Faydra Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 With proof I have no doubt that she would recognize his claim... but given the way things are, they're very likely to end up dancing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Pepsi_Cupps Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 The "mummer's dragon" thing gets overused - it could mean Aegon, it could mean Dany. Whoever wins will have proven the other one to have been just a mummer's dragon. I can't see Aegon winning though, and not only because Dany has dragons. He has doom written all over him. He was "raised to be a king" (Varys says it precisely to mean that he sees it as a duty, not a right; but regardless, do we believe the boy who was raised to be a king will end up a king?), he is so skilled, so brave, so handsome... I mean what could possibly go wrong??And his main advisor and commander just brought grayscale to Westeros. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 By the time Dany comes to Westeros, she will be quite convinced that fAegon is a Blackfyre pretender due to the information she will collect (like Tyrion, Tattered Prince etc.) in addition to her visions. If we disregard all the visions and evidences about fAegon being fake and assume that Dany comes to Westeros under these conditions, would she bend knee to him? I am also assuming that she will unite the khalassars and sack/conquer Volantis/Pentos and a lot of cities. Would Dany say "Oh my rightful king is alive. Here are dragons, here are my soldiers and here is the vast fortune I collected by sacking countless cities. Take them all. By the way, if you had not married Arianne, I could have married you. Nevermind the fact that I killed my first husband and my second husband was killed by this guy who wanted to marry me. BTW, did I mention that my first husband killed my brother (who was my rightful king for the time being) when he demanded his crown/host?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Tiger Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 They would fight, simply because it would make for a lot more interesting book if they did Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Greg of House House Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 I can't see Aegon winning though, and not only because Dany has dragons. He has doom written all over him. He was "raised to be a king" (Varys says it precisely to mean that he sees it as a duty, not a right; but regardless, do we believe the boy who was raised to be a king will end up a king?), he is so skilled, so brave, so handsome... I mean what could possibly go wrong??And his main advisor and commander just brought grayscale to Westeros. Yes. If one of the things Martin wants to discuss is how you forge the perfect king, certainly he will come up with a better idea than "Let Varys train him!". Dany and Jon are much more likely to be considered sensible monarchs. Though it's never that simple. If it was, Egg should've been a great king. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 The "mummer's dragon" thing gets overused - it could mean Aegon, it could mean Dany. Whoever wins will have proven the other one to have been just a mummer's dragon. I can't see Aegon winning though, and not only because Dany has dragons. He has doom written all over him. He was "raised to be a king" (Varys says it precisely to mean that he sees it as a duty, not a right; but regardless, do we believe the boy who was raised to be a king will end up a king?), he is so skilled, so brave, so handsome... I mean what could possibly go wrong??And his main advisor and commander just brought grayscale to Westeros.Agree on some, but greyscale was already in Westeros. Shireen, for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoamingRonin Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 The "mummer's dragon" thing gets overused - it could mean Aegon, it could mean Dany. No, it can't possibly mean Dany. Perhaps it doesn't mean Aegon (but it does) but there's no way it means Dany. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walkingWITHcersei Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 If and i mean if she believed he was real, which ain't happening so relax the dragons will dance, she'd just marry him easy peasy lemon squeezy. But that ship sailed long ago. I gave up predicting the ending long ago (oh no i said long ago maybe I'm the Nights King) but I'm absolutely certain it's not ending with those two married and ruling the realm together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mithras Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 The "mummer's dragon" thing gets overused - it could mean Aegon, it could mean Dany. Whoever wins will have proven the other one to have been just a mummer's dragon.I can't see Aegon winning though, and not only because Dany has dragons. He has doom written all over him. He was "raised to be a king" (Varys says it precisely to mean that he sees it as a duty, not a right; but regardless, do we believe the boy who was raised to be a king will end up a king?), he is so skilled, so brave, so handsome... I mean what could possibly go wrong??And his main advisor and commander just brought grayscale to Westeros. “In Volantis they use a coin with a crown on one face and a death’s-head on the other. Yet it is the same coin. To queen king her him is to kill her him." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Pepsi_Cupps Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 Agree on some, but greyscale was already in Westeros. Shireen, for example.We still don't know the deal with Shireen's case, as it doesn't spread (I know there are theories this is just lulling us into a false sense of security).JonCon just contracted it, it's spreading, which (unless I'm mistaken?) means it's contagious.Val's freakout about Shireen may be just a red herring. JonCon acting hastily because of his new greyscale (he admits this) will definitely have major consequences involving greyscale. So I think he will start an epidemic.Poor Shireen might end up in the flames because people freak out over JonCon's epidemic, when she wasn't even dangerous to anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 Yes. If one of the things Martin wants to discuss is how you forge the perfect king, certainly he will come up with a better idea than "Let Varys train him!". Dany and Jon are much more likely to be considered sensible monarchs. Though it's never that simple. If it was, Egg should've been a great king.A) Varys could actually be a good choice.b ) Varys didn't train him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Greg of House House Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 A) Varys could actually be a good choice.b ) Varys didn't train him. I mean that in a broad sense, if it is really Varys' masterplan. I know the boy was with Illyrio then JC. It's just the idea that you can "train" the perfect monarch simulating the conditions of a humble person + highborn education. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 I mean that in a broad sense, if it is really Varys' masterplan. I know the boy was with Illyrio then JC. It's just the idea that you can "train" the perfect monarch simulating the conditions of a humble person + highborn education.Varys is the man who posed the 'three men in a circle' metaphor. I think he has a better understanding of what power is and how it works than almost anyone in the series I can think of.As for the training, that's the central thrust of many Arthurian tales. I suppose what you mean is that it's idealistic to think it will work, but RL monarchs have been trained along similar lines...for example every Ottoman leader had to master a trade, to be able to earn a living were he not leader. Prussian leaders and some Germanized British Monarchs were essentially raised like they were in boot camp. In a more modern context, the Kennedy Boys were very much raised according to a formula their father had created to train them to be Presidents, though imo it worked best on the one it was least intended for (Bobby)Etc.The idea of trying to achieve a specific combination of factors in a ruler via his training isn't just the stuff of fairy tales. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veltigar Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 If she believes him, she'll bend the knee and follow him (as long as he doesn't do anything that hurts her freedmen). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Greg of House House Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 Varys is the man who posed the 'three men in a circle' metaphor. I think he has a better understanding of what power is and how it works than almost anyone in the series I can think of.As for the training, that's the central thrust of many Arthurian tales. I suppose what you mean is that it's idealistic to think it will work, but RL monarchs have been trained along similar lines...for example every Ottoman leader had to master a trade, to be able to earn a living were he not leader. Prussian leaders and some Germanized British Monarchs were essentially raised like they were in boot camp. In a more modern context, the Kennedy Boys were very much raised according to a formula their father had created to train them to be Presidents, though imo it worked best on the one it was least intended for (Bobby)Etc.The idea of trying to achieve a specific combination of factors in a ruler via his training isn't just the stuff of fairy tales. Fair enough. I'm not saying that Aegon would be a terrible king. I know Varys is not stupid. If we look at the last kings, he would probably fare better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibzit Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 She would only bend the knee if they married, and she would only marry him if her dragons like him.It also depends on how much of westeros aegon has by the time dany lands, if he allready somehow has it all or the majority united i doubt she would attack him, when they could marry and she would be queen with no struggle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRANDON GREYSTARK Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 She is going to fight regardless . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falstaff_Stark Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 I think Martins thrust on kingship is that it's a horrible form of government. Some good men made bad kings, and some good Kings were bad men. Then, you have to endure boy kings, madmen, and religious nuts. If you open up succession to selection, you still cause havoc. When did that succeed for long in history? the Good Emperors made it, what 5 successions before Commodus? Even with education, agreement, and careful political support, monarchy fails. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Arryn Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 I think Martins thrust on kingship is that it's a horrible form of government. Some good men made bad kings, and some good Kings were bad men. Then, you have to endure boy kings, madmen, and religious nuts. If you open up succession to selection, you still cause havoc. When did that succeed for long in history? the Good Emperors made it, what 5 successions before Commodus? Even with education, agreement, and careful political support, monarchy fails.What system has a better/longer record? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleFinger Posted October 26, 2014 Share Posted October 26, 2014 The Galactic Senate went on for a long time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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