Jump to content

Fantasy series with multiple viewpoints and toned-down magical elements - recommendations ?


Syhle

Recommended Posts

Hi everyone,


I'm new here and I would like to get recommendations on what to read now that I've read ASOIAF.


I'm 27 and I've read quite a lot since I was a child and started reading fantasy when I was a teenager : Harry Potter first then His Dark Materials, Robin Hobb (The Liveship Traders are my favorite), Ursula le Guin (loved Earthsea), Terry Goodkind (liked it at first then hated it, too cliché and poorly written), of course TLOTR and The Silmarillion, Zelazny (enjoyable), Eddings (meh)...


I knew ASOIAF was an excellent series but I didn't want to start reading since I knew it wasn't finished and I would be more than eargerly waiting for the following books. Well then the TV series started, and I wanted to watch it (I would have seen character's faces anyway in the media and maybe spoilers), and I hate watching a movie/TV series without having read the book (can't properly imagine the characters in my head if I've already seen them), so...I've read the books.


Man was I hooked. One of the best series I've ever read. I read it 3 times, discovering new things each time (prophecies and little details and stuff, R+L=J...). I've started coming here to see what the theories were and what people thought about the books, the show...


And now I don't know what else to read in fantasy. I've tried The Wheel of Time since I saw some recommendations here but it took me 2-3 weeks to finish book 1 because I found it so boring and cliché. I also read The Pillars of the Earth (fun to read but not that good) because I realised that what I like now in fantasy is the medieval-ish world more than the magic and goblins and trollocs and whatnot.

So I've read several threads in this forum and I've come with a list of series but it's very long (I've excluded the ones I've already read and some that didn't seem to fit my liking). Here it is (some are rated since they seem to come up a lot)



Greg Keyes' The Kingdom of Bone and Thorn

Acacia trilogy by David Anthony Durham +++

First Law trilogy by Joe Abercrombie +++

Patrick Rothfuss's Kingkiller series +

Gentleman Bastards by Scott Lynch ++ The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch

Daniel Abraham's The Dagger and the Coin

Prince of Thorns by Mark Lawrence

Philippa Gregory

Malazan Book of the Fallen by Steven Erikson ++

The Prince of Nothing R Scott Bakker ++ The Second Apocalypse - R. Scott Bakker

Sara Douglass - Wayfarer Redemption trilogy

Coldfire Trilogy by C.S. Friedman

Ann McCaffrey, PERN

Elizabeth Haydon, Symphony of Ages

Jacqueline Carey's Kushiel Trilogy +++

Juliet Mariller's Sevenwater's trilogy

Tad Williams's Memory, Sorrow, Thorn series

Paul Kearney's The Monarchies of God series

Monarchies of God by Paul Kearny

Sunsword (Michelle West) ++

Ursula Le Guin's Gifts/Voices/Powers trilogy +++

Ellen Kushner's Swordspoint & Privilege of the Sword

The Book of the New Sun By Gene Wolfe

The Fencer Trilogy - KJ Parker




I am french and I can't peruse the books in a library or bookstore to see if I like the writing or the storytelling (I want to find them in english and our foreign libraries are not very extensive - and even if I wanted to read them in french I don't know if all of these series have been translated anyway). So I would like to select some (4-5) out of that list.


I'd like your advice on this :

- first what I really, really like is when the story is told from multiple points of view

- I also like good and extensive character building and world building (preferably a medieval world)

- not too dark/gritty

- nothing poorly written (english is not my mother tongue so I can't always judge but stuff like Terry Goodkind made me cringe)

- little magic or fantasy beings, more political plots and war, evolving rapidly (and I don't mind about romance if it's not too cheesy)

- a writer that doesn't hesitate to kill off characters (it's so boring when you know that the main characters will always escape)



Thank you very much for your help (sorry if this post was too long or too descriptive about me but I really need to start another fantasy series that I like since I'm going crazy over thinking about ASOIAF - I do read other books, classics mostly, but I like to alternate between them and fantasy books).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think Dagger and Coin might fit best with what you are looking for. Medieval setting. Low magic. Multiple viewpoints. (Also consider Abraham's other finished work, The Long Price Quartet.)

First Law also meets those criteria.

