Hodor's Dragon Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 ...for 40,000. So, 136,5 kg for 30,000 dragons. Now, if the dragon is closer to the aureus, it would be about 270 kg... I assumed one of the lesser-weight French coins of the late medieval period, which would come to about 270 pounds (or about 120 kg for those who use weird numbers ;) ). . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A True Kaniggit Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 It's worth about tree fiddy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
willofDorne Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Thats not on par with what we've seen in the books, Dunks armor for a huge guy cost 800 silver which translated into 3 gold. Dunk's armor was the plainest, least decorated armor. And his horse wasn't very quick. 226 silver = 1 gold dragon, so it'd be closer to 4 gold dragons, I think. He sold his Horse to get that 800 silver... so that means we can put a bare minimum entry fee of a hedge knight at 8 gold or thereabouts. But lords with fancier armor and more expensive horses are going to be a different story. We'e talking about crests, jewels, precious metals, thoroughbred horses. So my guess is the average starting ransom would be closer to 20-30 gold, and further from dunk's meager 5-10 gold ransom. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I think Ser Loras's armor and horse would be in the neighborhood of 500 gold. Rhaegar's armor and horse would be worth 1000's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GallowsKnight Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 @willofDorne We see it's not unheard of for Lords and Knights to waive the ransom. Baelor Breakspear did it for Ser Arlan. One of the hedge knights in the Mystery Knight expects it to happen if he loses a bout (and secure a job). Even the snail knight (who is solely driven by profit) complains about the effort selling Dunk's actually gear would involve. I imagine a lot of hedgeknights get away only paying whatever cash they have on them, as the Lords/wealthier knights can't be bother or don't want to appear miserly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free Northman Reborn Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 How much did Saladhor Saan charge Stannis for his ships again? I think 40k dragons can hire you quite a reasonably sized army of mercenaries for a year. I bet Ser Eustace would not have minded having 40k dragons when he tried to raise his 8 man strong army to protect his lands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaak Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 As for the 6 million dragons debt: England had a public debt of £ 6,1 millions by 1694, and has never paid it off. In terms of silver, looks like 1 dragon is more like £4. Well, Great Britain was £ 34 millions in debt by 1712, and has never paid that off, either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambolpuddy Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Even if living completely lavishly, it seems like the time between the tournament and Blackwater was too short to spend 30,000ish gold. I wonder what he did with the rest of it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeanF Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Probably, the prizes at the Tournament of the Hand should have been 1% of the figures that were actually given. 40,000 dragons would buy a hell of a lot of land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Tyrion thought 30 dragons was a fortune for Shae's singer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OldGimletEye Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Looking at this in terms of purchasing power. From the ASOIAF wiki, it says that one bushel of corn cost 1 silver stag just during the War of Five Kings. It also says that one dragon equals 210 silver stags. The spot price of a bushel of corn over the last thirty years has had a rough average of about $3.00 (in current nominal dollars) or so. A rough estimate would be accordingly: 3.00 dollars/bushel x 1 bushel/stag x 210 stags/dragon x 40,000 dragons = $25,200,000.00 Of course this isn't precisely accurate for at least two reasons. The first is that we know that the price of food was greatly inflated during the War of Five Kings. Secondly, you would need more information about the prices of other commodities in Westeros to build a true index. The estimate above just gives a rough idea. ETA:The computations might be off if "corn" really meant "wheat" i.e "The Corn Laws". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Civility Reigns Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 The Hound could have put some decent enchantments on his weapons and armor. I'm thinking a +2 enhancement bonus on his sword, and +3 on his armor. That will leave him 13,000 gold to buy a longship, 50 crewmen, and 120 mercenaries which he can use to terrorize the Narrow Sea for approximately 8 years, and a 1,028 gold rainy day fund. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arakan Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 It's things like this that make me doubt incredibly elaborate plans revealed through subtle foreshadowing in symbolic textual minutiae, irrespective of how much they align with a line from the Love Song if J. Alfred Prufrock. :agree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malchyor Posted August 21, 2014 Author Share Posted August 21, 2014 Seriously, are people unable to read? BWB only gave the Hound a note for 9k dragons, thus he was only carrying that much, thus he either spent the other 31k or stored it somewhere. Reading is one thing, memorizing the details of a (potential) tiny plot hole, as they come up over 5 books, is another. Kind of a jerky reply, but it's the internet, so I guess it's what we should expect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kienn Posted August 21, 2014 Share Posted August 21, 2014 Reading is one thing, memorizing the details of a (potential) tiny plot hole, as they come up over 5 books, is another.If you don't remember, why pretend that you do and spread misinformation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lost Melnibonean Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 13,333 ferries..."Three dragons?" Clegane gave a bark of laughter. "For three dragons I should own the bloody ferry." Arya IX, Storm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceaxe Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Well if we'd imagine the dragon was on the small side, say 2.5 grams, 9000 would weight only 22.5 kilos, which is reasonable. However, the smaller we think the dragon, the bigger the problem with the dragon stag equivalence. In both ancient and medieval times, the weight ratio between gold and silver coins was roughly 1 to 10. If we think the stag was about 1 gram, like a medieval denier or penny, then the dragon would be frigging 21 grams, quite a big coins for the medieval standards. So 9000 dragons = 189 kilos. Unfortunately this makes the dragon - stag equivalence a "plot hole" or Planetos silver abundant and dirt cheap (like modern day silver which is almost 100 times cheaper than gold) I do not know much about the medieval period, but in 1st Century Imperial Rome, a skilled laborer, or a common legionary soldier roughly earned a silver piece a day (3.3 grams) which is almost 1 gold piece a month ( 1 aureus (about 7.8 grams) = 25 denarii)A centurion (officer commanding 100 legionaries) might have been getting 20 times as much. An animal would cost in the tens of denarii, and a slave in the hundreds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Onion Sleight Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 One Fat Walda Frey? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceaxe Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Looking at this in terms of purchasing power. From the ASOIAF wiki, it says that one bushel of corn cost 1 silver stag just during the War of Five Kings. In ancient times (Rome or Greece) a bushel of grain was roughly from 1 to 2 pieces of silver depending on period and location. Interestingly enough this did not change much in medieval England, and rather-skilled labor wages were very similar (2 pence (almost 3 grams of silver) a day for a thatcher England 1261) Considering the wo5k price is a war price, then the stag must have been a heavy coin, heavier than a drachma/denarius and much heavier than a medieval penny, so at least 5, more likley 7 grams So the dragon would be truly enormous (about 50-70 grams of gold - totally unpractical for the main denomination) or hugely over-valuated :) Unfortunately Martin really messed up the monetary system of Westeros. Or their gold is much more valuable than on Earth... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bright Blue Eyes Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 Considering the wo5k price is a war price, then the stag must have been a heavy coin, heavier than a drachma/denarius and much heavier than a medieval penny, so at least 5, more likley 7 grams So the dragon would be truly enormous (about 50-70 grams of gold - totally unpractical for the main denomination) or hugely over-valuated :) Unfortunately Martin really messed up the monetary system of Westeros. Or their gold is much more valuable than on Earth... Or that non-canon "source" of 210 stags = 1 dragon is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iceaxe Posted September 10, 2014 Share Posted September 10, 2014 If that war price is correct, then a dragon should be from 10 to 20 stags. Say war price double than normal, 1 stag = 5 grams, 1 dragon 10 grams, 1 to 20. (The English "noble" used during the war of the roses was ~8 grams) That would make Sandor's load 9000 pieces = 90 kilos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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