Diplomacy Midlands: Turn 5 Months 13-15 Summer

[Bright Blue Eyes]

If you look at the last turns, you'll notice that Nox and Nog have prepared that stunt for four or five turns already.

[Leonardo]

Also what happens to land movement for navies now that they have both seafarers and feeble?

[Bright Blue Eyes]

3 land regions = 8 sea regions. Or out of the 8 sea movement, each land region takes 2,66 in a mixed route.

[Nox Irradiata]

The individual breakdown, including moves after landing, is in the rulebook under Army And Combat.

[Leonardo]

The individual breakdown, including moves after landing, is in the rulebook under Army And Combat.

Nm its there

I don't think its really fair they move over a large sea distance AND 3 moves after landing, otherwise feeble may as well not be there

[Nox Irradiata]

There are no situations listed where someone with both Seafarers and Feeble can move 3 moves after landing. The most they can get is 2 land moves (and that's only if they've moved 3 or less sea spaces). 4 sea spaces, and they get 1 land move. 5 or more sea spaces, and they get 0 moves.

[Leonardo]

Aye I was just making sure ;D

[TheCrannogDweller]

Eh limited how? 6 castles in one turn doesn't really strike me as limited, and it doesn't seem complex to flip land for building. I'm not saying we change anything about it mid game, I just think its a little humorous to read the discussion topic about ways to help discourage large alliances and trading land and men

Trading men is now pretty much impossible.

Trading resources has been severely limited.

Trading land has also had a restriction placed on it.

I understand your desire to limit the power of big alliances (and I share it, to an extent), but in this case it is completely misplaced. Those 6 castles have been painstakingly planned since before turn 1 started - and Nox and I are the only people involved in their creation.

[Leonardo]

Trading men is now pretty much impossible.

Trading resources has been severely limited.

Trading land has also had a restriction placed on it.

I understand your desire to limit the power of big alliances (and I share it, to an extent), but in this case it is completely misplaced. Those 6 castles have been painstakingly planned since before turn 1 started - and Nox and I are the only people involved in their creation.

Nox's income is 8/10

The order cost 14/12

Hence I thought it worth asking because I am not keeping track of banks turn to turn, as that's a 6 resource discrepancy

Another important question: other houses who colonize in the westerlands or crownlands also suffer the same penalties correct?

[TheCrannogDweller]

Nox's income is 8/10

The order cost 14/12

Hence I thought it worth asking because I am not keeping track of banks turn to turn, as that's a 6 resource discrepancy

It's not a discrepancy - it's savings.

Another important question: other houses who colonize in the westerlands or crownlands also suffer the same penalties correct?

Of course not. The colonization penalty for the Houses in the Westerlands was meant to balance the additional Gold they are getting for being there - and I mean the Regional Silverfingered trait, not the mines that can be built.

[Nox Irradiata]

If you counted my build order this turn, and looked at how much my build order was last turn, it's pretty obvious.

And your second question has been discussed several times within the last couple of pages. You don't get the inherent traits of any given region just by taking land (whether through colonizing, or conquering) there. The only thing that works that way is the buildable items, whose bonuses are available to anyone owning land in the region (gold mines, farms, trading posts, no embarkment). The only exception is Blood Of Old Valyria, which isn't transferrable by taking land in the Crownlands, but requires a players' capital to be there.

[Nox Irradiata]

I'm going back to sleep. 'Night, folks.

[Lord Syv Aldlark]

No one can receive 6 resources from someone else; if the move isn't legal it won't happn- simple.

Also if she has received resources from someone else than she doesn't have to disclose it; nor do I as it would be a secret trade.. and we've discussed secret trades as not being disclosed to the public :)

How the regions work:

Vale: Anyone who builds a castle gets an extra turn of siege. Anyone who builds a port here gets a trading post. Anyone with a capital here suffers feeble.

Riverlands: Anyone with land here can build a farm on that land. Anyone with a capital here gets an extra food per turn. Anyone with a capital here suffers Upjumped Stewards

Crownlands: Anyone who builds here gets the craftsmen trait. Anyone with a capital here gets Blood of Valyria. Anyone with a capital here suffers from fearful smallfolk

Westerlands: Anyone with land here can build a mine. Anyone with a capital here has automatic silverfinger trait.Anyone with a capital here suffers from fearful smallfolk.

