Trogdor Targaryen Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 How would Jon have handled learning that Stannis and Mel used the power of the lord of light and kingsblood-magic to curse Robb to death? While we know that he would be supposed to behave diplomaticly, he doesn't always react in the most well thought out ways, and is a little shaky about certain parts of his NW vow. I cannot imagine that he would be acting with such loyalty to Stannis if he knew that information. On another note, I often wonder if Jon would have been more accepting his pardon from the NW and being legitimized if he had received word of Robb's will, instead of being offered a similar option by Stannis? Perhaps he would feel like less of a usurper if he got the offer of Winterfell from a Stark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble Maester Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Here I thought Walder Frey and Roose Bolton were responsible. That whole "kings and leeches" was Melisandre misleading Stannis via visions she had gotten before, reckon I. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Warning Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Roose Bolton killed Robb. Mel probably just saw their deaths in a vision, then served up the leeches as a way to convince him that blood rituals and sacrifice with Edric was the way to go. I'm sure Jon's already aware that Stan would have lopped off Robb's head if he was given the chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Santa of House Claus Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 First, love your user name! Second, I think this was a thread a few months ago. I am not sure exactly how Jon would react because I am not sure Jon would view that little leach ceremony as actually causing Robb's death. Jon certainly would not like the fact that Stannis wished Robb dead, but I do not really think Jon would view that as actually having a hand in Robb's betrayal and murder. As for how Jon would react about potentially getting Winterfell via Robb's will. I have no doubt that Jon wold have been much more willing to become a Stark and inherit Winterfell via Robb then Staninis for a few reasons, one, it is Robb, his brother who he loved, and two because he would have been allowed to keep the Old Gods through Robb's will. That was one of the conditions of Stannis' that Jon did not like, he did not want to burn the heart tree in Winterfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis's Lawyer Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Jon will never find out how Stannis killed Robb because Stannis did not kill Robb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheHouseHB Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 :bang: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Hodor Hodor of Hodor Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Roose Bolton killed Robb. Mel probably just saw their deaths in a vision, then served up the leeches as a way to convince him that blood rituals and sacrifice with Edric was the way to go. I'm sure Jon's already aware that Stan would have lopped off Robb's head if he was given the chance. :agree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trogdor Targaryen Posted September 21, 2014 Author Share Posted September 21, 2014 Why does nobody want to give the Gods any credit in this series. They all CLEARLY have real powers, but nobody seems to think they and their powers matter in the slightest. Stannis used blood magic, which is, according to several knowledgeable characters on the matter, the darkest and most powerful form of magic, especially when kingsblood is involved.Sure Roose Bolton killed Robb, at a wedding which was a trap set be Walder Frey, but I feel like the invisible hand of fate is guiding some of these events, particularly this one. House Claus, I'm sorry if I made a repeat Topic that has been discussed before. There are a lot of topics and it's hard to find the ones I'm looking to see if they exist, sometimes. I enjoy your username, as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble Maester Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Why does nobody want to give the Gods any credit in this series. They all CLEARLY have real powers, but nobody seems to think they and their powers matter in the slightest. Stannis used blood magic, which is, according to several knowledgeable characters on the matter, the darkest and most powerful form of magic, especially when kingsblood is involved.Sure Roose Bolton killed Robb, at a wedding which was a trap set be Walder Frey, but I feel like the invisible hand of fate is guiding some of these events, particularly this one. House Claus, I'm sorry if I made a repeat Topic that has been discussed before. There are a lot of topics and it's hard to find the ones I'm looking to see if they exist, sometimes. I enjoy your username, as well.Magic exists; gods, who knows?If Melisandre had magical king-blood-leeches she and Stannis would sure as heck use them to kill everyone on their way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis's Lawyer Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Why does nobody want to give the Gods any credit in this series. They all CLEARLY have real powers, but nobody seems to think they and their powers matter in the slightest. Stannis used blood magic, which is, according to several knowledgeable characters on the matter, the darkest and most powerful form of magic, especially when kingsblood is involved. Sure Roose Bolton killed Robb, at a wedding which was a trap set be Walder Frey, but I feel