GoldHandTheGood Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 The problem with people thinking she deserves the WOS is that she's not being punished for her actual crimes, she's only being punished for being sexual. In the books and show, yes, she's being punished due to an archaic and misogynistic notion that she is not allowed her own sexual agency. However, if someone is saying they feel she deserves the WOS, I highly doubt it's due to them agreeing with the high septon on the morality of female sexual agency, but rather Cersei's actual crimes. If you recall, Cersei got caught out by the faith whilst trying to frame Margaery for similar crimes, again centered around a woman's sexual agency. You can see then why people, men and women alike, might have very little sympathy for Cersei's plight, regardless of the legitimacy or fairness of the punishment. So when people say she deserved it, it's probably due to the fact that she herself had no problem throwing Margaery into basically the same situation, along with the general fact that she's quite a contemptible human being. Now of course, in regard to the show, this all depends on how they play the buildup to the walk, whether it's like the books or not. But of course, I must be wrong, it's clearly just cos she's a woman! :bang: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 In the books and show, yes, she's being punished due to an archaic and misogynistic notion that she is not allowed her own sexual agency. However, if someone is saying they feel she deserves the WOS, I highly doubt it's due to them agreeing with the high septon on the morality of female sexual agency, but rather Cersei's actual crimes. If you recall, Cersei got caught out by the faith whilst trying to frame Margaery for similar crimes, again centered around a woman's sexual agency. You can see then why people, men and women alike, might have very little sympathy for Cersei's plight, regardless of the legitimacy or fairness of the punishment. So when people say she deserved it, it's probably due to the fact that she herself had no problem throwing Margaery into basically the same situation, along with the general fact that she's quite a contemptible human being. Now of course, in regard to the show, this all depends on how they play the buildup to the walk, whether it's like the books or not. But of course, I must be wrong, it's clearly just cos she's a woman! :bang: Well I just don't think anyone deserves that type of sexual humiliation and abuse even if its a sexist like Cersei. I mean I'm fully prepared for people saying that she "deserves" it but those people just need to stay a 100000 miles away from me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldHandTheGood Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 Well I just don't think anyone deserves that type of sexual humiliation and abuse even if its a sexist like Cersei. I mean I'm fully prepared for people saying that she "deserves" it but those people just need to stay a 100000 miles away from me I don't think anybody deserves it either, regardless of how horrible a person they may be. It is a terrible form of punishment for any person to have to go through, and I do hope they do the scene justice, and show that despite Cersei's many crimes, the ordeal she goes through is something no person ever should have to. However I can understand why many people would feel she deserved it, especially if they do go down the line of Cersei's dwarf killing, giving pets to Qyburn, and her various other misdeeds from AFFC and ADWD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 I don't think anybody deserves it either, regardless of how horrible a person they may be. It is a terrible form of punishment for any person to have to go through, and I do hope they do the scene justice, and show that despite Cersei's many crimes, the ordeal she goes through is something no person ever should have to. However I can understand why many people would feel she deserved it, especially if they do go down the line of Cersei's dwarf killing, giving pets to Qyburn, and her various other misdeeds from AFFC and ADWD. well duh but those people are missing a point imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldHandTheGood Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 well duh but those people are missing a point imo Perhaps, but I wouldn't call them misogynists, no more than I'd call people sexist for feeling Theon deserved castration after killing the two miller's boys. It's a horrible thing to happen to anyone, but I can see why people wouldn't feel sorry for him considering his previous crimes. Are they being narrow-minded and callous? Probably, but not necessarily sexist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 Perhaps, but I wouldn't call them misogynists, no more than I'd call people sexist for feeling Theon deserved castration after killing the two miller's boys. It's a horrible thing to happen to anyone, but I can see why people wouldn't feel sorry for him considering his previous crimes. Are they being narrow-minded and callous? Probably, but not necessarily sexist. The fact that Cersei's punishment is SO public (High Sparrow is making a statement to all Westerosi women, its not just about Cersei) and so inherently feminine (them shaving her hair to take away her beauty) does make me think that there is some internalized misogyny there with people saying she deserved it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairGrowsBack Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 Well I just don't think anyone deserves that type of sexual humiliation and abuse even if its a sexist like Cersei. I mean I'm fully prepared for people saying that she "deserves" it but those people just need to stay a 100000 miles away from meWell it's a good thing you are fully prepared, because we've already had people from a serious (or supposedly so) podcast stating (re the Sept scene)she deserved to get raped / that it didn't matter because "it's Cersei" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 Well it's a good thing you are fully prepared, because we've already had people from a serious (or supposedly so) podcast stating (re the Sept scene)she deserved to get raped / that it didn't matter because "it's Cersei" name of podcast? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldHandTheGood Posted October 14, 2014 Share Posted October 14, 2014 The fact that Cersei's punishment is SO public (High Sparrow is making a statement to all Westerosi women, its not just about Cersei) and so inherently feminine (them shaving her hair to take away her beauty) does make me think that there is some internalized misogyny there. The high Septon is sexist, by nature of the faith being patriarchal in its hierarchy, and of the religious and moral values he holds. The law in Westerosi society is naturally sexist, as it's based off of real Medieval history, as the Faith is based off the Christian church in our own world. People saying they think she deserves it are not necessarily being sexist just because the punishment is sexist. A lot of it is simply that they do not feel empathy for a character who is quite sexist and sadistic herself, however, you're right, some people might be looking at it from a sexist angle, and it is unfortunate that that is the case. I just simply wouldn't put all those people who will feel the walk is what Cersei deserves for her own crimes in the same box as misogynists, the same way I wouldn't call someone who felt Theon's castration was what he deserved was sexist, due to the punishment being centered around his male gender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairGrowsBack Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 name of podcast?Pretty sure it's What the Flick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 Pretty sure it's What the Flick oh yeah I actually knew about them already. lol idgaf most of them are morons anyways especially those fools cenk and ben Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ho Ho Hodor Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 lol if this were Jaime being walked out naked it would be just as humiliating... I hate all of this mysogeny talk because it is meant to strip a human down to their bare being to demonstrate the point that their status in life doesn't mean anything.. Cersei tried to do things much worse and got caught in a lie but what was done to her before then (the waking every hour by the septas) was wayyy worse as a form of torture then walking naked through the square this is a silly argument because a man being walked naked would still have the same effect if it was Tywin Lannister.. shame shame on the sinner would make Tywin's guts curl I have no problem with them doing this scene in privacy so it has more effect when viewing but I really don't care about it that much... I feel Cersei burning the tower of the hand is more provoking then this.. other than her shame of being seen with stretch marks and sagging breasts Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairGrowsBack Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 ^ No, it's meant to shame her sexually because she dared fuck people who were not her husband. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mo123 Posted October 15, 2014 Share Posted October 15, 2014 Cersei is clearly an awful person, as are many people in GOT/ASOIaF, but clearly (hopefully) most of us here do not condone this kind of medieval punishment for anyone. However, this is a fantasy story that takes place in a world that is based off of medieval society where public humiliation was a common occurrence. Just because this happens in the story does not mean the writer is endorsing this kind of punishment. It is just another example of the many awful things that took place in medieval society (and still in many modern societies). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beric175 Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 I don't want this kind of punishment being dealt out for any sort of acts because we should hate the sin, not the sinner and humiliating the sinner is awful in any situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tywin Manderly Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 ^ No, it's meant to shame her sexually because she dared fuck people who were not her husband. The rest he left unsaid. Cersei was soiled goods now, her power at an end. Every baker's boy and beggar in the city had seen her in her shame and every tart and tanner from Flea Bottom to Pisswater Bend had gazed upon her nakedness, their eager eyes crawling over her breasts and belly and woman's parts. No queen could expect to rule again after that. In gold and silk and emeralds Cersei had been a queen, the next thing to a goddess; naked, she was only human, an aging woman with stretch marks on her belly and teats that had begun to sag … as the shrews in the crowds had been glad to point out to their husbands and lovers. Better to live shamed than die proud, Ser Kevan told himself. "My niece will make no further mischief," The Walk of Shame was designed by the High Sparrow, with the connivence of Kevan Lannister, to remove Cersei from the national stage as a political actor for good by making her a moron in the eyes of the public and then banishing her to Casterly Rock for the duration of her life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonBranRickon Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 Why would anyone waste their time putting todays morals on yesteryears fantasy show? All men of era were sexist. The punishment is fitting because she used her sex to manipulate the entire realm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoldHandTheGood Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 Why would anyone waste their time putting todays morals on yesteryears fantasy show? All men of era were sexist. The punishment is fitting because she used her sex to manipulate the entire realm. :agree: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shockwave Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 anyone know if Cersei will be bald as well in the version they shot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lion_Eyes Posted October 16, 2014 Share Posted October 16, 2014 anyone know if Cersei will be bald as well in the version they shot? In photos I seen of it Lena Headey wore a really short wig - not quite bald :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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