Wealth and Power of House Velaryon

[Denam_Pavel]

I think Robert greatly stripped the Velaryons of power and priviliges, just like the Conningtons and the Darrys, but they were so powerful to begin with it didn't seem all that remarkable till we knew the full history.

[Moondancer]

Hey, that's probably how the Targaryen saw it. Those people saw themselves as close to gods, resorted to incest to keep their blood pure, and then that bastard-born Alyn comes and impregnates a Targaryen princess, making not one but three bastards...can you imagine their outrage?

I can't imagine their outrage because the Targ princess was half a Velaryon herself and was betrothed to that bastard-born fella. :)

[Ser Lepus]

I can't imagine their outrage because the Targ princess was half a Velaryon herself and was betrothed to that bastard-born fella. :)

Alyn Velaryon never married Elaena Targaryen, as far as I know. Their children were bastards.

And it's a very different thing to have a Targaryen marrying a Velaryon (the Targaryen have sometimes intermarried with lesser noble houses, like the Plumms or the Dondarrions) and to have Alyn making bastards with a Targaryen princess. Many people would think that the Velaryon were outreaching, forgotting their proper place as vassals.

[The Red Widow of Coldmoat]

Alyn Velaryon never married Elaena Targaryen, as far as I know. Their children were bastards.

They weren't married, no, but Elaena had hoped to marry Alyn before he was lost at sea (also they had two children, not three). Keep in mind that Alyn had already been married to a Targaryen, Elaena's aunt Baela (who we can assume was dead at this point as Eleana had hoped to marry Alyn)

[Baela of Pentos]

Alyn Velaryon never married Elaena Targaryen, as far as I know. Their children were bastards.

And it's a very different thing to have a Targaryen marrying a Velaryon (the Targaryen have sometimes intermarried with lesser noble houses, like the Plumms or the Dondarrions) and to have Alyn making bastards with a Targaryen princess. Many people would think that the Velaryon were outreaching, forgotting their proper place as vassals.

Alyn was much trusted by Daeron l the Young Dragon during his conquest of Dorne also. House Velaryon may not be as rich as Sea Snake's days but definitely held sway at court for a while still.

[Wmarshal]

Alyn Velaryon never married Elaena Targaryen, as far as I know. Their children were bastards.

And it's a very different thing to have a Targaryen marrying a Velaryon (the Targaryen have sometimes intermarried with lesser noble houses, like the Plumms or the Dondarrions) and to have Alyn making bastards with a Targaryen princess. Many people would think that the Velaryon were outreaching, forgotting their proper place as vassals.

Alyn married Baela though, a king's sister.

[Waters Gate]

I think their greatest loss came with the extinction of the dragons.

The Velaryons became rich bcause of tolls levied on the sea area's around them. They could effectivly enforce this in the past, before Aegon's consuest i figure the targaryan dragons were emplyed to keep control over the sea's around them to make this forcing off toll succesfull, and the valaryons with their ships would have been the ones taking the payment in hand and pushing a good chunck trough to the Targaryans. As a means of income for dragonstone. The Velaryons remained well connected with the iron throne in the first century after the conquest, and they had dragons in the family at various points, as such i would have thought that the Velaryons would have still been able to levy their toll on trade understood as being backed by dragons in this, and no trader wants to see his ship burn i guess.

With the dragons going extinct, the tool that would have enforced a load of shipping to pay toll to the Velaryons would suddently be gone, and merchants might now risk it to try to slip past Velaryon ships. The income of the velaryons would have dropped gruaduatly and their fleelts get harder to maintain. Then there were wars too.

[Lord Thaeglei of Frostpyre]

The Velaryons became rich bcause of tolls levied on the sea area's around them. They could effectivly enforce this in the past, before Aegon's consuest i figure the targaryan dragons were emplyed to keep control over the sea's around them to make this forcing off toll succesfull, and the valaryons with their ships would have been the ones taking the payment in hand and pushing a good chunck trough to the Targaryans. As a means of income for dragonstone. The Velaryons remained well connected with the iron throne in the first century after the conquest, and they had dragons in the family at various points, as such i would have thought that the Velaryons would have still been able to levy their toll on trade understood as being backed by dragons in this, and no trader wants to see his ship burn i guess.

I believe that it is not the tolls that made House Velaryon the richest house in the Seven Kingdoms, but rather, it was the wealth Lord Corlys Velaryon brought back from his many travels that made the Velaryons richer than the Lannisters and Hightowers..

