Why Was Rowan So Offended?

[PripSoBot]

During ADWD Theon is with Rowan in the godswood at Winterfell when he mutters, "Winter is coming..." after reflecting on how icy the pool and heart tree had become. Rowan becomes offended and says, "You have no right to mouth Lord Eddard's words. Not you. Not ever. After what you did..." I understand the free folk and the northerners share a common trait, the blood of the First Men, and it's obvious she abhors Theon for his alleged murder of Bran and Rickon, mere children, but why would this make her so angry? Why would she defend the honor of the Stark words? We know from Mance the wildlings disdain all "kneelers." This always struck me as odd. Any thoughts?

[Lord Hanna]

Never noticed. She even calls him Lord Eddard.

Good question...

[butterbumps!]

So, according to Jon, Mors Umber's only daughter was carried off by wildlings 30 years ago. There's a chance that Rowan is this daughter or granddaughter, specifically chosen for this task at hand because of that connection. There's definitely something going on with Rowan and the Umbers, because Rowan is one of the only 3 figures who uses the term "kinslayer" to Theon; the other 2 are the Hooded Man and Mors Umber, who is right outside Winterfell's walls, and might well be the HM himself.

[Mithras]

I think she is Crowfood’s kidnapped daughter, or her daughter. That means she is an Umber who are the fiercest Stark loyalists.

ETA: ninjaed by bumps

[King Brandon Ice Eyes]

Wow, I always found that odd as well that a wildling would be so passionate about the Starks' honor but that theory about the Umbers makes a lot of sense.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

That could be, but do we know what's Mance's opinion about Ned? Maybe Mance thought good of him and that feeling extended over "his people".

[butterbumps!]

The Old Gods abhor a kinslayer, and that family is the one he betrayed/kinslayed against.

He has betrayed them in the worst possible way, and yet he still acts as though he is one of them. That is unacceptable. Although it is really interesting that she would refer to him as ''Lord'' Eddard.

But then, the lands beyond the Wall have many stories about the Starks, and it being a meritocracy they respect them even as deadly and implacable foes. As we see with Osha in AGoT.

I've not read about her being a possible daughter of Mors Umber, that is curious.

Here's the thing, though. You know how the Manderlys and Umbers have been working together since Clash to build ships? I think there's a good chance Manderly filled Mors in on how Rick and Co are still alive. Which means that Theon wouldn't have killed his foster brothers. Which means that "kinslayer," even in this stretched application of it to include foster brothers, wouldn't apply.

So why would Mors call him this? Well, Manderlys and Umbers may have been working together for 3 books, but they have a long-standing rivalry; they don't historically like each other. Mors might want independent confirmation that Rick and Co are still alive, which can come from Theon. Using a hugely inflammatory term like "kinslayer" to jolt Theon into a denial of having murdered them might be what's going on. This might not be outrage about Theon's alleged "kinslaying" (which, imo, is a gross misuse of the term), but rather, shocking him into confessing in order to get Manderly's story confirmed.

oh, ETA: if that's what's going on, I should add that it almost works, because Theon thinks on how he didn't actually kill them in his own POV each time "kinslayers" thrown at him.

[Tywin Smokin a Blunt]

During ADWD Theon is with Rowan in the godswood at Winterfell when he mutters, "Winter is coming..." after reflecting on how icy the pool and heart tree had become. Rowan becomes offended and says, "You have no right to mouth Lord Eddard's words. Not you. Not ever. After what you did..." I understand the free folk and the northerners share a common trait, the blood of the First Men, and it's obvious she abhors Theon for his alleged murder of Bran and Rickon, mere children, but why would this make her so angry? Why would she defend the honor of the Stark words? We know from Mance the wildlings disdain all "kneelers." This always struck me as odd. Any thoughts?

Good catch, I never noticed that before. The Umber explanation seems plausible to me.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I think Bumps has it.

[Fire Eater]

So, according to Jon, Mors Umber's only daughter was carried off by wildlings 30 years ago. There's a chance that Rowan is this daughter or granddaughter, specifically chosen for this task at hand because of that connection. There's definitely something going on with Rowan and the Umbers, because Rowan is one of the only 3 figures who uses the term "kinslayer" to Theon; the other 2 are the Hooded Man and Mors Umber, who is right outside Winterfell's walls, and might well be the HM himself.

