Daenerys at the end of A Dance of Dragons

[Isobel Harper]

Obviously, don't read this unless you've read all five books.

I guess this is just a theory-buster, but oh well...

I've noticed several people theorizing that Dany has the Bloody Flux. I don't have direct quotes from ADWD to post, but her being sick with this disease should not be possible. First, during her POV while taking care of her people with the Bloody Flux, she recalls Viserys having told her that Targaryens are immune, or at least very resistant, to disease. Also, she remembers never having been sick as a child. Second, in Dany's last POV, it does crosses her mind that she might have the Bloody Flux when she feels pain and sees blood, But then, in her own inner-monologue, it reveals that she's only menstruating.

I'd just like to point this out because I've noted multiple posts stating that she has the Bloody Flux.

[The guy from the Vale]

Obviously, don't read this unless you've read all five books.

I guess this is just a theory-buster, but oh well...

I've noticed several people theorizing that Dany has the Bloody Flux. I don't have direct quotes from ADWD to post, but her being sick with this disease should not be possible. First, during her POV while taking care of her people with the Bloody Flux, she recalls Viserys having told her that Targaryens are immune, or at least very resistant, to disease. Also, she remembers never having been sick as a child. Second, in Dany's last POV, it does crosses her mind that she might have the Bloody Flux when she feels pain and sees blood, But then, in her own inner-monologue, it reveals that she's only menstruating.

I'd just like to point this out because I've noted multiple posts stating that she has the Bloody Flux.

Viserys also told Dany that Targaryens were resistant to fire... and died because he got crowned with a crown of molten metal. I wouldn't put any stock in his statements.

More to the point, several Targaryens died in the Great Spring Sickness, and Greyscale was, according to legend, a curse on the Valyrians (including Targaryens). If anything, more Targaryens have managed to die of either sickness or fire than of any other cause of death...

Also, Dany recognizes she has fever - but how should she recognize fever if she never had fever before? So she's been sick before... and indeed she was sick at the end of AGoT.

ETA: Not saying she definitely has the flux, but it's far from impossible. Indeed, it is pretty plausible to think so.

[Isobel Harper]

Also, Dany recognizes she has fever - but how should she recognize fever if she never had fever before? So she's been sick before... and indeed she was sick at the end of AGoT.

I wasn't considering that, but again, that could have been a side effect from what MMD did.

[IRON BANK]

dany contracted the bloody flux from drinking the river water. The mixture of the poison berries and sickly river water caused a vision, After that her menstruation returns. showing she is back to her old self.

[Lord Damian]

Dany is not immortal but her menstruating is possible. Would that not contemplate things if she births a child either by Reznak or Daario at this point in the story?

[Forever May]

I think she is just reflecting she might be sick because she was too stupid to realize she was pregnant and miscarried. Although I haven't read the chapter for a while and might have the timing around the wrong way? Anyway, I think she got sick to show how useless she was without her handmaids. I doubt she will suffer from the bloody flux and die from it. Dany has a lot to do in the story right now. The prophecy states her going to the Mother of Mountains and stuff, so she can gather a horde to storm Westeros, kill the men, rape the women, and enslave the children like Drogo promised her ages ago. And then she can get sick and die.

[Isobel Harper]

Dany is not immortal but her menstruating is possible. Would that not contemplate things if she births a child either by Reznak or Daario at this point in the story?

Well, if she's menstruating, not much chance of her being pregnant, is there. ;)

dany contracted the bloody flux from drinking the river water. The mixture of the poison berries and sickly river water caused a vision, After that her menstruation returns. showing she is back to her old self.

The question is, did she ever stop menstruating? MMD said she would be infertile, but I'm not sure if she ever stopped having a menstruation.

[The guy from the Vale]

I wasn't considering that, but again, that could have been a side effect from what MMD did.

That's only if you believe MMD caused Dany's miscarriage, which is not all that clear. Moreover, childbed fever is a thing in Westeros; an infection after a miscarriage does not require a supernatural explanation.