I like Gentlemen Bastards, but there aren't a ton of viewpoints in that. Similarly, I enjoyed the Warlord Chronicles by Cornwell, but there is just the one viewpoint.

I enjoy Malazan and Bakker quite a bit, but they are both very high magic settings.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Commenting on the following, I have not read the rest:

  • Greg Keyes' The Kingdom of Bone and Thorn
  • Acacia trilogy by David Anthony Durham +++
  • First Law trilogy by Joe Abercrombie +++
  • Patrick Rothfuss's Kingkiller series +
  • Gentleman Bastards by Scott Lynch ++ The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch
  • Malazan Book of the Fallen by Steven Erikson ++
  • The Prince of Nothing R Scott Bakker ++ The Second Apocalypse - R. Scott Bakker
  • Ann McCaffrey, PERN
  • Paul Kearney's The Monarchies of God series
  • Ellen Kushner's Swordspoint & Privilege of the Sword
  • The Book of the New Sun By Gene Wolfe
Elimination game:

good and extensive character building and world building (preferably a medieval world)

nothing poorly written

evolving rapidly (and I don't mind about romance if it's not too cheesy)

None seem out, really, though some worlds are less medieval than others (looking at you PERN and New Sun), and well written is very much a opinion varying for person to person, for best sellers like this.

Multiple point of views, are out:

  • Patrick Rothfuss's Kingkiller series +
  • Gentleman Bastards by Scott Lynch ++ The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch (hey, It has some shifts, but I don't think it meets with the spirit of "multiple PoVs" thing)
  • Ann McCaffrey, PERN
  • Ellen Kushner's Swordspoint & Privilege of the Sword
  • The Book of the New Sun By Gene Wolfe
not too dark/gritty. Oh boy, here we go. Are out:
  • Greg Keyes' The Kingdom of Bone and Thorn
  • Acacia trilogy by David Anthony Durham +++
  • First Law trilogy by Joe Abercrombie +++
  • Malazan Book of the Fallen by Steven Erikson ++
  • The Prince of Nothing R Scott Bakker ++ The Second Apocalypse - R. Scott Bakker
  • Tad Williams's Memory, Sorrow, Thorn series
  • Paul Kearney's The Monarchies of God series
  • The Fencer Trilogy - KJ Parker (havent read it, but damn, it's KJ Parker!)
little magic or fantasy beings. Are out:
  • Greg Keyes' The Kingdom of Bone and Thorn
  • Acacia trilogy by David Anthony Durham +++
  • Patrick Rothfuss's Kingkiller series +
  • Malazan Book of the Fallen by Steven Erikson ++
  • Ann McCaffrey, PERN (borderline but, heck, the whole story is about mfing dragons teleporting around)
  • Malazan Book of the Fallen by Steven Erikson ++
  • The Prince of Nothing R Scott Bakker ++ The Second Apocalypse - R. Scott Bakker
more political plots and war,
  • Patrick Rothfuss's Kingkiller series +
  • Gentleman Bastards by Scott Lynch ++ The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch
  • Ann McCaffrey, PERN (what war?)
  • Ellen Kushner's Swordspoint & Privilege of the Sword (it's romance with some swordsplay, ffs)
  • The Book of the New Sun By Gene Wolfe (there is *some* politics, but "politics and war?" nope, not the books you're looking for)
a writer that doesn't hesitate to kill off characters (it's so boring when you know that the main characters will always escape)

Seems to contradict your "not too dark/gritty". If you are seeing main character deaths, you are not in carebear land anymore. Anyway, most of those I've read kill some characters, notable exceptions being:

  • Patrick Rothfuss's Kingkiller series +
  • Ann McCaffrey, PERN
  • Ellen Kushner's Swordspoint & Privilege of the Sword
  • The Book of the New Sun By Gene Wolfe
So, that means you should not read any of the books I have read....

Mais bon, franchement, ça serait dommage de ne pas lire au moins TLOLL, qui est un roman de cape et d'épée, à la base, avec des éléments fantastique, et super fun à lire. Le reste, bah, si tu ne veux pas de truc trop noir ou déprimant, c'est sûr que je ne vais pas recommander de lire Abercrombie, Bakker, Kearney, Erikson ou Parker, bien que ce soit les gros auteurs dans la catégorie "epic fantasy". Durham et Keyes sont en dessous au niveau qualité, je trouve.

