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Jon & Dany TWINS?!


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67 replies to this topic

#1 LadySaeryn

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 01:52 PM

Ok, so I know all of you are going to disagree about this theory because of the obvious age issues, buttt I think that it could easily be explained. Let's say, to cover it up Dany was told she was born in 284AC during the storm. I might be completely and absolutely wrong.

 

So let's pretend that this theory has merit. GRRM told Alfie Allen that Jon's story resembles that of Luke Skywalker. For those that are not familiar with Luke's story, to sum it up, Luke and Leia were attracted to each other then they found out they were twins and their father was Darth Vader. So how could Jon's story be similar to Luke's? 1- He could have a twin sister 2- His father could be alive and he's evil. It fits really well since Luke actually lived with his uncle who kept the secret of his father hidden. I don't know about Rhaegar being alive, but I think Dany and Jon could actually be twins.

 

So let's say that Lyanna gave birth to twins in the Tower of Joy. Ned Carried both children with him to Starfall. He left Dany there because he couldn't come back home with her since she has the Targaryen look and that's how Dany would remember the lemon trees in her childhood seeing as there are no lemon trees in Braavos and plenty in Dorne.

 

Another thing I noticed was that Ned thought a whole lot about the incident at the Tower of Joy and the promise he made Lyanna after Robert ordered Varys to kill Dany. He even dreamt about blood and broken promises. Why would his promise to his sister be broken if Jon was safe. There must be something else that's troubling Ned and the only thing that completely infuriated him was the assassination of Dany. Right?   

 

Problems with this theory:

1-The obvious reason is that Jon is a year older that Dany.

2- It is widely known that Rhaella was pregnant and gave birth to Dany on Dragonstone, but that could be a lie. Dany knows nothing of her childhood in Westeros and her only source of info is Viserys. 

3- If Rhaella didn't give birth to Dany, why did she die, and how? Could she have been pregnant, but died with her baby in childbirth? That could be a great opportunity to pretend Dany was the child.

4- How did Dany end up with Viserys and wouldn't he remember if she wasn't his sister?

5- The dragon has three heads. This theory only gives us two. It's possible that Lyanna could have given birth to triplets, but that's just an overkill. Who knows?

6- Who helped Ned with covering up Dany's parentage? Ser Willem?

 

I could be completely wrong, but I'd love to hear some feedback!!

 



#2 Red Tiger

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:08 PM

Id be really pissed if this turned out to be true.



#3 The Doctor's Consort

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:08 PM

Welcome to the forums!  :cheers:

 

How Jon's story be similar to Luke's; 3: His father was the "enemy" whose actions caused a war and the death of his family.



#4 RoamingRonin

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:14 PM

.
So let's pretend that this theory has merit.


No.

We know one character is older than the other. There's no point in pretending.

#5 cat o' canals

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:15 PM

I actually kind of like this theory. I once read a series of essays on how Jon's and Dany's story lines and character development seemed to complement and mirror each other and that would tie in nicely with that observation. I don't think it's going to happen, it would take a lot of backtracking and explaining to get away with it, but still kind of cool.



#6 Ser Cory Trevor

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:18 PM

I do think there's something we don't know about Dany's past but there's like no textual evidence for this apart from the house with the red door/lemon tree which is far from conclusive.



#7 JNR

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:25 PM

Flat statement from GRRM that Jon is eight or nine months older than Dany



#8 ChillyPolly

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:38 PM

 

Yes, but which Dany was he referring to?  Was he referring to the real Dany, who was born on Dragonstone 9 months after the fall of King's Landing, and was smuggled away somewhere by Willem Darry?  Or was he referring to the virgin slave-girl which the Beggar King picked up from somewhere so he could fool some dumb barbarian into supporting his claim.

 

In any event, the statement was not really so flat.   The flat statement was that it was not so much as a year, and that it was "closer to" 8 or 9 months.  Certainly, if the Dany we know is the exact same age as Jon, that is "closer to" 8 or 9 months than it is to a year.


Edited by ChillyPolly, 10 August 2014 - 04:40 PM.


#9 The Doctor's Consort

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:42 PM

Yes, but which Dany was he referring to?  Was he referring to the real Dany, who was born on Dragonstone 9 months after the fall of King's Landing?  Or was he referring to the virgin slave-girl which the Beggar King picked up from somewhere so he could fool some dumb barbarian into supporting his claim.

 

In any event, the statement was not really so flat.   The flat statement was that it was not so much as a year, and that it was "closer to" 8 or 9 months.  Certainly, if the Dany we know is the exact same age as Jon, that is "closer to" 8 or 9 months than it is to a year.

Goodness gracious! *facepalm* We have no textual evidence at all that Dany is not Dany but is some Lyseni's whore daughter. I mean c'mon on people! Let's at least have some kind of common sense.



#10 Debra Morgan

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:44 PM

It is delirium.

