GRRM is in the middle of TWOW

[mormont]

There was a thread on this exact topic that was locked a week back presumably because it led to GRRM bashing. So tread lightly.

In fact, that thread was locked because it reached 20 pages and also because people wandered off-topic (into discussion of the merits and flaws of the TV adaptation, for example).

However, bashing of GRRM could get a thread locked. That's distinct from legitimate criticism of his writing pace. What we will tolerate is reasonable criticism of GRRM's writing: what we won't is any personal criticism or commentary, including speculation about his health, lifespan, lifestyle, alleged ulterior motives, etc.

[Takiedevushkikakzvezdy]

Has Webster's defined "middle" so exactly?

Middle is more like anywhere between 0.00001% to 99.99999% done.

Or 100% done but only 83.723819% done with rewrites.

GRRM has has said that he doesn`t have to do many rewrites for TWOW.

[midi]

ho-hoh-hoo people expecting the book as soon as 2016... oh sweet summer child.

If you think 2016 is a realistic estimate, you havent been paying attention...

[The One And Only]

If he was even 80% finished, I doubt he would refer to being in the middle.

My guess is that the book will be released in 2017.

[SweetPea]

ho-hoh-hoo people expecting the book as soon as 2016... oh sweet summer child.

If you think 2016 is a realistic estimate, you havent been paying attention...

ADWD took 5 years to write. Why is the same so unrealistic for TWOW? My personal guess is 2017, but I could see it released a year earlier.

[midi]

ADWD took 5 years to write. Why is the same so unrealistic for TWOW? My personal guess is 2017, but I could see it released a year earlier.

Because he has been working on a bunch of time intensive side projects (GOT, AWOIAF...). Because the writing pace has constantly slowed down, and it was 6 years for ADWD not 5. Not to mention he already had a bunch of ADWD ready as he was writing AFFC because he was initially writing it as one book. Still it took 6 years to get it out.

Because he has giving no interviews saying he is even close to being finished with TWOW. For 2016 release he would have to have most of it ready by now given all the edits he is going to do before release.

[Mithras]

Actually ADwD took a lot more than 5 years. George wrote the first ADwD chapters along with AFfC.

[Squab]

And at the end of AFFC he said it would be a year, didnt he? Oops.

There was one that came out quickly, probably ASOS, i cant remember. That one was good.

2017 sems to be a common guess with lots of graphs and analysis. Some a little earlier. 2022 or 2023 for last one is common too

[jet199]

GRRM tends to write a chunk of one POV at a time. So he will be in the middle of the book for the POV the deaths will occur in but he will be further ahead in some POVs (maybe even finished some) and might still have some POVs which need more work. GRRM does not write the chapters in chronological order so his being in the middle of the book does not translate as having written half the book.

[SweetPea]

Because he has been working on a bunch of time intensive side projects (GOT, AWOIAF...). Because the writing pace has constantly slowed down, and it was 6 years for ADWD not 5. Not to mention he already had a bunch of ADWD ready as he was writing AFFC because he was initially writing it as one book. Still it took 6 years to get it out.

Because he has giving no interviews saying he is even close to being finished with TWOW. For 2016 release he would have to have most of it ready by now given all the edits he is going to do before release.

That's true, but he also had a bunch of TWOW ready, as plenty of stuff was edited out of ADWD, and he's since stopped working on side projects. There's no Meereeneese knot either.

[Elm Tree]

I'm probably way too optimistic, but I think TWOW could still come out in 2015, if he wants it too. I mean, considering he published AGOT, ACOK, ASOS and The Hedge Knight al between 1996-2000 he could really surprise us.

[Princess That Was Promised]

I read the name of this topic and had a little heart attack

[ChillyPolly]

Some say that "in the middle" is an ideom for "working on it" and not a litteral middle.

That's exactly what it means, IMHO.

