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Where was Daenerys' House with the Red Door? -- Not Braavos!


Archmaester Drew

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Please tell me this is a joke. Because of your first post, I really don't know.

Why should it be a joke. Like I said, I don't know what happened to the "real Daenerys". Perhaps she died, as infants often do. Or perhaps she is being fostered secretly somewhere. If so, one might suspect a certain 15-year old blond girl who dyes her hair green, and who, ironically, has a fierce loyalty to the Starks, just as Lyanna's real daughter has grown up to hate them.

But it does not matter, because the "real Daenerys" does not matter. The "real Daenerys" is not in the line of succession, not while any of Rhaegar's children live, if legitimate or legitimized. And the prophesy as Rhaegar understood it (and he seems to be the only person who knew anything about this prophesy) was that his own children would be the three-headed dragon, and his heir would be the Prince that Was Promised. All clues seem to indicate that the "Dany we know" is one of those 3 people (child of three): either Baby Aegon and one of the twins born at the TOJ or (if Baby Aegon did die) one of the triplets born at the TOJ.

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Because there is Dorne involved, admit it :)

I do think Dorne was involved in that they gave the lemon tree (and probably a ton more) to the Sealord to keep Dany and Viserys safe. But they were in Braavos with the lemon tree, not Dorne.

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The theory supports that Daenerys lived in Dorne.

Hmm.. Daenerys remembers the flight from Braavos, and the journey to the other Free Cities they had been to. Kind of find it difficult to believe that she missed the fact that to get from Dorne to one of the Free Cities, you need to board a ship (which can't be done without any money, and they seem to have left the house with the red door without any money),

And even if they did manage to get a ship from the house with the red door to Myr, I'd think that Dany would know the difference between travelling from north to south (Braavos to Myr), and from south to north (Dorne to Myr). Especially since a trip from Dorne to Myr would need you to pass the Stepstones.

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Hmm.. Daenerys remembers the flight from Braavos, and the journey to the other Free Cities they had been to. Kind of find it difficult to believe that she missed the fact that to get from Dorne to one of the Free Cities, you need to board a ship (which can't be done without any money, and they seem to have left the house with the red door without any money),

And even if they did manage to get a ship from the house with the red door to Myr, I'd think that Dany would know the difference between travelling from north to south (Braavos to Myr), and from south to north (Dorne to Myr). Especially since a trip from Dorne to Myr would need you to pass the Stepstones.

I know but unfortunately there are people who support this idea.

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Because there is Dorne involved, admit it :)

Hehe am I that transparent?? ;)

Mostly it would just mean that there were a lot more to Doran's plans than we know right now, which is something I'm really really hoping is true.

I do think Dorne was involved in that they gave the lemon tree (and probably a ton more) to the Sealord to keep Dany and Viserys safe. But they were in Braavos with the lemon tree, not Dorne.

That's a cool/slightly more plausible idea as well.

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The lemon tree was probably kept in a pot in a glasshouse, and then brought out in the Summer.

Given that the Sealord of Braavos witnessed the marriage pact between Viserys and Arianne, I think it's likely they were staying at his palace. Presumably, a different Sealord took power and changed their policy towards Westeros.

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Hmm.. Daenerys remembers the flight from Braavos

The text does not say so. The text says she relies on the stories of Viserys to reconstruct her past ("sometimes Dany would picture the way it had been, so often had her brother told her the stories"). She remembers bits and fragments. She remembers Ser Willam, and she remembers crying when the house with the red door closed behind her forever.

, and the journey to the other Free Cities they had been to.

Well, these journeys continued til she was 12. So yeah. She remembers them pretty well, at least towards the end

Kind of find it difficult to believe that she missed the fact that to get from Dorne to one of the Free Cities, you need to board a ship (which can't be done without any money, and they seem to have left the house with the red door without any money),

Dead wrong. Viserys had wealth, which gradually dissipated over the course of his travels. There is nothing to indicate they never traveled by ship. Nor is there any sane reason to suppose that a toddler can identify the port that she sailed from, especially if she never sees that port again.

And even if they did manage to get a ship from the house with the red door to Myr, I'd think that Dany would know the difference between travelling from north to south (Braavos to Myr), and from south to north (Dorne to Myr). Especially since a trip from Dorne to Myr would need you to pass the Stepstones.

