless my wife says otherwise."

He does have to deal with economic issues. Need money? Kill a bunch of people and take their money.

He doesn't have to deal with food issues. See above and the women handle the food distribution and cooking

It's a pretty simple comparison. Robert might be a shit king, but let's just swap the two for a second.

Is Robert, in fighting condition, going to be a capable leader of Drogo's horde? It's pretty safe to say yes. In fact, if you just described characters personalities, he would sound exactly like Drogo but on the wrong continent.

If Drogo was king of Westeros, how well do you think he'd rule? He can't read or write. He knows nothing of agriculture, economics, or politics. His closest allies are the exact same. He would be far worse.

Stop trying to dumb down leadership.

Khal Drogo was clearly a very charismatic and great leader. He is basically like Shaka Zulu. He united other Khalasars until he ended up with the biggest in the Dothraki sea, possibly in history as well.

The fact is, given the knowledge each of them had about each others culture they'd both be shit leaders if switched.

Khal Drogo like you said, can't read or write and knows nothing about running a Kingdom or how to keep friendly relations with lords but at the same time Robert knows nothing about Dothraki customs. They'd quickly lose respect for him and the people would start leaving in droves.

I am taking issue with this. The suggestion that tribal society takes no skills in politics or economics. this reeks of a western-centric view on society, which is why I called your post slightly racist. Did I offend you? Sorry. But you did suggest that Robert merely being a king was better than Drogo leading a tribe with no context. Context is important.

For example, di I just imagine that a big wedding took place at Pentos with no big war destroying and pillaging of said city? No. Obviously there is a certain amount of diplomacy that Drogo employed, or else the marriage to Daenerys probably wouldn't have taken place.

Yep basically. 40,0000 active warriors, over 100,000 people. He lead more people then some Kingdoms.

[Universal Sword Donor]

Stop trying to dumb down leadership.

Khal Drogo was clearly a very charismatic and great leader. He is basically like Shaka Zulu. He united other Khalasars until he ended up with the biggest in the Dothraki sea, possibly in history as well.

The fact is, given the knowledge each of them had about each others culture they'd both be shit leaders if switched.

Khal Drogo like you said, can't read or write and knows nothing about running a Kingdom or how to keep friendly relations with lords but at the same time Robert knows nothing about Dothraki customs. They'd quickly lose respect for him and the people would start leaving in droves.

This should be painfully obvious, but customs can be learned fairly quickly. The ability to read, write, do math, learn how to rule, et al takes a bit longer. Drogo united Khalasars by beating them. "The Dothraki follow only the strong"

What would Robert do to offend them? He literally tells Ned all he wants to do is fight, drink, and whore.

The disparate level of complexity between the two is staggering. You can't even pretend it's not. I also totally forgot that the Dothraki don't build anything. That means Drogo has literally no concept of infrastructure creation and maintenance.

[Jasta11]

Robert achieved more in his life I think. He went from a Great Lord to a King, and while it was mostly thanks to circumstances and allies, he was also talented at making said allies in the first place, and he fought very hard in the War. Sure, after he became a drunk good for nothing, but we can't deny he did a lot prior to that, and hell he still kept the Realm in peace, if not in prosperity, and everyone had great sport events and parties so that's something.

Drogo did unite a giant army, which must not have been easy. But he didn't do much with it, all things considered. Before the attempted assassination, he went on doing what Khals do, this being not much but run around the Sea pillaging villages and taking/selling slaves. After he took on a far more ambitious project... and got killed after his first on-page battle.

As far as morals go, well, Robert without question, he didn't sell slaves and run around pillaging for the lulz, or to pay for an invasion. Drogo was much better to Dany than Robet to Cercei, that's true, but something tells me that Drogo would have been far less tractable with a fiery woman like Cercei than with the insecure teenager that Dany was. He was definitely not the kind of husband you could slap and insult, that's for certain.

[Lord Damian]

Honestly I don't see much difference between either of them. Drogo at least respected his wife (after a while).

Well, there was a difference between Dany and Cersei, Cersei was an arrogant bitch who was already cheating with her twin brother and conspired from the beginning to put their incest babies on the throne. Dany on the other hand was terrified of her brother and Drogo and was afraid to protest as she submitted to her "husband". Dany was more honest and submissive to Drogo where as Cersei never was the same to Robert. Big difference.

[Sir Lee knot]

This should be painfully obvious, but customs can be learned fairly quickly. The ability to read, write, do math, learn how to rule, et al takes a bit longer. Drogo united Khalasars by beating them. "The Dothraki follow only the strong"

What would Robert do to offend them? He literally tells Ned all he wants to do is fight, drink, and whore.