Je dirais qu'au delà de Lynch, Abraham peut être un bon choix avec sa série The Long Price, bien que ça manque de PoV et de batailles que tu retrouverais dans les bouqins plus noirs.

I'll say, if you must choose five, choose them because they don't meet your criteria, each in a different way, and maybe one will hook you like ASOIAF did. In my opinion you should try, for example:

  • Gentleman Bastards by Scott Lynch ++ The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch
  • Ann McCaffrey, PERN
  • Paul Kearney's The Monarchies of God series
  • Ursula Le Guin's Gifts/Voices/Powers trilogy +++
  • The Book of the New Sun By Gene Wolfe
  • And see what floats before going to the usual Abercrombie/Bakker/Abraham and so on.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Your list includes a lot of quality work, and it is also very popular work.



Eventually you might also want to include some more obscure books that I think fit your criteria and are well written.



Two good books from Gene Wolfe are his Soldier series, about Latro the Hellene who has a form of amnesia.





Lois McMaster Bujold has a series set in an Iberian pre-Renaissance world with limited magic.





Harry Harrison's three books with "John Holm" (Tom Shippey) of the Hammer and the Cross are another good option, featuring politics and maybe a clash of the gods or maybe just a clash of cultures in Northern Europe in the Middle Ages.



The Hammer and the Cross


One King's Way


King and Emperor



Harry Turtledove, writing as Dan Chernenko, has written The Scepter of Mercy series. Like a lot of his fiction, the stuff he writes under his pen names seems to be of better quality than the popular works sold under his own name.



The Bastard King


The Chernagor Pirates


The Scepter's Return


Link to comment
Share on other sites

Welcome to the forum. :)



I have not read that much fantasy either, so I just want to comment on your mentioning



Philippa Gregory


because as far as I know, none of her work counts as fantasy. At least I would not call any of her novels I have read as fantasy. I have read her The Other Boleyn Girl, White Queen, The Queen's Fool, The Boleyn Inheritance and a half of that novel about the gardener that I just looked up and seems like the original title is Earthly Joys (I read most of them in translation). And as far as I can remember, only the White Queen had some sort of a magicky mythical backstory that might be described as a fantastical element, but it really does not have any impact on the plot.


Only the Boleyn Inheritance fulfills your requirement for mulitple POVs.


And I do not find them to be really well written and realistic in the description of politics either, especially I think in the White Queen I remember thinking that the main character was less of a competent politician than dear Queen Cersei Baratheon, and she still somehow ended up well all the time, so :dunno: The Other Boleyn Girl might have been the best of them. (Or maybe it is just that I have read it first, years ago and my taste in literature has developed somewhat before I have read the others.) They are good entertainment, but not very high quality literature.



So yeah, if you are trying to find a good fantasy series with multiple POVs and realistic mediaeval setting and character building, you might want to scratch that off your list.


Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am french and I can't peruse the books in a library or bookstore to see if I like the writing or the storytelling (I want to find them in english and our foreign libraries are not very extensive - and even if I wanted to read them in french I don't know if all of these series have been translated anyway). So I would like to select some (4-5) out of that list.
I'd like your advice on this :
- first what I really, really like is when the story is told from multiple points of view
- I also like good and extensive character building and world building (preferably a medieval world)
- not too dark/gritty
- nothing poorly written (english is not my mother tongue so I can't always judge but stuff like Terry Goodkind made me cringe)
- little magic or fantasy beings, more political plots and war, evolving rapidly (and I don't mind about romance if it's not too cheesy)
- a writer that doesn't hesitate to kill off characters (it's so boring when you know that the main characters will always escape)

From outside your list I think Adrian Tchaikovsky's recently-completed 10 book series Shadows of the Apt seems to fit quite well with your criteria, although it might depend on your definition of fantasy beings, it certainly doesn't have traditional fantasy beings.

I agree with other people's recommendations of The Dagger and the Coin, Long Price Quartet and Chalion series.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with other people's recommendations of The Dagger and the Coin

Wait, this is the one with dragons, 12 races, magic swords, talking human dog hybrids, spider blooded priests, and magic mind control, right?