I think that is unlikely, as what is the point of her being Umber's daughter/granddaughter if she's dead, and it can't impact the storyline somehow?

I think Rowan was offended by what Theon did in killing children who had been raised alongside him, betraying the late man who raised him since he was ten.

[butterbumps!]

I think that is unlikely, as what is the point of her being Umber's daughter/granddaughter if she's dead, and it can't impact the storyline somehow?

I think Rowan was offended by what Theon did in killing children who had been raised alongside him, betraying the late man who raised him since he was ten.

Where do we see Rowan die? The last we hear of her is this, right before Theon and Jeyne go over:

Of Abel, Rowan, Squirrel, and the others there was no sign. He and the girl were alone.

The Pink Letter doesn't prove she's dead either.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I think that is unlikely, as what is the point of her being Umber's daughter/granddaughter if she's dead, and it can't impact the storyline somehow?

She may not be dead.

[Fire Eater]

She may not be dead.

Ramsay says the six women who came with Mance are skinned. I doubt she would survive as she is in a castle filled with armed men loyal to the Boltons, and I doubt they would let her live.

[fuem]

Winter is coming the wild people know all to well what it truly means were a iron born does not.
I guess they might hate the Kneelers but still respect there values of the old ways of Never kill if you share there meat and mead that custom seems to be a Major thing in the north. Or you could say that Bael the bard story would truly mean kin slaying to the wild folk who truly knows

[Illyrio Mo'Parties]

...isn't she undercover? Hence "Lord Eddard."

[SunflashJT]

The Starks are very well known to the wildings, probably respected even. There has been mention of her being an Umber descendant which is highly likely. Additionally the wildlings probably have honor, and the fact that Theon is THE turncloak of the series would probably get under the skin of anyone north of the neck, with the exception of the Boltons.

[Lord Martin]

Could the "Lord Eddard" bit be part of her acting as a wandering singer?

Obviously she doesn't want anyone knowing she's a wildling... all the northern houses hate wildlings... plus she'd have some explaining to do. So its a form of cover for her. She wants to look like a random northerner who hates Theon for what he did to the Starks.

I can't recall if there were others around when she said this....

[The Fallen]

How old was Umber's daughter when she was taken away? Would she have been imbued with the Stark loyalty by then?

[Pod The Impaler]

But then, the lands beyond the Wall have many stories about the Starks, and it being a meritocracy they respect them even as deadly and implacable foes.

The Starks are very well known to the wildings, probably respected even.

One gets the feeling the wildlings do respect the Starks, grudgingly. After all, the wildlings respect strength and the Starks are strong (too strong for them to defeat, pretty much every time they have tried). Starks have the blood of the First Men; Starks were Kings in the North for 8000 years; a Stark built the Wall and founded the Night's Watch; Joramun and a Stark defeated the Night King. The Starks are wargs, and wargs are respected and feared; a greenseer like Bran or Jojen would be even more so.

If the Bael story is true, Stark blood probably runs in many wildlings, and wildling blood in the Starks. This is not just with regard to the Starks, but the other northern nobles as well. Many a woman has probably been stolen from them and made into a "wife" north of the Wall; however, while little is said of northern nobles going north of the wall, but I imagine it has happened just as often. The practice of First Night existed in the North, and even if prohibited south of the Wall, if a northern lord fancied some wildling girl, what was to stop him from taking her (figuratively or literally) ?

The general point here is that there may be more connections between the northmen south of the wall and the northmen north of the wall than is generally acknowledged by either one. Like with the "crows", there seems to be more of an exchange going on.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

The wildlings respect the Starks. They may hate them, but nevertheless they respect them very much. What Theon did was detestable.

How old was Umber's daughter when she was taken away? Would she have been imbued with the Stark loyalty by then?

Adult. Only possible brides are stolen by wildlings. Fits Umber's age as well.

Nevertheless, my take on Umber's daughter is Tormund Giantsbane's wife and mother to his children.