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Arthur Dayne love?


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32 replies to this topic

#1 TallTyrionLannister

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 04:03 PM

I notice a lot of fan theories and a sizable fan base surrounding this one particular character who really isn't mentioned very much at all. Is there something I'm missing here? I haven't read the books in forever, mind you, perhaps I'm forgetting something that made him a particularly interesting character? 



#2 DipMeInGoldAndCallMeAegor

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 04:06 PM

Well, he was one of the three kingsguard that faced off against Eddard at the Tower of Joy, and he had the awesome title of "Sword of the Morning". He was also said to be one of the greatest knights that was alive at the time of The War of the Usurper.



#3 Mladen

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 04:07 PM

Arthur Dayne is named as the greatest swordsman of all time by quite substantial number of characters... Plus, he had a sword that is unique in every possible way.

 

As for love theories, there is nothing to support them. Some are crackpot and some are fanfic...



#4 Jankmaster

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 04:09 PM

Well, to me he's no Duncan the Tall in terms of chivalry but to others apparently they see him as one of the few True Knights in the series. I still wonder how anyone on the Mad King's Kingsguard could have that status after all the things they stood by and watched but IDK.

 

:dunno:



#5 Dornish Vinegar

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 04:12 PM

He was a great knight who is still remembered by the remaining great knights of Westeros with respect, he had a great title and a great sword, and above all, he said "Our knees do not bend easily" to a band of seven rebels in the middle of the desert, which is absolutely badass.



#6 ultimo12

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 04:13 PM

"Our knees do not bend easily"

 

i was sold after that.



#7 JonCon's Red Beard

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 04:16 PM

"I want that white sword of yours!"

"Then you shall have it, ser".

 

/sold and I take 20.



#8 TheOldWolf

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:01 PM

1. "Our knees do not bend easily"
2. Fights a psychotic knight in the Kingswood and allows him to get another sword and then kicks his ass
3. Has a sword made of a star!

All of those things=BADASS

#9 Liz Stargaryen

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:06 PM

He's badass, brave, "deadliest of the KG," has a sword named Dawn, nickname is Sword of the Morning, his sister was a heartbreaker, he's best friends with the Crown Prince... what's not to love? <3



#10 Winterfell is Burning

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:33 PM

I think fans have a tendency to overrate characters that are dead before the series starts and whose view is biased due to memories and time and underrate some characters that are alive and whose contradictions and shortcomings can be seen more clearly.

 

I mean, Dayne's cool, but he spent an entire war as a glorified sentry for a 15 year old girl we are not even 100% sure came and/or stayed willingly while she made love/was raped by the married and father of two crown Prince, all while technically commiting treason by not informing his location to the King (and don't try to argue otherwise- Aerys sent the White Bull to look for Lyanna for a reason) nor reporting for duty when he learned that a war started.

 

Imagine if Dayne had somehow survived the war and Barristan died in the Trident; we would hear about how the latter was the greatest swordsman of them all and Arthur could only beat him with Dawn, how Barry led troops for the Targaryens during the war and killed a dozen of Robert's friends in the Trident alone, being the greatest asset that the Targaryens had, and how every knight in the 7K wanted to be him when they grew up.

 

Meanwhile, Dayne would be remembered as the guy that was complicit in the act that started the entire war, and who was more loyal to his friend than to his vows. If he had killed Ned then, he'd be seen as a monster.


Edited by Winterfell is Burning, 08 June 2014 - 05:34 PM.


#11 MsLibby

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:41 PM

I think if the roles were reversed then Selmy wouldn't be remembered anywhere near as fondly as Dayne is.  Dayne just seems to be so much more of a man than Selmy ever was. At least in my opinion. 

 

I'd love to learn more about the fight between Ned and Danye. We know Ned won, but he didn't win honestly. I'd like to learn exactly what role Howland Reed played in that fight.


Edited by MsLibby, 08 June 2014 - 05:41 PM.


#12 OnlyOne

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:45 PM

I think if the roles were reversed then Selmy wouldn't be remembered anywhere near as fondly as Dayne is.  Dayne just seems to be so much more of a man than Selmy ever was. At least in my opinion. 
 
I'd love to learn more about the fight between Ned and Danye. We know Ned won, but he didn't win honestly. I'd like to learn exactly what role Howland Reed played in that fight.


My thoughts exactly:-)

#13 CosimaistheHottest

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:51 PM

I think fans have a tendency to overrate characters that are dead before the series starts and whose view is biased due to memories and time and underrate some characters that are alive and whose contradictions and shortcomings can be seen more clearly.
 
I mean, Dayne's cool, but he spent an entire war as a glorified sentry for a 15 year old girl we are not even 100% sure came and/or stayed willingly while she made love/was raped by the married and father of two crown Prince, all while technically commiting treason by not informing his location to the King (and don't try to argue otherwise- Aerys sent the White Bull to look for Lyanna for a reason) nor reporting for duty when he learned that a war started.
 