#11 Dr. Pepper

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:53 PM

Ok, so I know all of you are going to disagree about this theory because of the obvious age issues, buttt I think that it could easily be explained. Let's say, to cover it up Dany was told she was born in 284AC during the storm. I might be completely and absolutely wrong.

 

So let's pretend that this theory has merit. GRRM told Alfie Allen that Jon's story resembles that of Luke Skywalker.

 

No, according to Allen, GRRM told him who Jon's parents were and Alfie Allen is the one who likened it to Luke Skywalker.  

 

 

 

So let's say that Lyanna gave birth to twins in the Tower of Joy. Ned Carried both children with him to Starfall. He left Dany there because he couldn't come back home with her since she has the Targaryen look and that's how Dany would remember the lemon trees in her childhood seeing as there are no lemon trees in Braavos and plenty in Dorne.

 

 

 

There are trees in Braavos, in the courtyards of the mighty.  This is almost surely where Dany and Viserys - two scions of a royal house - would have stayed.  They were never in hiding and would have had no reason to live well below their means until their means started to dry up.  Even when they left Braavos, they guested with the mighty throughout the Free Cities.  Then, when their means really started drying up, they were hosted with Illyrio.  But the big thing to keep in mind here is that they were never in hiding.  There were always eyes on the two young Targaryens.  There is absolutely no indication that the last two known Targaryens were exactly as they claimed to be or that one of them appeared out of thin air one day or that one of them was switched with another.  



#12 ChillyPolly

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:54 PM

Goodness gracious! *facepalm* We have no textual evidence at all that Dany is not Dany but is some Lyseni's whore daughter.

 

The suggestion was not that she is a Lyseni whore's daughter.  The suggestion was that she might not be who she thinks she is; and specifically that she might be one of the children born at the Tower of Joy.



#13 The Doctor's Consort

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 04:59 PM

The suggestion was not that she is a Lyseni whore's daughter.  The suggestion was that she might not be who she thinks she is; and specifically that she might be one of the children born at the Tower of Joy.

There are so many mistakes about this. The lack of textual proofs; There is a great difference between a 9 months old and a new born. There is no textual proof that Lyanna had 2 children and not one. Again there is no textual evidence that Dany isn't Rhaella's daughter.  

Lyanna's promise; "Promise me Ned! Promise me that you will send my daughter far far away!" 


Edited by Jon's Queen Consort, 10 August 2014 - 05:00 PM.


#14 Ser Greg of House House

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 05:02 PM

Now let's talk about that lemon tree...



#15 Hodor's Dragon

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 05:05 PM

 

JNR, on 10 Aug 2014 - 2:25 PM, said:

 

In any event, the statement was not really so flat.   The flat statement was that it was not so much as a year, and that it was "closer to" 8 or 9 months.  Certainly, if the Dany we know is the exact same age as Jon, that is "closer to" 8 or 9 months than it is to a year.

 

 

:stunned:

 

So, ChillyPolly, you're saying what Martin really meant with the below quote was that they were born at the same time?

 

All of which is a long winded way of saying, no, Jon was not born "more than 1 year" before Dany... probably closer to eight or nine months or thereabouts.

 

 

Ummm, no.



#16 ChillyPolly

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 05:06 PM

There are so many mistakes about this. The lack of textual proofs; 

 

I wouldn't expect there to be proofs.

 


There is a great difference between a 9 months old and a new born.

 

Sorry, but I cannot remember the difference from that age.  Neither, I think, can Dany.  A 3-year old and a 4-year old, or a 4-year old and a 5-year old,  might be harder to tell apart.  And that's what matters.

 


There is no textual proof that Lyanna had 2 children and not one.

 

Well ... the dragon does have 3 heads.  And Alfie Allen's comment about a "Luke Skywalker" situation might count as, at least, a clue.

 


Again there is no textual evidence that Dany isn't Rhaella's daughter.  

 

Right.  No proof.  No proof.  No proof.  No proof.  But I thought people were trying to rule out the POSSIBILITY.  



#17 Dr. Pepper

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 05:07 PM

Now let's talk about that lemon tree...

I've always wondered what those lemons tasted like.  They must have been poor quality since they were planted in an unsuitable environment, almost purely ornamental.  Maybe this is why Dany only looked at the tree and never partook of it's fruits, as the lemons were likely disgusting.  



#18 ChillyPolly

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 05:08 PM

 

So, ChillyPolly, you're saying what Martin really meant with the below quote was that they were born at the same time?

 

Not at all.  Even if it were true, that would be giving it away.



#19 yolkboy

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 05:09 PM

I deserve a bullet in the skull for starting this lemon tree obsession


Edited by yolkboy, 10 August 2014 - 05:10 PM.


#20 Acolyte of Radmure

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 05:12 PM

GRRM may have just meant the I am your father thing with Luke Skywalker, might not have even been thinking about the sister.