like the invisible hand of fate is guiding some of these events, particularly this one. Because 1. The Red Wedding was being planned long before the leech burning 2. There was no real sacrifice, which seems to be a requirement for blood magic 3. Why didn't Melisandre just use more leeches to kill Tywin, Roose, Mace, Tommen, Margaery, etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trogdor Targaryen Posted September 21, 2014 Author Share Posted September 21, 2014 They would have if Davos didn't smuggle away their secret stash of kingsblood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis's Lawyer Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 They would have if Davos didn't smuggle away their secret stash of kingsblood. Stannis's blood. Also, Florents are Gardener descendants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twenty of House Goodmen Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Even if Stannis is responsible for Robb's death, the only thing Jon can do is advise Stannis to attack the Dreadfort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maid So Fair Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I'm pretty sure Mel actually specifically admits that the three leaches were just a clever ploy, with no real magic involved. It was means to an end of making Stannis BELIEVE. As for the will reaching Jon this would make no difference to Stannis's offer as in that scenario the decision is purely Jon's - if he accepts and follows Robb's wishes, he would be the Lord of Winterfell and the King in the North, whether Stannis liked it or not. If he rejects the offer, like Aemon for example, the decision is still his and he would be unlikely to be swayed by an opinion of a stranger. Either way, it would have nothing to do with Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Santa of House Claus Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 House Claus, I'm sorry if I made a repeat Topic that has been discussed before. There are a lot of topics and it's hard to find the ones I'm looking to see if they exist, sometimes. I enjoy your username, as well. Oh that was not meant as a complaint, all these topics get recycled every few month. I'm pretty sure Mel actually specifically admits that the three leaches were just a clever ploy, with no real magic involved. It was means to an end of making Stannis BELIEVE. I think this is why everyone kind of dismisses the leaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolorous22 Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Yeah... Leeches being thrown into a fire does nothing other then to put on a show for Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drogon'sWrath Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Why does nobody want to give the Gods any credit in this series. They all CLEARLY have real powers, but nobody seems to think they and their powers matter in the slightest. Stannis used blood magic, which is, according to several knowledgeable characters on the matter, the darkest and most powerful form of magic, especially when kingsblood is involved. Sure Roose Bolton killed Robb, at a wedding which was a trap set be Walder Frey, but I feel like the invisible hand of fate is guiding some of these events, particularly this one. House Claus, I'm sorry if I made a repeat Topic that has been discussed before. There are a lot of topics and it's hard to find the ones I'm looking to see if they exist, sometimes. I enjoy your username, as well. For one, all we know for sure is that magic exists. That, in and of itself, neither proves nor disproves the gods. Now, for this particular example, Mel probably just saw their deaths in the flames. That would create the illusion that the red god had a hand in their deaths, when in reality it was just a mummer's show put on for Stannis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RainGhost Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I don't believe the leeches killed Robb. However, I'm sure Jon would be pretty pissed if he knew that Stannis and Mel were hoping and praying for Robb's death. But given Stannis's whole rant about how Robb was a rebel and traitor blablabla and all the 'one true king' stuff, it's not really difficult to come to the conclusion that Stannis wanted him dead. Jon seems to be pretending that's not the case though. As for the other question, Robb wanting Jon to inherit Winterfell is very different from Stannis offering it. Firstly, Winterfell was Robb's to give away, secondly Jon wouldn't feel guilty about taking something that wasn't his, thirdly he would want to fulfill his brother's last wish, finally he wouldn't have to betray his father's gods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis's Lawyer Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 I don't believe the leeches killed Robb. However, I'm sure Jon would be pretty pissed if he knew that Stannis and Mel were hoping and praying for Robb's death. But given Stannis's whole rant about how Robb was a rebel and traitor blablabla and all the 'one true king' stuff, it's not really difficult to come to the conclusion that Stannis wanted him dead. Jon seems to be pretending that's not the case though. Why would he be pissed? He already knows Stannis and Robb weren't best buddies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon's Queen Consort Posted September 21, 2014 Share Posted September 21, 2014 Stannis was the man in dark armor and a pale pink cloak spotted with blood who stepped up to Robb and said Jaime Lannister sends his regards? :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.