Kiporman Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 So, the title of this thread must be pretty self-explanatory. Who do you guys think that’s the most honorable of the three? Prince Baelor Breakspear who… *Was courteous to all, noble birth or not*Was merciful towards the defeated lords that followed Daemon*Fought alongside Ser Duncan against his own brother since he knew he was in right Lord Eddard “Ned” Stark… *Denied to take part in the murder of children*Told Cersei about his discovery so as to give her a chance to flee, saving herself and her children*Forsake his honor for the sake of his daughter Or perhaps Hand of the King, Ser Davos Seaworth, who… *Saved Stannis life at Storm’s End despite owing no allegiance to the lord*Reaffirmed his loyalty to strangers despite knowing that this could end in his execution*Defied his own king and friend to save the life of a boy So, what do you people think? Who wins this one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 EDITED: Breakspear... Ned made some compromises, Baelor didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Prince Baelor who imprisoned his sisters because he couldn't control his libido? I think Ned... He was incredibly stupid, but honorable. Davos is overall the best man in the series. The other Baelor... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dmerle Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 Seen as Davos started as a smuggler I doubt he has much of a case here, also he's tried to kill Mellisandre which he knows Stannis wouldn't of approved of, I'll go with Ned, he might of killed her but he would of warned her a week before hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiporman Posted December 19, 2014 Author Share Posted December 19, 2014 Prince Baelor who imprisoned his sisters because he couldn't control his libido? I think Ned... He was incredibly stupid, but honorable. Davos is overall the best man in the series. Baelor Breakspear, son of Daeron the Good. You know. From the Dunk stories? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 The other Baelor... Baelor Breakspear, son of Daeron the Good. You know. From the Dunk stories? LOL... Yeah, I know... I misread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dorian Martell Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 So, the title of this thread must be pretty self-explanatory. Who do you guys think that’s the most honorable of the three? Prince Baelor Breakspear who… *Was courteous to all, noble birth or not *Was merciful towards the defeated lords that followed Daemon *Fought alongside Ser Duncan against his own brother since he knew he was in right Lord Eddard “Ned” Stark… *Denied to take part in the murder of children *Told Cersei about his discovery so as to give her a chance to flee, saving herself and her children *Forsake his honor for the sake of his daughter Or perhaps Hand of the King, Ser Davos Seaworth, who… *Saved Stannis life at Storm’s End despite owing no allegiance to the lord *Reaffirmed his loyalty to strangers despite knowing that this could end in his execution *Defied his own king and friend to save the life of a boy So, what do you people think? Who wins this one? All and none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronn Urgandy Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 "Honour" kind of makes me cringe, apparently blood for blood is honourable or something, but neither Ned, Davos, or Baelor seem the type to kill random members of a family to make up for the ones they've lost, so none of them, really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj4iy Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 All were honorable men. But more importantly, all were GOOD men...men who would do whatever was necessary to do what was right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sullen Posted December 19, 2014 Share Posted December 19, 2014 From what we know of them, Baelor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salafi Stannis Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 "Honour" kind of makes me cringe, apparently blood for blood is honourable or something, but neither Ned, Davos, or Baelor seem the type to kill random members of a family to make up for the ones they've lost, so none of them, really. Honour is defined as "the quality of knowing and doing what is morally right." So yeah, they're all pretty honourable. But then again, you knew blood for blood is not in the definition of honour and is not at all honourable, so I don't get the point of making that comment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronn Urgandy Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 Honour is defined as "the quality of knowing and doing what is morally right." So yeah, they're all pretty honourable. But then again, you knew blood for blood is not in the definition of honour and is not at all honourable, so I don't get the point of making that comment. Oh is that what honour means? No, seriously I don't know. Seems to me that honour in practice is defined strangely and differently depending on who you are, if its about doing what's morally right then how does someone get "honour"? How is someones "honour" offended by some meaningless insult that necessitates being answered with steel? Where do sullied marriage beds come into it? How is death on the battlefield honourable? Honestly I find it confusing, its a convenient word to bandy about, but seems to basically be about being better than everybody else. That said, all three men have put their lives on the line with regards to the actual criteria, but Davos (probably because the word 'honour' never actually occurs to him during the process) has managed to so far survive by balancing it out with some practicality, so either he is the most honourable or the least honourable, because yadda yadda "honourable death", etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nictarion Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 Baelor Breakspear Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salafi