But, even if it does mean "roughly 50% done", I am surprised that people are disappointed by this. Is no-one aware that our last meaningful update had him with only 168 pages submitted to his editor, with one additional chapter (or more?) confirmed as roughly complete, as of July 2014?

If he is really now roughly 50% complete, then I would say he has had a good few months on Book 6 since he completed work on TWOIAF. But for all I know, he may still be stuck at roughly 200 completed pages, for whatever reason.

[Rho'd Berth]

GRRM had stopped all side projects and would not visit GOT sets for 2014 b/c he would be working on TWOW.
Then he said maybe early 2015 he would be ale to visit the set.

To me that translated like: "I hope to have finished TWOW by the end of 2014/early 2015 so that I can visit the sets in 2015".
I mean, it makes no sense to skip set visits in 2014 b/c of TWOT and then visit it in 2015 anyway despite of TWOW.

What am I missing here?

[Jo cool]

I think (well I hope) "in the middle"=in the process and not some linear measurement of progress.

[Maid So Fair]

GRRM had stopped all side projects and would not visit GOT sets for 2014 b/c he would be working on TWOW.

Then he said maybe early 2015 he would be ale to visit the set.

To me that translated like: "I hope to have finished TWOW by the end of 2014/early 2015 so that I can visit the sets in 2015".

I mean, it makes no sense to skip set visits in 2014 b/c of TWOT and then visit it in 2015 anyway despite of TWOW.

What am I missing here?

Life doesn't always go as we plan? GRRM is notorious at underestimating how much time it will take him to write something.

[SevasTra82]

I think people would feel better about waiting if they just got periodic updates on where it currently stands. Its hard for fans to go year after year without any meaningful updates on where the Book is. Without knowing, it leads to questions, concerns, and people freaking out, making up erroneous things.

I wish more writers would give their fans updates. I think it would help GRRM avoid getting the same "when is it coming out" question over and over again.

[Cas Stark]

GRRM had stopped all side projects and would not visit GOT sets for 2014 b/c he would be working on TWOW.

Then he said maybe early 2015 he would be ale to visit the set.

To me that translated like: "I hope to have finished TWOW by the end of 2014/early 2015 so that I can visit the sets in 2015".

I mean, it makes no sense to skip set visits in 2014 b/c of TWOT and then visit it in 2015 anyway despite of TWOW.

What am I missing here?

He didn't stop all side projects. He went out to promote the Ice and Fire book and he's doing other events. He's doing these events at the exact same time he would have been visiting the GOT set for the coming season. Now, maybe the set visits are more than just visits and so they sap more time and energy than just appearance at events and interviews, but still....he certainly isn't at home writing.

[ChillyPolly]

GRRM had stopped all side projects and would not visit GOT sets for 2014 b/c he would be working on TWOW.

Then he said maybe early 2015 he would be ale to visit the set.

To me that translated like: "I hope to have finished TWOW by the end of 2014/early 2015 so that I can visit the sets in 2015".

I mean, it makes no sense to skip set visits in 2014 b/c of TWOT and then visit it in 2015 anyway despite of TWOW.

What am I missing here?

Reading comprehension?

Seriously, even if he had said that he "hopes" to have finished TWOW by 2015 (which he did NOT say) anyone who knows his history knows that "hope" means "hope" in the sense of "I hope that when I wake up tomorrow morning I will find that my muse has suddenly gone on a rampage and the magical elves of my subconscious have done my work for me while I slept, but right now it's just not happening." "Hope" is not a progress update, nor even a reasonable or likely expectation.

He never made any promise to stop all side projects; or not to visit the sets until Book 6 was completed. He never even said he would not be writing a season 6 script.

He probably has a contractual obligation to HBO to at least appear to be somewhat involved and approving. A set visit costs him little.

[ChillyPolly]

I think people would feel better about waiting if they just got periodic updates on where it currently stands.

We did. A total of 168 manuscript pages submitted to his editor as of July 2014, with at least one chapter fairly complete but not submitted. Feel better now?