Imagine if Dayne had somehow survived the war and Barristan died in the Trident; we would hear about how the latter was the greatest swordsman of them all and Arthur could only beat him with Dawn, how Barry led troops for the Targaryens during the war and killed a dozen of Robert's friends in the Trident alone, being the greatest asset that the Targaryens had, and how every knight in the 7K wanted to be him when they grew up.
 
Meanwhile, Dayne would be remembered as the guy that was complicit in the act that started the entire war, and who was more loyal to his friend than to his vows. If he had killed Ned then, he'd be seen as a monster.

This!

#14 MsLibby

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 05:55 PM

I think that Dayne being "more loyal to his friend than his vows" is exactly what makes him such a great man.  Selmy is an excellent Knight but he served only for his own honour and not with the good of everyone in mind. He knew the Mad King was mad and had he been left behind at KL's the place would have burned.. His honour intact though! 

 

Dayne saw what was happening and did what was right instead of what was expected. I think that's the sign of a better man.



#15 natty bumppo

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 06:03 PM

True chivalry has been short in supply since the end of the Targaryen rule. It's only natural that the members of the last "real kingsgard" are remembered fondly. I guess Arthur Dayne was the most glamorous of the bunch, being from prominent noble family and a friend of Rhaegar. 



#16 John Hulboy

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 06:07 PM

If Arthur shows up with Howland Reed and reveals Jon is the king and swears his sword to Jon I will love him.if he dead and threw away his life an killed 5 of Ned's friends then set Arthur will get no love from me.

#17 Bedwyck

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 06:11 PM

Well, he is renown in Westeros as being a great knight/kingsguard.  Gerold Dayne however, seems to think he's overrated.  He asks why Arthur is the only Dayne people ever know.  There's probably some degree of jealousy there.  Its very possible that Darkstar's feelings of inadequacy when compared to Arthur are part of what drove to him to do something so drastic like attack Myrcella.  


Edited by Bedwyck, 08 June 2014 - 06:12 PM.


#18 CosimaistheHottest

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 06:24 PM

I think that Dayne being "more loyal to his friend than his vows" is exactly what makes him such a great man.  Selmy is an excellent Knight but he served only for his own honour and not with the good of everyone in mind. He knew the Mad King was mad and had he been left behind at KL's the place would have burned.. His honour intact though! 
 
Dayne saw what was happening and did what was right instead of what was expected. I think that's the sign of a better man.

But thats the thing from what we know Dayne did absolutely nothing. Winterfell is Burning is right. Dayne basically played sentry to a teenage girl while his royal family were being destroyed. We have no evidence that he actually tried to help save Westeros from the Mad Kings delusions while he was there. Even Rhaegar himself says he had hoped to do something not that he actually did anything besides the abduction. Same could be said for Dayne.

#19 Winterfell is Burning

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 06:37 PM

I think that Dayne being "more loyal to his friend than his vows" is exactly what makes him such a great man.  Selmy is an excellent Knight but he served only for his own honour and not with the good of everyone in mind. He knew the Mad King was mad and had he been left behind at KL's the place would have burned.. His honour intact though! 

 

Dayne saw what was happening and did what was right instead of what was expected. I think that's the sign of a better man.

 

Again, he spent an entire war that led to the deaths of the King, his wife (indirectly), his eldest son, his grandchildren and his daughter-in-law as a glorified sentry for a 15 year old girl that might even have not been there willingly. Where's the honor in that? How did Arthur Dayne helped his King or his cause? Or the Seven Kingdoms for that matter?

 

You say that Selmy would not be as fondly remembered, but you fail to provide any fact to present that. Barristan is already at least as respected as Arthur Dayne by the ASOIAF characters themselves.

 

And any complaint about Barristan's shortcomings comes from seeing his struggle to keep his vows, and he's the first to admit his failures in his POV. Had he died, we wouldn't have his POV.

 

If Dayne was alive, we would have his, with him undoubtedly remembering how he spent nearly a year listening to a 15 year old girl having sex/being raped by an older married man while the realm burned because of that, and with him doing nothing while his brave sworn brothers, like Barristan, fighting the war. And most of the failures to Barristan during Aerys' reign can't be attributed to him as well.


Edited by Winterfell is Burning, 08 June 2014 - 06:39 PM.


#20 MsLibby

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Posted 08 June 2014 - 06:53 PM

I've always felt that being a confidant of Rheagars, that Dayne would have known some of his ideas and feelings. The most important that it was through his line that The Prince Who was Promised might appear. That conviction would be more than enough reason for Dayne and the others to stay and guard Lyanna and the child.