Gneisenau Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 How do you measure how socialist a country is ? If you look the freedom rankings: http://www.heritage.org/index/ Sweden and UK and the USA have pretty similar scores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Iceman of the North Posted August 30, 2014 Share Posted August 30, 2014 How do you measure how socialist a country is ? If you look the freedom rankings: http://www.heritage.org/index/ Sweden and UK and the USA have pretty similar scores. There's nothing in modern social democratic doctrine that prevents economic freedom, rather the opposite. The aim of a "socialist" regime would be to maximise tax revenue to maximise the welfare, but to do that you need to ensure a highly productive economy which entails a fair degree of economic freedoms. You'd be expected to find government intervention in markets to "fix broken markets", ensuring proper competition and preventing non-natural monopolies and oligopolies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galactus Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I don't see how wage agreements made by people who voluntarily accept them can be considered minimum wage. Because the agreements create a floor. You can't offer a wage lower than the collective agreement, regardless if you're a party to the agreement or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdyphillip Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 How can there be any flaw to this logic? Wouldn't everyone rather live in Jackson Mississippi rather than London? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Flashheart Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 How can there be any flaw to this logic? Wouldn't everyone rather live in Jackson Mississippi rather than London? Bad food, worse weather, Mary fucking poppins? London. I guess I'd still take it over pretty much anywhere in Mississippi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Theda Baratheon Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I think i'll stay in the UK, thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdyphillip Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I think i'll stay in the UK, thanks Don't you live in an imaginary country that is only loosely associated with the UK through myth and legend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Scot A Ellison Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 HP,How can there be any flaw to this logic? Wouldn't everyone rather live in Jackson Mississippi rather than London?Been to both. I like London better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IheartIheartTesla Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Obviously I'd like to visit London more because I've always wanted to eat authentic Indian food, but as I grow older I find I cant stand the hurly=burly of a big city. Ideally a suburb that is on the outskirts of a big city. Oh, as for the economic analysis, I haven't paid too much attention to it. But I usually mistrust most such analysis - like all the arguments about what caused or cured the Great Depression or the lost decade for Japan, it is probably very contentious and most experts don't have a handle on the complete truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I think this thread title has Thatcher spinning in her grave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinDonner Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I think this thread title has Thatcher spinning in her grave.Shit. You think we should have stuck a few extra stakes in for good measure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Marquis de Leech Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Shit. You think we should have stuck a few extra stakes in for good measure? Or else stuffed in some extra garlic. Unless Cameron/Osborne's austerity policies include cutting back on protection against the undead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lessthanluke Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Don't you live in an imaginary country that is only loosely associated with the UK through myth and legend? I will fight you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Thursday Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Obviously I'd like to visit London more because I've always wanted to eat authentic Indian food, but as I grow older I find I cant stand the hurly=burly of a big city. Ideally a suburb that is on the outskirts of a big city. Oh, as for the economic analysis, I haven't paid too much attention to it. But I usually mistrust most such analysis - like all the arguments about what caused or cured the Great Depression or the lost decade for Japan, it is probably very contentious and most experts don't have a handle on the complete truth.[tangent]You don't really get authentic Indian food in London though, you get a British interpretation of what Indian food is supposed to be. It's very tasty and definitely worth eating, but there are a lot of differences to the real thing, or so I'm told (having not actually visited India I don't have first hand knowledge...)[/tangent] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Flashheart Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I will fight you.Use your words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lessthanluke Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Use your words. Words get you nowhere with this topic :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin Of House Hill Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Interesting article. I haven't assessed its veracity or the accuracy of its calculations, but the source seems credible enough. And yes, I know Britain is hardly the epitome of socialism, by European standards. But compared to the US, it is probably halfway to the North Korea side of the socialist spectrum. I do note the last sentence of the article, which I bolded for emphasis. Upon request, I've removed most of the article (which can be found at the link below) and just retained the concluding paragraphs. http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2014/08/25/britain-is-poorer-than-any-us-state-yes-even-mississippi/ Britain really is poorer than even the poorest of the US States, yes, including even Mississippi. One final point: while exactly this study may not have been done very similar ones have. I specifically recall someone making this comparison with Sweden a few years back. And theres a vast research program called the Luxembourg Income Study which exists to look at exactly these sorts of things. Even if exactly this study hasnt been done there things very like it have been as a part of that program. And the LIS is where Branko Milanovic is now based, its at CUNY, and its the research program that Paul Krugman has just been hired (at a quite lovely salary) to be the public face of. Milanovic will of course be doing the actual running of it. As an example of output from the LIS they had a wonderful paper a decade ago showing that the bottom 10% in the US have the same incomes (yes, PPP adjusted) as the bottom 10% in either Sweden or Finland. While the top 10% have very much larger incomes than the top 10% in either country. All that redistribution hasnt made the Nordic poor richer than the American poor but it has made the rich poorer. Ah, yes. Quoting a capitalist source to show that socialism sucks. That'll work. And yes, US rich are wealthier than their Nordic counterparts. But that assumes that wealthy worthless piles of shit like the Koch brothers or the Walton family are worth having, at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lacuna Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 I will fight you. Use your words. Or your magic pixie wings and fairy dust. Whichever. *runs away* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awesome possum Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 America, Fuck Yeah! Even our horrible miserable racist backwards poor states are richer than England! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltaran Posted August 31, 2014 Share Posted August 31, 2014 Since none of them are London, I expect the answer is yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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