Arthmail Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 So this might be a bit of a hot topic right now in light of what is happening in Australia, and I'm not looking to start a war. Now the floor could be opened up to the idea of what exactly terrorism is, as I personally don't consider a couple of loons that happen to follow a proscribed religion to be terrorists (objectively I believe I'm wrong, but I think of cells and networks as opposed to hatred and a gun - which is in no short supply regardless of ideology). This of course leads into problems of states expanded rights into personal lives all for the sake of national security and citizen safety, but this is a tertiary conversation. My main point is this. I always see in news and media, and a great deal on social sites like FB, that the people of this or that nation are going through a difficult time because of a 'terrorist' attack. It happened recently in Canada with the shooting of a soldier at a war memorial. The guy wasn't a terrorist, but for the sake of argument lets let the wishy-washy dynamics of the terminology slide for a second. Now when this happened in Canada, there was a great deal going on about how people in Canada were going through a rough time right now and people needed to be respectful of us because of our shared sense of loss and grief. Or something. I don't get it. Honestly, this notion that there is a national sense of grief for much of anything is troubling to me. A major event, like 9/11, or some of the London bombings, are more understandable. (I think the response was out of proportion but that's an old and tired topic). But this lone man killer narrative that's come out, that nations will be forever changed, and we must never forget, is foreign to my experience. It's hyperbole to be sure, but I wonder how much other people really care. Or is it concern trolling. I don't know. I don't get it. I served in the infantry. I was friends and teammates with the Calgary herald reporter killed in Afghanistan and am good friends now with the man who was her fiancé. But I don't expect people all over Canada to mourn about this sort of thing. It sucks that Cpl. Nathan Cirillo was killed by some asshat while on duty, but his death does not directly affect me. I suppose that as part of a national process of dealing with these sorts of events there is some grandiose statements to be made. But the truth is the dead are often glorified, their roles in our lives and our societies mythologized and made less than real. I feel it strips away some of the person and replaces it with an ideal, fuel for neo-cons to scrap away rights and drop bombs in other countries. But I also feel that people's reactions are overblown. We all talk in hushed whispers and short of actually knowing someone that was lost to this sort of thing, how much does it really effect us? Again, this is not meant to be disrespectful to the Aussie borders. I can see people in the city involved having a bit more trouble processing it, but I'm curious what people think of a nation at larges reaction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Fallen Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I think media has a lot to do with it. They tend to write the narrative of a country in mourning. I'm not sure whether they believe it or not. But hey, there are awards to be had for reporting of these types of events. On a personal level, I can empathize because I've lost family and close friends unexpectedly. I feel bad for the family as I know what they're going through. But it doesn't affect my every day life. Not even when they try to instill fear and panic. I live in NYC, probably the number one location for terrorists to want to strike, but I don't think about terrorism at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkhangel Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 It shakes peoples' sense of security, particularly in a country with no real history of terrorism on our shores. It's a reminder that lunatics of all stripes exist in the population, and that if it can happen in Sydney it could happen anywhere. I understand that you are unaffected by what happened in Canada recently, but might have been a bit more thoughtful to wait at least 24 hours after the deaths of the hostages before making this post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shryke Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Despite I assume some people making grandiose statements somewhere about this shit, the truth is that most Canadians were sad it happened, maybe watched/participated in the mourning ceremonies and then just went on with their lives. Ain't no one changed or living in fear as far as I've seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solmyr Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Terrorism doesn't affect me irl. It makes a good internet discussion topic tho. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinDonner Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Terrorist acts in London just make everyone pissed off that the trains are going to be running even later than usual. This is not stiff-upper-lip bravado, it's just what happens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galactus Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Not one shit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galactus Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Terrorist acts in London just make everyone pissed off that the trains are going to be running even later than usual. This is not stiff-upper-lip bravado, it's just what happens. This is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jarl the climber Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I was working construction when the 9/11 attacks happened. Now a lot of the jobs were in the DC area and a lot of the buildings were federal properties. Before the attacks security was sort of lax. It was easy to get onto the job. Within a couple of years afterwards, security was way tighter. It was way harder to get on the job, even though they knew that you were supposed to be there working in the building. You'd have to spend hours sometimes waiting to get onto the job, it was a fucking pain in the ass. So terrorism itself did not effect me but all the security in response to the attacks drove me up the fucking wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Drunkard Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 It's not something I think about. Even at work today someone mentioned the Sydney thing, there was about ten minutes of "it must have been terrible" and other sympathies, then everyone got back to it and it wasn't brought up again. I don't think that was disrespectful at all, by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sologdin Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 'Country in Mourning' is one of those rare phrases that is likely to be simultaneously apodictic truth to the extent that the law will decree something to that effect as well as the worst sort of disingenuous cynicism insofar as no one really cares about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fez Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Actual attacks? Not at all (outside of empathizing with those affected). The national response? Far too often (for instance, the extra security every time I fly). