So what does everyone think of Ann Leckie's "Ancillary Justice?"

[Frey Filet]

I've read mostly good reviews, gotten recommendations from acquaintances, but need to hear from you guys before making the decision to read it... Give me your thoughts, good or bad!

[peterbound]

I'm sure I'll be the minority on this one, but I couldn't even finish it. The gender shit was clever, but the book wasn't that engaging. I found it dull as fuck, and had better shit to read at the time.

[Darth Richard II]

Eh, there's already a topic for this I thought.

And I have to disagree with my secret alt, I thought it kicked ass.

Don't get why the gender stuff got all the attention it did though, its more of a side thing.

[Errant Bard]

Old thread

You of course know it won the Hugo Award, Nebula Award, BSFA Award, Arthur C. Clarke Award and Locus Award, right? So some people have liked it.

I thought the gender stuff was irritating and often inconsistent, but it was a minor annoyance, the rest of the book was full of good and (relatively) original ideas, and not badly written. Overall it was a bit rought and unpolished, and the ending lacked a bit of oomph, and I would not put it on the same level as the best SF books ever, but it still was a nice read and better than most, plus the roughness can be excused as it was a debut book.

[Serious Callers Only]

It's ok. The

distributed schizophrenia

idea is really clever.

[peterbound]

Eh, there's already a topic for this I thought.And I have to disagree with my secret alt, I thought it kicked ass.Don't get why the gender stuff got all the attention it did though, its more of a side thing.

Maybe I'll give it another go.

[Denvek]

Eh, there's already a topic for this I thought. And I have to disagree with my secret alt, I thought it kicked ass. Don't get why the gender stuff got all the attention it did though, its more of a side thing.

I suspect that because the default one-size-fits-all pronouns were the ones we RL-English speakers consider to be the feminine ones, it got more attention than if it had used masculine pronouns for the Raadchai. And it wasn't completely a side thing - Breq was identified by plot-relevant people as Raadchai because she couldn't reliably identify the gender of everyone she met. But I'll admit it isn't that important on it's own, in that context it's simply a cultural difference that serves to reveal something Breq is trying to hide.

The idea of a networked intelligence continuing on after being collapsed down to one insufficient node, and another one

where different nodes aren't just working at cross-purposes but are explicitly working against each other

was much more interesting to me.

[RedEyedGhost]

I really liked the Emperors' (or what ever the title was) storyline. It kind of similar to what has begun happening in book four of The Dagger and the Coin. I'm definitely looking forward to book two.

[Serious Callers Only]

The idea of a networked intelligence continuing on after being collapsed down to one insufficient node, and another one

where different nodes aren't just working at cross-purposes but are explicitly working against each other

was much more interesting to me.

The concept has a real world parallel, byzantine faults. It also has a 'science' solution, of course.

Maybe that will be used on the sequel.

[DanielAbraham]

I liked it a lot. The point that I kept coming back to after I finished was the distributed consciousness and the question (for me) of whether all the nodes of that consciousness were really dead when they were inducted into the group mind or if the induction involves creating the belief that you are dead.

Having a main character who deeply and sincerely believes that they're dead was cool.

I'm looking forward to the next book.

[Mlle. Zabzie]

Also liked it a lot. I found the pronoun thing jarring at first, and initially thought the book was going to have a MESSAGE in a way that I hadn't signed up for. And then it took a sharp right turn and started asking really interesting questions about consciousness, power, "civilization", culture and what it means to be human. Agree it read like a debut, but that's ok, because it was. I am looking forward to the next one.

[Datepalm]

Glad to see i'm not alone on thinking the gender stuff was the less interesting concept of the book. I really enjoyed the wonderful knot of motivations, intentions and ideologies of distributed intelligences, though, yeah, it was ropey here and there.

[The_Wanderer]

Conceptually it's a brilliant book. It reminded me of The Left Hand of Darkness because of the way it explores gender, and it reminded me of Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? because of the way it explored what humanity is? Emotionally I was expecting more, but this is a debut novel, and for a debut it's great.

[polishgenius]

I really liked it. It gave me quite a Banksian vibe, which is never a bad thing. Like others have said, the gender stuff was overblown in the hype - not that it was bad or uninteresting, for me, but it was less an exploration of gender roles and more just an additional little note of strangeness in that society compared to ours.

I think I said it in a previous topic, but the fact that a spiteful medic deliberately booted up a unit with a bad singing voice was more plot important than whether anyone was a man or a woman. And perhaps that was the point, but it didn't really do any significant exploration of the subject or anything.

Whereas the distributed consciousness stuff was very good, and like others I'm looking forward to the next one which comes out soon.

[williamjm]

I really liked it. It gave me quite a Banksian vibe, which is never a bad thing.

Agreed, although I think if Banks had written it then it would probably have been better in some respects but we can't necessarily expect a debut author to be able to match one of the greatest SF authors.

I thought it was a good book with some great ideas, although as others have send the bits about gender weren't the most interesting part of the story. I thought some of the supporting characterisation could have been a bit better, although that might be a side-effect of the story being told from the perspective of a character who doesn't really understand other characters all that well. I think Lieutenant Awn was one of the few characters I really cared about other than the protagonist herself, but that might because she's one of the few characters that Breq really cares about.

I think the most thought-provoking bit about the gender pronouns is that I seem to have mentally assigned genders to various characters myself and I can't really explain why I made those choices about who was what. Based on previous discussions other people did the same thing but made different decisions about who was really male and female.

Surprisingly, I found a copy of Ancillary Sword in Waterstone's today, even though Amazon.co.uk say it won't be published for another week, so I'll probably start reading that soon. Hopefully it is similar quality to the first novel.

[David Selig]

Very good novel. It reminded me strongly of Banks and Le Guin's work, which is always a good thing. The ending was quite weak though. All awards it won were a bit baffling since it's hardly a masterpiece for the ages, on the other hand it's still better than most recent winners, so no big deal.

But it's still absurd that it beat a (future) Booker award finalist and PEN/Faulkner award winner for the Nebula. ;)

[Darth Richard II]

Meh, the booker can eat my poop.

[Bastard of Godsgrace]

But it's still absurd that it beat a (future) Booker award finalist and PEN/Faulkner award winner for the Nebula. ;)

Bah, both can't hold a candle to A Stranger in Olondria, IMHO ;)

[MinDonner]

I think the most thought-provoking bit about the gender pronouns is that I seem to have mentally assigned genders to various characters myself and I can't really explain why I made those choices about who was what. Based on previous discussions other people did the same thing but made different decisions about who was really male and female.

This is much like my view - the gender stuff is not that interesting in itself, so much as for what it did to my thought-processes while reading it; kept finding myself trying to "work out" what gender all the characters were, rather than just accepting that it didn't matter, which shed some uncomfortable light on my inbuilt assumptions. And it does tickle me to see a love story in which we have no idea of the gender of either participant.

[Errant Bard]

For some reason I assumed everyone was female except for the loser Breq finds (male), the hero (neutral) and the emperor (neutral). Heroine Awn, bitch officer posse, hypocritical "princess" "friend", rumoured gal who disobeyed and did not shoot that alien, captain of the JoT, etc, all women.

Now that leaves me to wonder why I preferred not to see an arrogant, classist, racist, self destructive, confrontational loser who gets beaten into submission by the hero, literally, as a woman. It's something worth reflecting about, good call, thanks for bringing it up.