Iron: Anyone who has troops here suffers no embarkment penalty. Anyone with a capital here has the seafarer trait. Anyone with a capital here has the reaver trait. Anyone with a capital here suffers from feeble.

Feeble applies to seafarer once they hit land; so every movement they could do overland is minused by 1. As it says right above the naval movements.

While the Ironislands seemed buff; their economic perk((reavers)) involves them raising troops, building a port and attacking someone where as all the other economic perks are reliant on just building.

Otherwise no one had any objections to regional perks before the game, and before sign ups. I asked in the first post for sign ups that if anyone wanted to discuss the rules to please do so as they were not set in stone yet.

As such can we move on? If someone would like to ask what a certain thing means by all means ask; but discussing what is fair/not fair right now in the middle of the game only causes disruption and unnecessary back and forth. We can change the rules next game; just like we've done at the end of every game so far.

[Leonardo]

If you counted my build order this turn, and looked at how much my build order was last turn, it's pretty obvious.

And your second question has been discussed several times within the last couple of pages. You don't get the inherent traits of any given region just by taking land (whether through colonizing, or conquering) there. The only thing that works that way is the buildable items, whose bonuses are available to anyone owning land in the region (gold mines, farms, trading posts, no embarkment). The only exception is Blood Of Old Valyria, which isn't transferrable by taking land in the Crownlands, but requires a players' capital to be there.

...No it hasn't been discussed. In the vale you get feeble, and on the iron isles you can embark without penalty, so clearly there are region bonuses tied to the map that can apply to any house. The same has been implied in regards to colonization from fearful smallfolk as well as other bonuses like non crownlanders still getting the castle bonus from building within the crown lands, otherwise there are a shitton of penalties for settling the land around you and absolutely none for settling in other regions, which would be ridiculous. It would actually promote people to set up satellite states in other regions or just abandon the idea of settling neighboring regions to your starting one.

I contest on both accounts as there is no way to even have known people outside the respective regions could colonize without penalty in aforementioned regions from the rule set we've been given, and in fact the total opposite is implied. Most traits are in fact tied to the land itself, not the house's starting position, the same as last iteration, and fit with the balance of the game.

[Bright Blue Eyes]

Quite the opposite. I knew and I'm not the only one.

Could we please stop the bitching about the rules in the middle of the game and just play?

[Leonardo]

And no, most of what is detailed in your post is not what is implied from the rules on wattpad, which is the only real version we have aside from sorting through several pages of an old topic, which mind you is filled with threads of thought that never really get a good conclusion :/

I'm not saying we change stuff now, but I can speak for more than just myself when I say there was no way to know the specifics of this from what we've been given, and the fact that regional traits worked much the same last game; very few were tied to the capital; feeble should apply to every army in the vale, or what is the point of penalizing just them? The rest of the traits are much the same

[Nox Irradiata]

You only get Feeble from the Vale if your capital is there.

Edit: Nvm.

[Leonardo]

Quite the opposite. I knew and I'm not the only one.

Could we please stop the bitching about the rules in the middle of the game and just play?

Could you guys please stop being so hostile over said game and simple debate?

Obviously I'm not the only one seeing the issues here and you guys have started to become pretty shitty about us having some legitimate concerns and just asking about some game flow issues that aren't quite clear.

[Nox Irradiata]

Ya apparently they just like giving each other land out west. I'll be sure to recruit several people to give me lands in the future MAHUUU

This was what started the irritability for me, personally. Also, the fact that people are crawling up my ass about where income comes from, when it's very obvious if you look at the preceding turns.

[Leonardo]

This was what started the irritability for me, personally. Also, the fact that people are crawling up my ass about where income comes from, when it's very obvious if you look at the preceding turns.

I wasn't being accusatory, merely asking in case it had been forgotten. Its not easy to paw through pages of topics ;D

I apologize if it came off as so; I'm merely pointing out that in terms of game balance, most of the traits were implied to be the way I've described from folks I've talked to, otherwise everyone would have been colonizing differently because its an easy way to dance around negative traits, which we all agreed was a bad thing.

Feeble should be anyone in the vale much like the stormlands debuff last game. That's the only way the trait makes sense

Let's all just take a minute to also remember this is a young game; if it were something easy to balance it would have been done already, and the cycles of it are too long to simply say "to hell with it remember for the next"