The disparate level of complexity between the two is staggering. You can't even pretend it's not. I also totally forgot that the Dothraki don't build anything. That means Drogo has literally no concept of infrastructure creation and maintenance.

Does Robert know anything about leading a group of nomads? Does he know how to prevent in fighting in a Dothraki society, does he know the various rituals that a Khal has to perform to keep the respect of the people. He may not even be all that great a rider which kind of seals the deal. Rival Dothraki in his Khalasar would quickly recognize him as someone not worth his position.

[The Traveler]

Ifs and buts...

Drogo wasn't king of Westeros and Robert wasn't a Khal. Hypotheticals tell us nothing substantial. If I wanted hypotheticals I'd go to fanfic.net.

Fact. Drogo was a good Khal. Fact Robert was a terrible king. In their respective societies, Drogo was much more successful than that joke Robert.That was my point.

You're the kind of person who would "judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree" aren't you? Robert wasn't in his element. While both were good swimmers, at some point Robert had to climb a tree while Drogo kept on swimming.

What you cite sure are facts, but if you're interpreting them in a biased way, they're irrelevant. Drogo was better a Khal than Robert was a king (The same way that a goldfish is better a swimmer than a sailfish is a climber, which are also facts).

[LordStoneheart]

You're the kind of person who would "judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree" aren't you?

I'm not the kind of person to think of such nonsense in the first place. Analogies are not arguments, bud.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

Drogo was, apparently, smart. He was learning another language along with Dany. Robert... well. Robert fucked a lot. And drank a lot.

[Ellfoy]

OP you are asking for troubles.

Well if you want to go there : Drogo was at least faithful to the woman he loved, not fathering bastards all over Westeros when the girl he loved was according to him being raped ad eternam by an evil prince.

[Lord Damian]

I do not give the Dothraki a "pass" on their culture as "they do not know any better so we should not judge them too harshly". Believe it or not, it is amazing how many people feel that way in reading the books and the same in our modern word we live in. Crazy, huh? To some yes, others, it is "not their fault". Drogo was everything a Khal should be, a great killer, undoubtably he raped many many women and girls in his life and burned many huts and villages to the ground, captured slaves and stole treasures. We could also say, we cannot blame him for it as he was born into that culture and never knew much different. If we or Robert had been born into the Dothraki, would we turn out any different?

We should answer this question probably as this, Who would you rather see approaching you if you are a peasant farmer anywhere in Westeros or Essos. Robert with 20-30 bodyguards or Drogo with 20-30 bloodriders? Ask the same question if you are married and have a couple of kids or more and atleast one of them is a daughter 12 years or older? I says Robert anyday.

[Pod The Impaler]

Robert never took any slaves.

And Drogo was not a drunkard.

/thread.

[Universal Sword Donor]

Does Robert know anything about leading a group of nomads? Does he know how to prevent in fighting in a Dothraki society, does he know the various rituals that a Khal has to perform to keep the respect of the people. He may not even be all that great a rider which kind of seals the deal. Rival Dothraki in his Khalasar would quickly recognize him as someone not worth his position.

What particular nuances did Drogo exhibit? To put it frankly, there's not nearly as much for Robert to learn as Drogo. How do you prevent infighting? Kick the shit out of the people infighting. Robert is clearly a proficient warrior. I doubt he's going to have much problem or issue with cracking skulls and telling people what to do.

Him not being a great rider is an actual valid point, but he's clearly a competent rider. He can joust and fight on horseback. He doesn't give a shit about tournament jousting and loves the melee, but we know that you start on horseback in melees. The odds of him being rejected because of his riding skill are basically nil.

[Wavey Sauce]

Well, there was a difference between Dany and Cersei, Cersei was an arrogant bitch who was already cheating with her twin brother and conspired from the beginning to put their incest babies on the throne. Dany on the other hand was terrified of her brother and Drogo and was afraid to protest as she submitted to her "husband". Dany was more honest and submissive to Drogo where as Cersei never was the same to Robert. Big difference.

Not true. Yes in the past she messed around with Jaime. But when it was time to get married Cersei did love Robert and wanted to be with him, until first night he called her "Lyanna" and then would still go sleep with other chicks. If Robert would have been a good husband back Cersei wouldnt have any kids with Jaime, she was full on board being with Robert at first

[Universal Sword Donor]

Not true. Yes in the past she messed around with Jaime. But when it was time to get married Cersei did love Robert and wanted to be with him, until first night he called her "Lyanna" and then would still go sleep with other chicks. If Robert would have been a good husband back Cersei wouldnt have any kids with Jaime, she was full on board being with Robert at first

She had sex with Jaime on her wedding day.