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Bean Corbray Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 It's effected me in that I basically can't go to baseball games anymore because 13 years later we are still fucking singing "God Bless America" during the 7th inning stretch because we're too dumb to remember it's not a real tradition, just a fear-based reaction that we started doing and has, to our discredit, become entrenched. Good luck stopping it now. One team even tries to do away with it and on comes the poorly written clickbait "OMG IS TEAM X UNPATRIOTIC?" (never mind they'll still have veterans singing the national anthem and throwing out the first pitch every game) which will get parroted into the echo chamber by the legions too busy looking for an outrage to critically think. And before long the team will bow and start singing it again, probably trotting out twice as many veterans as before to prove extra hard we're really patriotic patriots oh yes we are please forget about the time when we tried to do away with singing rah rah usa songs during breaks in the action. And so now I'd probably get my ass kicked by some drunk shithead for not singing along. Or be too worried I'm gonna get my ass kicked for not singing that I can no longer actually enjoy the game. So I can't go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aceluby Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Direct terrorism? Not at all. Effects due to terrorism? - Ridiculous airport checks - Militarization of police - Huge amount of extra public debt - Loss of rights due to the Patriot act - Media sensationalism dominating the airwaves and lots more that impact everyone. Funny how national and international reaction to terrorism is worse than actual terrorism. It's as if that was the goal of terrorism or something... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Bean Corbray Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Also there's like at least half a dozen non-Anthem patriotic pro-USA songs and ALL OF THEM are better than God Bless America. So we picked the shittiest song option possible ON TOP OF all my other objections. [seriously, "America The Beautiful" is actually good. Why can't we sing that one?] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frances Bean Corbray Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Direct terrorism? Not at all. Effects due to terrorism? - Ridiculous airport checks - Militarization of police - Huge amount of extra public debt - Loss of rights due to the Patriot act - Media sensationalism dominating the airwaves and lots more that impact everyone. Funny how national and international reaction to terrorism is worse than actual terrorism. It's as if that was the goal of terrorism or something... And I mean, the God Bless America thing obviously pales in comparison to all this but every time I hear God Bless America I can't help but think of all this because in its own small way its part of this bigger ball of wax. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zorral Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Not exactly on topic here, but "The Star Spangled Banner" is the national anthem, not "God Bless America." I haven't been to a baseball game in a long time, but back in the day games around here tend to open with the singing of "The Star Spangled Banner". Even the choice of who gets to sing it on the opening day of the national season became a big deal. These days the rendering of "The Star Spangled Banner" on opening days seems to have become a demonstration on just how much melisima the singer's voice can bend out of each note .... Do they open games now with "God Bless America?" At least it's tote American, written by Irving Berlin (1918). It's kinda funny, since the music for "The Star Spangled Banner" comes from Britain -- a glee, titled "Anacreon in Heaven". The melody for "My Country 'Tis of Thee" comes from Britain also -- their national anthem, "God Save the King / Queen"! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swordfish Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 It's effected me in that I basically can't go to baseball games anymore because 13 years later we are still fucking singing "God Bless America" during the 7th inning stretch because we're too dumb to remember it's not a real tradition, just a fear-based reaction that we started doing and has, to our discredit, become entrenched. Good luck stopping it now. One team even tries to do away with it and on comes the poorly written clickbait "OMG IS TEAM X UNPATRIOTIC?" (never mind they'll still have veterans singing the national anthem and throwing out the first pitch every game) which will get parroted into the echo chamber by the legions too busy looking for an outrage to critically think. And before long the team will bow and start singing it again, probably trotting out twice as many veterans as before to prove extra hard we're really patriotic patriots oh yes we are please forget about the time when we tried to do away with singing rah rah usa songs during breaks in the action. And so now I'd probably get my ass kicked by some drunk shithead for not singing along. Or be too worried I'm gonna get my ass kicked for not singing that I can no longer actually enjoy the game. So I can't go. Of all the reasons to not go to a baseball game, that's got to be the silliest I've ever heard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Notorious Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 Direct terrorism? Not at all. Effects due to terrorism? - Loss of rights due to the Patriot act What specific rights have you lost due to the Patriot Act, aceluby? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Posted December 16, 2014 Share Posted December 16, 2014 I've done most of my travelling post 9/11, and whilst there is a lot of waiting at some airports, it does not seem that bad to me. Mind you, I haven't travelled a couple of places at all, namely Canada and South America. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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