Discussion of the Season 5 storylines - Implications of the Casting News from San Diego

[FreeParking]

What's Asha's function at all then? )

I have a feeling the Old Gods will reveal themselves during the battle with Boltons&Freys... Possibly Theon and Asha just have to be there and witness it for some reason...

But that's just my speculation. More book than show related.

No fucking clue.

[augustine_strindberg]

And the idea of Arianne/ Aegon replacement with Myrcella/Trystan seems very.. VERY reasonable.

[FreeParking]

Responses in bold.

Book four and five spoilers

The entirety of the Rhoyner subplot is being cut. Tyrion will wind up in Pentos and then he'll travel with Illyrio and Varys, heading for Dany. Jorah still probably kidnaps Tyrion at some point.

Jorah mentioned is was in the Golden Company once, and that was the second time is was mentioned in the show. I think he will be with the GC and then kidnap Tyrion.

Tyrion and Jorah probably absorb some of Quentyns storyline and Tyrion convinces Jorah to free the dragons after Dany flies off.

All we need to do is open a door; doesn't really matter too much who we get to do it. Certainly could be Jorah who get flamed.

But does that mean they cut Aegon? I doubt it, Aegon is pretty fucking crucial. I think they did cast Aegon: they cast a pretty boy as Trystane who hasn't even been in the books, really, and considered him a major casting announcement.
That showed us Aero too who is important but I wouldn't call major. That being said Trystane being Aegon could work, just kinda stupid for Doran not to have any other heirs.

My conclusion is that the role of Aegon has been folded into Trystane's role--and it is very possible/probable that Trystane will be revealed to secretly be Aegon.

It's equally possible that they will skip out on having a secret Aegon entirely--but I think the way that they emphasized Elia and her children all of last season and especially in the Mountain and the Viper episode, suggests that the show will keep the Aegon-in-hiding storyline from the books, only instead of hiding on the Rhoyne, he's been hiding as Trystane.

What they will probably drop is any pretense of (f)Aegon, but who knows, perhaps they will try to weave in the Blackfyre backstory with the combination of Aegon and Bloodraven entering the show.

Yeah I doubt we will get the Blackfyre stuff. They could throw in some hints that he might be fake but nothing about the Blackfyres.

The show has made mention many times that they try to collapse locations/sets because it's such a huge expense to have extra locations. If, ultimately, Aegon's faction joins forces with Dorne, it will make for much more economical storytelling on the show to have the two factions already be merged, because then they only have to cast and locate a single new faction and they do not have to script a merger of the factions.

Sounds good.

Likewise Myrcella seems to be absorbing much of Arianne's role into her role. I was always surprised that they cast Myrcella and Rickon in season 1, because I thought they would be obvious cuts to make, they have almost no on screen role in major events, and are offscreen/MIA for 98% of the story, but evidently they were important enough to pour money into early on for a second half of the series pay off.

Eh, I would say that Arianne's role is more likely being absorbed by the Sand Snakes and Ellaria.

Now Myrcella's role is being beefed up. If there isn't an Arianne/Aegon marriage, I imagine that Myrcella/Trystane marriage is going to supplant it. Arianne's character is probably being absorbed by both Myrcella (Arianne/Myrcella marries Trystane/Aegon) and by some of the SandSnake characters.

If Varys is actually supporting Aegon and in the book if Aegon and Arianne get married they would have the Dornish army and the GC. Same way if Trystane/Aegon and Myrcella marry in the show. Again that is if Varys supports Aegon in the show. Tyrion gets separated from Varys when they meet with the GC since Jorah is there.

remember how cool Doran's line is "vengeance justice fire and blood?" it's a great line, but it has no content behind it other than an attempt of a feint of a plan resting on the shoulders of an inept and dolorous young man. They could retain that kickass line, and instead have a killer reveal that Trystane is Aegon.

True

[alcasinoroyale]

Does anyone think that the possible return of Gendry could be Aegon's replacement?

[FreeParking]

And Varys supports Gendry? You would have thought he would have been keeping Gendry safe then instead of letting him get sent to the Wall.

[boojam]

What's Asha's function at all then? )

I have a feeling the Old Gods will reveal themselves during the battle with Boltons&Freys... Possibly Theon and Asha just have to be there and witness it for some reason...

But that's just my speculation. More book than show related.

Asha/Yara may turn out to be a Greyjoy Pyke place holder , so to speak.

Theon is also, but in a different way, even tho he had screen time this last season , it was not that much.

However season 3 set Yara/Asha up for season 4, when they could have cut her.

So it is odd, if more Greyjoys don't show up this season they may in 6.

[alcasinoroyale]

And Varys supports Gendry? You would have thought he would have been keeping Gendry safe then instead of letting him get sent to the Wall.

No I just saw this on another thread and wanted to know what everyone thinks. It's just interesting how Gendry was not in Season 4, but Joe Dempsie tweeted "still rowing" so that pretty much sums it up.

[alcasinoroyale]

Asha/Yara may turn out to be a Greyjoy Pyke place holder , so to speak.

Theon is also, but in a different way, even tho he had screen time this last season , it was not that much.

However season 3 set Yara/Asha up for season 4, when they could have cut her.

So it is odd, if more Greyjoys don't show up this season they may in 6.

I feel like the Greyjoy brothers (or at least one of them) will be introduced when they confirm Balon's death, which has to be Season 5 because how much longer can they hold that off when he was supposed to be dead already. They did not announce the casting of Ramsay, Daario, Tormund, Mance, and Grey Worm until August anyway, so its possible that they might include the ironborn in Season 5.