Why on earth would she remember that? How on earth would she know the difference? I have no memory whatsoever of the trip to the airport that occurred when I was five years old. I MIGHT possibly have a vague memory of landing on the other side of the Atlantic. The idea that a small child can reliably remember the direction that a car, or boat, or plane is traveling (how? By looking at the sky? A compass?) is just mind-boggling.

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Of course it was in Braavos, probably in the Sea Lord's palace. All these theories about lemon trees not being able to be cultivated in Braavos are bullshit. We know trees are grown in the courtyards of the mighty, and the Sea Lord is the ruler of Braavos, of course his palace will have expensive trees in it, probably kept in boxes like in Versailles. I'm sure Arya's chapters in tWoW (or season 5 you never know) will reveal that the Sea Lords palace has an orangery like the one in Versailles.


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The text does not say so. The text says she relies on the stories of Viserys to reconstruct her past ("sometimes Dany would picture the way it had been, so often had her brother told her the stories"). She remembers bits and fragments. She remembers Ser Willam, and she remembers crying when the house with the red door closed behind her forever.

You can't remember stuff only because people have been telling you stories.. Dany recalls her time in Braavos, and she recalls her time on the run.

Well, these journeys continued til she was 12. So yeah. She remembers them pretty well, at least towards the end

Again, Dany was 13 years old when she was at Illyrio's.

And nowhere is it stated that she only remembers the travels towards the end.. In fact, she only speaks about those from the beginning..

Dead wrong. Viserys had wealth, which gradually dissipated over the course of his travels. There is nothing to indicate they never traveled by ship. Nor is there any sane reason to suppose that a toddler can identify the port that she sailed from, especially if she never sees that port again.

The servants had stolen what little money they had left, and kicked the children onto the streets. All the "wealth" Dany and Viserys had afterwards, came from stuff they had to sell, like Rhaella's crown. Perhaps they even had to sell gifts they had gotten from previous hosts... But when they left Braavos, they barely had anything. The servants stole what money there was left, after all.

And Dany was 5 years old when Darry got sick. He died reasonably fast, probably in the year that followed, around which time she would have been either 6 or close to 6. She was definitly not a toddler anymore.

Why on earth would she remember that? How on earth would she know the difference? I have no memory whatsoever of the trip to the airport that occurred when I was five years old. I MIGHT possibly have a vague memory of landing on the other side of the Atlantic. The idea that a small child can reliably remember the direction that a car, or boat, or plane is traveling (how? By looking at the sky? A compass?) is just mind-boggling.

Airplane and ship cannot be compared, now can they? Ships would usually stay within sight of the coast, I'd say, judging from the journeys mapped out on the Lands of Ice and Fire maps for other ship journeys made by characters. Which will give you landmarks to see. And what is that one landmark by which Braavos can be so very easily identified that is so well-known in the world? Hmm.. a Titan, perhaps? ;)

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Just to be clear, what inspired this question was that while re-reading AFFC I came upon Arya's arrival at Braavos where she thinks:



"They have no trees, she realized. Braavos is all stone, a grey city in a green sea." (Arya I, AFFC)



I thought this was at odds with Dany's childhood memories, and recalled hearing some theories about it. Thus, I posted this thread.



Apparently the "mighty" have trees in their courtyards and gardens, but lemon trees are unlikely to grow well there, so it seems an open question. I have no doubt that Dany is Aerys' daughter, but is there some other mystery here? Maybe, maybe not...



:)




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Apparently the "mighty" have trees in their courtyards and gardens, but lemon trees are unlikely to grow well there, so it seems an open question.




It really isn't. The Sea Lord just has an extensive orangery, where the citrus trees are stored when the weather is bad. When the season is favourable, the boxes with citrus trees are rolled out. Orangeries were invented in the Italian city states, on which George has modelled the Free Cities. We know they have clear glass to built greenhouses, and the Sea Lord is more than wealthy enough to pay for such extravagance.


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Of course it was in Braavos, probably in the Sea Lord's palace. All these theories about lemon trees not being able to be cultivated in Braavos are bullshit. We know trees are grown in the courtyards of the mighty, and the Sea Lord is the ruler of Braavos, of course his palace will have expensive trees in it, probably kept in boxes like in Versailles. I'm sure Arya's chapters in tWoW (or season 5 you never know) will reveal that the Sea Lords palace has an orangerie like the on in Versailles.

Really well put.

/thread.

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