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The Rise and Fall of Kings, Just and Cruel v.2


Salafi Stannis

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KJR the PR of TaFW

These traitors must die, as has always been the case, look no further than Daemon Blackfyre, the brothers Toyne, the Vulture King, Grand Maester Hareth... traitors have always paid with their lives ... even Rhaenyra Targaryen. She was daughter to one king and mother to two more, yet she died a traitor's death for trying to usurp her brother's crown.

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KJR the PR of TaFW

These traitors must die, as has always been the case, look no further than Daemon Blackfyre, the brothers Toyne, the Vulture King, Grand Maester Hareth... traitors have always paid with their lives ... even Rhaenyra Targaryen. She was daughter to one king and mother to two more, yet she died a traitor's death for trying to usurp her brother's crown.

Um, Your Majesty, Rhaenyra's father designated her as his heir. She ruled Dragonstone as heir apparent from the age of 16. Would you want your own daughter thrown off her throne because she had the audacity to be born female? The Hand (a Hightower, as was Aegon II's mother) and the LC of the KG defied their late king's wishes (and his last will and testament, I might add) and crowned Aegon instead of Rhaenyra. She did not usurp anything. I wouldn't go so far as to call Aegon a usurper either, but let's keep our history straight, shall we?

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Um, Your Majesty, Rhaenyra's father designated her as his heir. She ruled Dragonstone as heir apparent from the age of 16. Would you want your own daughter thrown off her throne because she had the audacity to be born female? The Hand (a Hightower, as was Aegon II's mother) and the LC of the KG defied their late king's wishes (and his last will and testament, I might add) and crowned Aegon instead of Rhaenyra. She did not usurp anything. I wouldn't go so far as to call Aegon a usurper either, but let's keep our history straight, shall we?

She was raised as heir apparent because she was the rightful heir, until her father had a son, and the laws of inheritance are clear, no daughter can inherit before a son, the wishes of one dead king do not change this.

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She was raised as heir apparent because she was the rightful heir, until her father had a son, and the laws of inheritance are clear, no daughter can inherit before a son, the wishes of one dead king do not change this.

She continued to be treated as rightful heir after her little brother was born. The lords of the land even swore fealty to her as their heir.

In the small council meeting called after Viserys I's death, the initial subject of conversation was Rhaenyra's crowning. It was only then that Ser Otto Hightower (Hand of the now-desceased King) mentioned crowning Aegon instead. Rather than being accepted as right, the point was argued and vehemently opposed by some who insisted that Rhaenyra was the heir. One of those men, Lord Lyman Beesbury (who was Master of Coin) was slain at that very meeting by Ser Criston Cole who is called the Kingmaker, not the Kingrecognizer.

Since the Dance, House Targaryen has practiced a highly modified version of agnatic primogeniture[13], placing female claimants in the line of succession behind all possible male ones, even collateral relations.

Male claimants always coming first was NOT the rule prior to the Dance, as clearly stated here.

Of course, even with minor lapses in memory like this, your grace still knows far more about the history of Westeros than Lord Renly ever did.

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She continued to be treated as rightful heir after her little brother was born. The lords of the land even swore fealty to her as their heir.

In the small council meeting called after Viserys I's death, the initial subject of conversation was Rhaenyra's crowning. It was only then that Ser Otto Hightower (Hand of the now-desceased King) mentioned crowning Aegon instead. Rather than being accepted as right, the point was argued and vehemently opposed by some who insisted that Rhaenyra was the heir. One of those men, Lord Lyman Beesbury (who was Master of Coin) was slain at that very meeting by Ser Criston Cole who is called the Kingmaker, not the Kingrecognizer.

Male claimants always coming first was NOT the rule prior to the Dance, as clearly stated here.

Of course, even with minor lapses in memory like this, your grace still knows far more about the history of Westeros than Lord Renly ever did.

No, what I said is a direct quote from me after I killed Renly, so it must be true.
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You're only human, your grace. There is no shame in having misspoken. And it only happened the one time.

I suppose so, my Lady Hand. That's why I chose you for the job, you're willing to tell me when I'm wrong, that's what I need, leal and honest service. The other fools probably would have rewritten the history books to appease me. Well I've no need for appeasement.

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I suppose so, my Lady Hand. That's why I chose you for the job, you're willing to tell me when I'm wrong, that's what I need, leal and honest service. The other fools probably would have rewritten the history books to appease me. Well I've no need for appeasement.

And THAT is why you are the best king, your grace!

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