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

They lost their Valyrian blood, and they lost their wealth and might. I think they would have similar wealth to the Celtigars.

Yeah the Velaryons have lost so much.

They didn't lose their Valyrian blood. They were always Valyrian and they're still Valyrian.

[AtomixIGN]

There is always Aurane Waters and his fleet out there in the Stepstones. If he plays his cards right he just may be able to parlay his fleet of massive wardrummonds into a legitimization and some solid love for his house.

Side Note - I hope whomever wins gets rid of Master of Ships and replaces with two posts, Lord Admiral of the Narrow Sea and Lord Admiral of the Summer Sea. I mean - there are 4 Wardens.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

They didn't lose their Valyrian blood. They were always Valyrian and they're still Valyrian.

Source of blood sorry. The Targaryens.

[Wmarshal]

Source of blood sorry. The Targaryens.

The targaryens aren't the only Valyrians around, nor we're their blood that pure.

[sertravisredbeard]

Their money seemed very "new money"ish in our-world speak. The Sea Snake and Oakenfist both cleaned up a few times on some sea voyages, but those riches couldn't have lasted more than a few generations. The Lannisters and Hightowers both have huge regions that have been economically developed by them. Probably every industry in Lannisport and Oldtown pours a little bit of its earnings into the Lannister and HIghtower coffers. The Velaryons could have developed like this, but by 300 AC they don't seem to hold much influence. The Velaryons were just one extra Crownland house that supported Stannis. From the text they didn't seem that much more important than the Masseys and the Bar Emmons.

We know their wealth and economic development got hindered during the Dance of the Dragons with the destruction of Hull and Spicetown. A couple more calamities like that probably furthered their descent. One dumb heir could have wasted all the treasure and influence the Sea Snake and Oakenfist had amassed during their times.

[Fire Eater]

I think their wealth slid down after the Dance with Spicetown destroyed to the point it was never rebuilt, and the riches Corlys brought from the east being burned at High Tide. That, and the Velaryons may have sided with Daemon in the Blackfyre Rebellion given he was a Velaryon through his maternal grandmother, resulting in them losing more.

Source of blood sorry. The Targaryens.

The Velaryons are Valyrian in origin. TWOIAF confirms that.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

We already knew they wre Valyrians.

I meant marriages and the sort. Not actual blood.

After teh targs tehy were stuck marrying Rambtons and Stauntons and Celtigars and Sunglasses and Masseys. No more Targs.

[Dimples]

We already knew they wre Valyrians.

I meant marriages and the sort. Not actual blood.

After teh targs tehy were stuck marrying Rambtons and Stauntons and Celtigars and Sunglasses and Masseys. No more Targs.

The Celtigars are also Valyrian.

[Wmarshal]

We already knew they wre Valyrians.

I meant marriages and the sort. Not actual blood.

After teh targs tehy were stuck marrying Rambtons and Stauntons and Celtigars and Sunglasses and Masseys. No more Targs.

The Celtigars are also Valyrian.

Not to mention the Stauntons, Sunglasses and Masseys all likely have more Valyrian blood then most of the Targs matchs post Daeron.

[Dimples]

Not to mention the Stauntons, Sunglasses and Masseys all likely have more Valyrian blood then most of the Targs matchs post Daeron.

That seems to be quite an exaggeration to me, but it's true that they probably do have a good deal of Valyrian blood.

[Lord Thaeglei of Frostpyre]

We already knew they wre Valyrians.

I meant marriages and the sort. Not actual blood.

After teh targs tehy were stuck marrying Rambtons and Stauntons and Celtigars and Sunglasses and Masseys. No more Targs.

House Velaryon no need to confine their marriage prospects with just the other noble houses in Westeros though Celtigars are also Valyrian in origin and the Daynes may pass for dragonlords.. The are still many noble families of Valyrian descent in Essos such as the Maegyrs and Vaelaros of Volantis or the Rogares of Lys (family of Queen Larra, mother to Aegon IV, Queen Naerys and Aemon the Dragonknight).. The Velaryons might have chosen to intermarry with these houses instead, which also probably explain why their influence waiver in recent years -- they might have chosen to "keep their bloodlines pure" rather than to seal dynastic and political connections, seeing that the current Velaryons still have the silver hair and purple eyes of ancient Valyria..

[SeanF]

They surely lost wealth and influence over the years, but a lord who brings hundreds of men and four warships, when summoned to war, is still pretty powerful. On a par with the Florents, say.