[jobmartell]

I like your speculation Fury Burns, except for the GreatJon part, as I don't think they'll bring him back since the actor left on bad terms, and he's not the kind of character you can simply replace with another actor. Because at that point, might as well just use Manderly.

What happened between the greatjohn and d&d/hbo?

[Faint]

So much depends on whether they cast Aegon. If they do, then they can, as I suggested in another thread, just make Trystane into an amalgamation of the book version of himself, Arianne, and Quentyn. He will be Trystane in the sense that he will be betrothed to Myrcella; but he will attempt to crown her (like Arianne); and having failed at that, he will be sent to woo Daenerys (like Quentyn).

But if there is no Aegon, there is little reason for Trystane to assume Quentyn's role (assuming, of course, that the latter's purpose in the books is to turn Dorne against Daenerys). Moreover, if that is the case, with Aegon not cast, then they might simplify the story by having Varys and Illyrio be Targaryen supporters from the start and have Dorne help Daenerys to crush the Lannisters (who will be in power far longer than in the books, fitting the obvious preference of the showrunners).

As for the Iron Islands, I think that story is just going to be heavily edited and streamlined. We might hear about one of Asha's uncles being crowned and marrying her off, so that she has a renewed motive to find Theon, but none of the larger implications of Euron invading the Reach or Victarion making for Meereen.

Put in brief, my read on Benioff and Weiss and their perspective on the series, is that the Starks, Lannisters, and Targaryens are important -- everything and everyone else is expendable.

[Good Guy Garlan]

Of all the characters mentioned by the OP Alys Karstark is the only one who's truly pointless

Her main and pretty much only function is to tell Jon, and in turn Stannis, about the Karstark treachery, and assuming they keep that, Theon can take care of it perfectly

[Steelborn]

Yara being sent to Slaver's Bay? It doesn't suit Asha's character and there's no point of her going there personally to ally with Daenerys.

Or they can fall in love and create the first same-sex marriage in the world.

[boojam]

What happened between the greatjohn and d&d/hbo?

Like Conan Stevens , Clive Mantle had a conflicting schedule.

In Stevens case it was The Hobbit.

In Mantel's case another TV series which did not have another season.

Unlike Stevens ... Mantle has never given interviews about it , as far as I know.

Stevens wanted to come back.

Maybe Mantle did not care for the show.

Robert Pugh for instance fulfilled his role as Craster, but , is the only actor, I heard of, who voiced a displeasure with the show.

Ed Skrein , apparently, also had a conflict, we have never heard from him either.

One wonders if it is HBO or D&D , break a contract agreement and you are black listed??

[Hangover of the Morning]

The show has so far stayed pretty true to the plot of the first three books but it looks like that they are either streamlining or completely omiting a decent portion of the storylines from books 4 and 5. The message I take from it is that all that felt like a pointless filler in AFfC/ADwD is indeed mostly a pointless filler in the end. Not sure if I should feel sad or relieved.

[Annara Snow]

Of all the characters mentioned by the OP Alys Karstark is the only one who's truly pointless

Her main and pretty much only function is to tell Jon, and in turn Stannis, about the Karstark treachery, and assuming they keep that, Theon can take care of it perfectly

Barbrey Dustin is IMO even less necessary - her purpose in the books is to fill in backstory about Brandon and Rickard's "sothron ambitions" and hint at Brandon/Ashara. Obviously, that's not relevant to the show.

Val is also not necessary unless she has something big to do in TWOW that Tormund or someone else can't do. I also never found her all that interesting or fleshed out, and I never thought she had any special chemistry with Jon. There was more sexual tension between Jon and Mel, with Val it's just that everyone else kept thinking they could be a couple.

[Lordsteve666]

Thing is they will undoubtably announce more new cast members later on so some of the missing one might still happen.

Plus with Aegon for example, his very existence should be secret until the big reveal or it buggers up the whole storyline with him being hidden away at birth. Whether he is fake or not you would want to keep him under wraps until you reveal him, it's a big change to the power game in the books as there's suddenly a Targ on the doorstep of Westeros.

[Colonel Green]

Plus with Aegon for example, his very existence should be secret until the big reveal or it buggers up the whole storyline with him being hidden away at birth. Whether he is fake or not you would want to keep him under wraps until you reveal him, it's a big change to the power game in the books as there's suddenly a Targ on the doorstep of Westeros.

They would just cast "Young Griff", which would be meaningless to people who haven't read the books.

[Lordsteve666]

Good point. I'd completely forgotten he has a false name in the books at the start. Suppose they could do that.

[Faint]

Beyond that, you would hear about Jon Connington and mercenaries captains being cast, none of which has happened. Aegon is not a solitary figure in the story, he is an entire narrative arc. His inclusion would necessarily entail the arrival of three or four more named cast members.

[The hairy bear]

The suggestion of merging Arianne/Aegon with Myrcella/Trystane is really interesting. It would be a very bold choice, and surely controversial.

Ramsay locke and Dario all played major roles in season 3 and we're not in the video.

There's obvious reasons for not including Ramsay, and Daario only appeared at the final three episodes of the season so he was likely a late addition (and perhaps a hurried one, judging by the fact that the producers do not seem to have liked him much).

Locke is a good one. But still, it's only one and the S3 video already included a lot of big profile roles/actors. It's not comparable to the Season 5 video. I agree that one or two roles of the missing important ones may still be cast, but we can be asured that most of them won't and we can start theorizin about the impact of their absences.

I think I remember right, there was no 'casting video' for season 2 and 4 at Comic Con?

That's right.