Stannis Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 Oh is that what honour means? No, seriously I don't know. Seems to me that honour in practice is defined strangely and differently depending on who you are, if its about doing what's morally right then how does someone get "honour"? How is someones "honour" offended by some meaningless insult that necessitates being answered with steel? Where do sullied marriage beds come into it? How is death on the battlefield honourable? Honestly I find it confusing, its a convenient word to bandy about, but seems to basically be about being better than everybody else. That said, all three men have put their lives on the line with regards to the actual criteria, but Davos (probably because the word 'honour' never actually occurs to him during the process) has managed to so far survive by balancing it out with some practicality, so either he is the most honourable or the least honourable, because yadda yadda "honourable death", etc.There are other definitions too: The nouns are "high respect; great esteem" and "the quality of knowing and doing what is morally right". The verbs are "regard with great respect" and "fulfil (an obligation) or keep (an agreement)" Sorry if I came off as rude there, I was just trying to point out that killing innocent people is not honourable, and that people try to justify their actions by calling them honourable, even when they are anything but. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronn Urgandy Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 Baelor Breakspear Actually, what did Baelor do that was so great? Join in on a fight where half the enemy combatants weren't allowed to touch him and still manage to get himself killed? I mean, I know he called for mercy for the rebels but hey, so did Robert to the Greyjoys. I mean, he's a good guy, but; Contrast that to Ned and Davos, who risked all to protect kids they had no real reason to give a shit about and pretty much had to throw themselves at the mercy of people who weren't particularly interested in providing it at said time. Taking themselves wildly out of their comfort zone (unlike Baelor, who was comfortable sword in hand) and in Ned's case pretty much ensuring the WO5K starts, thousands die and his House gets overthrown. If Mel is to be believed Davos pretty much ensured the destruction of the Human race with his honourable actions. Alright, so excluding the consequences which I basically added in for dark humour anyway, there is no way I can look at what those three have done in their lives and call Baelor the most honourable with a straight face. I wouldn't call him the least honourable either, mind, just that there is no way he can stand above Ned and Davos. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bronn Urgandy Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 There are other definitions too: The nouns are "high respect; great esteem" and "the quality of knowing and doing what is morally right". The verbs are "regard with great respect" and "fulfil (an obligation) or keep (an agreement)" Sorry if I came off as rude there, I was just trying to point out that killing innocent people is not honourable, and that people try to justify their actions by calling them honourable, even when they are anything but. Nah, you didn't come off as rude. I just think that as a concept, honour creates as much trouble as it attempts to solve. It has been sullied too much in this series to be used as a measuring stick for the virtues of a mans character. And that's about as deep and meaningful as I am likely to get today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nictarion Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 I wouldn't call him the least honourable either, mind, just that there is no way he can stand above Ned and Davos.Sure there is. He wasn't a smuggler,he didn't cheat on his wife, he didn't lie to his wife for 15 years, etc.What little we know of BB he was the very definition of the honorable knight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sj4iy Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 Eh, Baelor Breakspear was simply trying to even the odds for Dunk by joining his side. Aerion's trial by seven was completely unfair to begin with, and then he called up the KG (the best knights in the land) against a young hedge knight from Flea Bottom. Baelor's plan simply made it a more manageable fight...and as we see, he dies fighting for the right cause, even though he was a great prince and Dunk was a nobody. However, I could easily see Davos or Ned doing the same, which is why I could not being to choose between them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baela of Pentos Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 Baelor Breakspear. Granted we only read about him in a few pages without a POV, unlike the other two. But everything we have seen of/heard about, he is the very definition of a true knight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kieran wilkie Posted December 20, 2014 Share Posted December 20, 2014 I think honors a stupid thing to live by, but for the hell of it... Davos- willing to be executed to save others lives, doesn't break his beliefs, made personal sacrifices to help others Baelor- willing to die (he did die didn't he?) to help a man he believed to be in the right, against his own family even. Eddard- I put him at the bottom because the other two put their lives at risk for others, and though he'd do the same I'm sure (and has in someways) he just happened to go at the bottom. Tbh i think its a hard and unfair comparison in someways to put them against each other, they all live by honor, but they've shone their honor in different ways/had to show it in specific circumstances. I.e. Davos facing execution for helping others in comparison to Baelor treating people equally- both honorable things, but in the end different in many ways. Though as i said, honors a bad thing to live by, seems to get you killed/ending up worse for wear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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