Howland Reeds Weed Swamp Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Not exactly evil but he's not exactly a nice person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squire to Ser Pounce Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Painful experiments performed on living human beings (likely including vivisection), even if the man has no malice in his heart while doing so, is Grade-A immoral and evil. The fact that he reminds people of friendly grandfatherly types makes it extra creepy which is terrific (as in, I find him to be a terrific part of the ASoIaF cast), since dude's basically the Westerosi Josef Mengele. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brandon Umber Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Painful experiments performed on living human beings (likely including vivisection), even if the man has no malice in his heart while doing so, is Grade-A immoral and evil. The fact that he reminds people of friendly grandfatherly types makes it extra creepy which is terrific (as in, I find him to be a terrific part of the ASoIaF cast), since dude's basically the Westerosi Josef Mengele. Mengele is a perfect comp. Whether he is evil isn't up for debate he actively seeks out living bodies to experiment on. These experiments are basically an extended torture that ends with the death of said bodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Guy Garlan Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 I think he's weirdly, ironically, the only member loyal to Cersei of her small council. He was the only one who stood by her and didn't flee the city. Or maybe he just really wanted to play with his brand new life-sized action figure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 I find him to be very interesting, he's a cool villain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boarsbane Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 He is a trailblazer, meanwhile the fools at the Citadel are stuck in the past Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howland Reeds Weed Swamp Posted September 1, 2014 Author Share Posted September 1, 2014 This is where what GRRM says comes to use. Qyburn is a Maester actually progressing though and learning more about humans all the time. You never know. One day a plague could hit Westeros and Qyburn knows the exact cure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Imperator Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 This is where what GRRM says comes to use. Qyburn is a Maester actually progressing though and learning more about humans all the time. You never know. One day a plague could hit Westeros and Qyburn knows the exact cure. I actually like Qyburn. I wouldn't be surprised if Qyburn does indeed discover a lot of useful medical knowledge that will help human beings in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Isn't Qyburn the guy who cruelly experiments with people who has been sent to him unwilling and undeserving? Even Jaime, whose hand and life he saved thinks the dude is creepy and shouldn't be trusted. Why this guy has any kind of sympathy? Actually, what's with the recent tendency to try to justify monsters who wouldn't bat an eyelash about murdering children? Is some kind of late hipster trend that I missing that looks for empathy towards villains because human are oh-so-complicated-not-really-evil? Didn't get the memo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jobmartell Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Perfect Halloween costume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Doe Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Actually, what's with the recent tendency to try to justify monsters who wouldn't bat an eyelash about murdering children? Is some kind of late hipster trend that I missing that looks for empathy towards villains because human are oh-so-complicated-not-really-evil? Didn't get the memo. Such as Dany? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Second To Last Dragon Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Such as Dany?she's no monster!just a boring teenage girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Isn't Qyburn the guy who cruelly experiments with people who has been sent to him unwilling and undeserving? Even Jaime, whose hand and life he saved thinks the dude is creepy and shouldn't be trusted. Why this guy has any kind of sympathy? Actually, what's with the recent tendency to try to justify monsters who wouldn't bat an eyelash about murdering children? Is some kind of late hipster trend that I missing that looks for empathy towards villains because human are oh-so-complicated-not-really-evil? Didn't get the memo. uh i dont think anyone has sympathy for qyburn. he's barely a character, he's mostly just a plot device lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowford Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Isn't Qyburn the guy who cruelly experiments with people who has been sent to him unwilling and undeserving? Even Jaime, whose hand and life he saved thinks the dude is creepy and shouldn't be trusted. Why this guy has any kind of sympathy? Actually, what's with the recent tendency to try to justify monsters who wouldn't bat an eyelash about murdering children? Is some kind of late hipster trend that I missing that looks for empathy towards villains because human are oh-so-complicated-not-really-evil? Didn't get the memo. Aside from the obvious answer that, no, this is not a recent tendency, unless you count "basically all of literature" as "recent". More to the point, what makes Qyburn different is that no, actually, no one is looking for a sympathetic backstory for him. He was kicked out of the Citadel, but that's not really the source of much trauma. The fascination with Qyburn seems to be very similar to the fascination with Hannibal Lecter (the incarnation in the Silence of the Lambs movie). Or, and that's one of the few instances I actually approve of Nazi comparisons, the fascination some people still have for Josef Mengele or his thinly veiled stand-ins that crop up a lot (though I have to point out that I don't share it). Qyburn isn't sympathetic, he isn't to be pitied. There is no traumatic event in his past. He is doing it for science, and doesn't care how many corpses he leaves behind doing that. ETA: And I also think that this is a good opportunity to point out that no, Mengele's experiments didn't actually offer any useful contributions to medical science. So Qyburn clearly has the higher ground here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 ETA: And I also think that this is a good opportunity to point out that no, Mengele's experiments didn't actually offer any useful contributions to medical science. So Qyburn clearly has the higher ground here. Sadly, Mengele's experiments did contribute a lot to genetics and any expert in the field will tell you so. However, he is "the one who must not be named", so his name in almost never mentioned when his discoveries are academically discussed. And it shouldn't. He used human subjects, which allowed him to speed his research ahead of any global rival in a space of just few years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRANDON GREYSTARK Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 He is not evil, just your average mad scientist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crowford Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Sadly, Mengele's experiments did contribute a lot to genetics and any expert in the field will tell you so. However, he is "the one who must not be named", so his name in almost never mentioned when his discoveries are academically discussed. And it shouldn't. He used human subjects, which allowed him to speed his research ahead of any global rival in a space of just few years. Are you sure? I am not exactly well-versed in this, but from what I have heard Mengele's research never amounted to much (in scientific terms), because he suffered from massive confirmation bias and just ended up "proving" earlier anthropological theories that were flawed in itself. I am not saying he left no data at all, but I never got the impression that his experiments contributed to genetics in a meaningful way. However, I am aware of the whole issue of scientific findings from other Nazi scientists obtained through forced human experimentation being later used for scientific reference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Modesty Lannister Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Are you sure? I am not exactly well-versed in this, but from what I have heard Mengele's research never amounted to much (in scientific terms), because he suffered from massive confirmation bias and just ended up "proving" earlier anthropological theories that were flawed in itself. I am not saying he left no data at all, but I never got the impression that his experiments contributed to genetics in a meaningful way. However, I am aware of the whole issue of scientific findings from other Nazi scientists obtained through forced human experimentation being later used for scientific reference. Yep, I'm totally sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edd tollett:( Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 I like Qyburn as a character. He's a bit of a wildcard. I don't think he's loyal to anyone except himself and science, and right now cersie just because shes pretty much has given him free rain over the black cells (and the 4th basement) and a nice supply of test subjects. But I did see a theory on youtube that said he and the brave companies are and have been working for Doran Martell this whole time. It's kinda of crackpot but it was kinda interesting. I think it was called " the dornish masterplan" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edd tollett:( Posted September 1, 2014 Share Posted September 1, 2014 Just to be clear i know Qyburn is evil i just think hes an interesting character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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