Just want to make sure we are clear on the 'light' magic elements.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Your list includes a lot of quality work, and it is also very popular work.

Eventually you might also want to include some more obscure books that I think fit your criteria and are well written.

Two good books from Gene Wolfe are his Soldier series, about Latro the Hellene who has a form of amnesia.

Soldier of Arete (1989) Locus Fantasy and WFA nominee, 1990

Lois McMaster Bujold has a series set in an Iberian pre-Renaissance world with limited magic.

Paladin of Souls (2003) (sequel to The Curse of Chalion) Hugo, Nebula and Locus Fantasy Awards winner, 2004

The Hallowed Hunt (2005) Locus Fantasy Award nominee, 2006

What about these books are obscure? I think you mean 'different'. They are far from obscure and, as the litany of awards behind the names suggest, very popular.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

What about these books are obscure? I think you mean 'different'. They are far from obscure and, as the litany of awards behind the names suggest, very popular.

As Darth Richards said, these aren't the sort of books that are the source of endless streams of threads on this forum.

But you are correct, they are not, or at least were not when published, obscure. Perhaps I should have used the phrase "currently popular on this site".

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wait, this is the one with dragons, 12 races, magic swords, talking human dog hybrids, spider blooded priests, and magic mind control, right?

Just want to make sure we are clear on the 'light' magic elements.

I'm interpreting the request as being for something with a similar level of magic to ASOIAF and although it's perhaps debatable I'd say the D&C series is roughly comparable. ASOIAF also has dragons, non-human races, supposedly magical weapons and priests with magical abilities although some of those elements might be more obvious in the D&C books (particularly the non-human races). It's definitely a lot lighter in terms of the magical elements than some of the other series they mentioned in their post like Wheel of Time or Malazan.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yeah, I was thinking in terms of world destroying fireballs and such... D&C is light on those.

Sure, take out the scene with a dragon in flight lighting the fuck out of a bunch of spider priests attempting to brainwash a king which their magical mind controlling powers, and I'll agree with you. It's not Malazan level KEWL magic use, but it's still there.

The same goes for george. People try to down play how much, or how important magic is in Westeros, but it's pretty damned important, and much more prevalent than people want to admit. I think they want to try and assign some literary significance to ASoIaF and they can't do that when it's just a book about dragons, magic swords, and and creepy ice zombies.

It's there, and it's not downplayed, it's pretty damned important.

Saying that, i'll agree, there are varying degrees of magic 'use' in the genre, and his is a little more sophisticated, but it's not hidden.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

After reading ASoIaF I went through a "oh my god what am I going to read next" phase, three years ago. What got me out of it was the First Law trilogy by Joe Abercrombie. It's different from ASoIaF in that the characters are way more grey, while on GRRM's series you can tell which side is the "good" side pretty easily, in First Law world that's a lot harder to do. Who are the good guys, and who are the bad guys? Abercrombie's battle scenes are excellent, very well written and not hard to follow. His book follows six PoV characters, each chapter is told from one of those PoVs, like in ASoIaF. The magic usage is low, and the world is gritty, most of the characters are very cynical. There's a dry humor in these books that I really enjoyed. From what you said, I think you'll like this series, if you don't mind the grittiness.



As for wanting a sample of the books you want to read, you should check Amazon's "look inside" feature, clicking on the cover of the book. Even if you don't have a Kindle, you can read the first few pages of a book to get a feeling of the style and the story. I do have a Kindle, but being able to read a sample of the books I'm interested in helps me decide what to buy.


Link to comment
Share on other sites

May I suggest the Baroque Cycle by Neal Stephenson? It's got 3 POV characters, is so light on the magic that it could classify as historical fiction, and is a little gritty without being too dark. It's well written, but some readers don't like it because it's a little too intellectual: One of the POVs focuses on science and another focuses on trade, only the third focuses on adventure.


Link to comment
Share on other sites

As Snowborn said, Amazon is a good source of samples. In fact, you can download a Kindle sample (usually a couple of chapters) and read it using a free Kindle Reading App on your computer or phone. This is usually enough to give you a good feel for a writer's style and whether or not you want to read the book.

I find it really useful, because I also lack easy access to physical copies of English-language books.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...