Generally speaking, I would advise against swallowing the image of themselves the Targaryens propagandized; we've been told far too many cases of said propaganda being patently false (Rhaenyra, Aegon II, Aegon V, Duncan, Aerion, Viserys III all died in fire; Daeron II and his heirs died of the Great Spring Sickness...)

[Isobel Harper]

I think she is just reflecting she might be sick because she was too stupid to realize she was pregnant and miscarried. Although I haven't read the chapter for a while and might have the timing around the wrong way? Anyway, I think she got sick to show how useless she was without her handmaids. I doubt she will suffer from the bloody flux and die from it. Dany has a lot to do in the story right now. The prophecy states her going to the Mother of Mountains and stuff, so she can gather a horde to storm Westeros, kill the men, rape the women, and enslave the children like Drogo promised her ages ago. And then she can get sick and die.

Isn't she infertile though? If not, then that might explain why she was so moody in Meereen. :wideeyed:

[The guy from the Vale]

Isn't she infertile though? If not, then that might explain why she was so moody in Meereen. :wideeyed:

That's one possible reading of Mirri's curse/prophecy. There are other possibilities as for how these things might shake out.

[Good Guy Garlan]

That's one possible reading of Mirri's curse/prophecy. There are other possibilities as for how these things might shake out.

Damn, it would be incredibly (and darkly) hilarious if MMD was just lying about Dany being infertile and Dany bought it. And it's technically possible, I think, because after Rhaego's miscarriage she only has sex with Daario and Hizdahr during roughly the same period, so she could've been pregnant before the end of Dance

[Isobel Harper]

That's only if you believe MMD caused Dany's miscarriage, which is not all that clear. Moreover, childbed fever is a thing in Westeros; an infection after a miscarriage does not require a supernatural explanation.

Generally speaking, I would advise against swallowing the image of themselves the Targaryens propagandized; we've been told far too many cases of said propaganda being patently false (Rhaenyra, Aegon II, Aegon V, Duncan, Aerion, Viserys III all died in fire; Daeron II and his heirs died of the Great Spring Sickness...)

What? Don't trust Viserys??

Perhaps Targaryens are only supposed to be immune to fire when hatching a dragon. Targaryens burning themselves to death seem to always be correlated with attempts to hatch dragon eggs. Otherwise, wouldn't they just test a little burn on the fingers first to test fire immunity?

Maybe Targaryens mixing with the Martells (and Baratheons at some point too?) made them less immune to disease, though this would be in regard to Daenerys as well, so you make a good point.

[Forever May]

Isn't she infertile though? If not, then that might explain why she was so moody in Meereen. :wideeyed:

There's no serious reason to believe she is infertile. Honestly, think about it. How does she know? She doesn't. She was most likely pregnant and miscarried due to stress.

[The guy from the Vale]

Viserys was the one who said Targaryens are immune to fire. He died because of molten metal. The irony should be obvious.

Aegon V and Duncan the Small probably tried hatching a dragon. They still died. Aerion Brightflame wanted to hatch the dragon he thought was inside him. He died. Hatching dragons still doesn't make Targs fireproof.

There are several theories for why Dany survived Drogo's funeral pyre, but the one that's most plausible to me is that Mirri tried to cast a spell making herself immune to fire ("you won't hear me scream") but failed to complete it, only for the spell to latch onto the first person to enter the pyre after Mirri's death - Dany.

ETA: Daeron II was he first Targ to marry a Martell, and he still died of the Great Spring Sickness. Also, again, Greyscale is a sickness that reportedly has been particularly dangerous fro Valyrians (e.g., Targaryens)

[Pod The Impaler]

The question is, did she ever stop menstruating? MMD said she would be infertile, but I'm not sure if she ever stopped having a menstruation.

In the text, she actually thinks she cannot remember the last time when she did menstruate. Normally that would be a tip-off, but also remember Dany has also believed that she was barren (thus no period ?).

In fact, she almost certainly miscarried - either from disease and / or poison berries.

Damn, it would be incredibly (and darkly) hilarious if MMD was just lying about Dany being infertile and Dany bought it. And it's technically possible, I think, because after Rhaego's miscarriage she only has sex with Daario and Hizdahr during roughly the same period, so she could've been pregnant before the end of Dance

I think MMD was lying and not lying - as with other prophecies, it seems to be true if considered from a certain perspective.

The prophecy only refers to some milestone where she bears a living child. Womb quickens? OK. Carry a child to full term, without miscarriage or stillbirth? Not so much.

[Amris]

There are several possibilities but it is unlikely Dany's 'sickness' is the Bloody Flux IMO.

That's because the little stream Dany follows in that chapter is far upriver from Meereen or any other town we know of. So I don't see how the 'Flux-bug' (whatever it is) could have gotten into the water there.

It's also unlikely that Dany brought it (the Flux) with her all the way from Meereen herself since she spent quite a while with Drogon in his cave first without falling sick.

I would like to add that the point about disease resistance shouldn't be shrugged off completely.

Even if Targaryens aren't proof against disease per se, the fact remains that Dany does not remember ever having been sick. It appears she - personally and aside from any supposed Targaryen propaganda - has a very healthy immune system at least. That of course doesn't prove she cannot ever get the Flux but it makes it less likely IMO. Nevertheless: The point about the stream being upriver from Meereen is the more decisive one of the two reasons.

We have at least three other possibilities as to what caused her sickness:

Her eating supposedly poisonous berries is the most obvious one since the sickness occured shortly after she did that.

Also she has been severely malnourished for some time and under physical and emotional stress.

Yeah and she could have had a miscarriage.

Most likely her sickness is a combination of all three causes IMO but not Flux.

EDIT: I personally see her journey along the little stream, the fasting and the visions as a kind of accidental Vision Quest, devised by GRRM to 'show her the way.' http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vision_quest

[Isobel Harper]

Viserys was the one who said Targaryens are immune to fire. He died because of molten metal. The irony should be obvious.

Aegon V and Duncan the Small probably tried hatching a dragon. They still died. Aerion Brightflame wanted to hatch the dragon he thought was inside him. He died. Hatching dragons still doesn't make Targs fireproof.

There are several theories for why Dany survived Drogo's funeral pyre, but the one that's most plausible to me is that Mirri tried to cast a spell making herself immune to fire ("you won't hear me scream") but failed to complete it, only for the spell to latch onto the first person to enter the pyre after Mirri's death - Dany.

ETA: Daeron II was he first Targ to marry a Martell, and he still died of the Great Spring Sickness. Also, again, Greyscale is a sickness that reportedly has been particularly dangerous fro Valyrians (e.g., Targaryens)

Hmm, I never thought of it that way. I always thought that a Targaryen would be fireproof (but only fireproof) during a dragon-egg-hatching.

[Queen‍‍‍‍‍‍ Alysanne‍‍™]

There are several theories for why Dany survived Drogo's funeral pyre, but the one that's most plausible to me is that Mirri tried to cast a spell making herself immune to fire ("you won't hear me scream") but failed to complete it, only for the spell to latch onto the first person to enter the pyre after Mirri's death - Dany.

That theory is actually one of the worst and has been debunked by the author in a recent interview where he stated that Dany "made" the magic in the pyre.

Mirri played the role of a sacrifice and thats her purpose, I see no reason for the author to include a botched spell.

[SeanF]

Dany would have been flat on her back for weeks, if she'd caught the Pale Mare.

Her sickness was due to sunstroke and the poisonous berries.

[Mithras]

Nightshade

Interesting stuff about nightshade:

Bittersweet is its common name.

Just past midday she came upon a bush growing by the stream, its twisted limbs covered with hard green berries. Dany squinted at them suspiciously, then plucked one from a branch and nibbled at it. Its flesh was tart and chewy, with a bitter aftertaste that seemed familiar to her.

Symptoms: Digestive disorders, such as Stomachache, salivation, diarrhea, liver problems.

An hour later, her stomach began to cramp so badly that she could not go on. She spent the rest of that day retching up green slime.

An important thing to note that In any case, it should never be administered to pregnant women because it can cause abortion easily.

Seems like nightshade is the reason for Dany's abortion and other symptoms observed.