Characterization Issues

[A Highborn Maid]

Cersei's implied murder of Melara is just not credible. For a FEMALE child of NINE to kill another FEMALE friend unprovoked is just something that doesn't happen, especially over something so trivial. Many of Cersei's chapters in Feast take the lazy way out. (the valanquor prophecy is also an example of lazy plotting, but less said about that the better)

Jaime and Cersei suddenly deciding they don't love each other was out of the blue and not convincing at all.

Dany torturing people and Dragon visions gives off the impression of mental illness, but not sure if Martin is actually intending to go down that route.

Arya's entire arc is not credible in the least. And i don't care about the child soldier malarky - she was a noble in a powerful family. Going from tomboy to murderess is too big a leap.

I think Dany and Cersei have the most contradictions in their characterizations. Martin can't write powerful females well.

Sansa and Theon probably have the most logical characterizations.

[QuickReviveGuy]

Cersei might have killed Melara because she liked Jamie right?

Cersei and Jamie don't just go "I hate you!" then leave. Jamie isnt the same man after losing his hand so Cersei has no use for him.

Arya watched her father get his head chopped off, hunted pigeons through city streets, get picked up by a Night's Watch full of rapists and killers, gets carried off by an outlaw gang, and seen her friend chopped damn near in half.

You are oversimplifying all these situations.

[~~~~~~~~~~~~~]

Cersei might have killed Melara because she liked Jamie right?

Cersei and Jamie don't just go "I hate you!" then leave. Jamie isnt the same man after losing his hand so Cersei has no use for him.

Arya watched her father get his head chopped off, hunted pigeons through city streets, get picked up by a Night's Watch full of rapists and killers, gets carried off by an outlaw gang, and seen her friend chopped damn near in half.

You are oversimplifying all these situations.

I agree.

[The Ned's Little Girl]

I always read it as Melara fell into the well accidentally and Cersei did not raise an alarm nor did she try to rescue her. It's tantamount to murder, yes - but it was not premeditated so it makes a little bit more sense for someone of Cersei's young age.

[dread pirate davos]

Cersei's implied murder of Melara is just not credible. For a FEMALE child of NINE to kill another FEMALE friend unprovoked is just something that doesn't happen, especially over something so trivial. Many of Cersei's chapters in Feast take the lazy way out. (the valanquor prophecy is also an example of lazy plotting, but less said about that the better)

I don't understand the relevancy of gender to the point here? Would a female be able to kill a male friend at nine or vice versa? Or a male kill a male? Is woman on woman violence such a rarity? Either way I disagree, it might be rare, maybe even improbable but not impossibly or out and out crazy and thus is a perfectly acceptable thing for a fictional character to do.

[The Drunkard]

Children kill other children occasionally, it happens (yes, even FEMALE children).

[CatOfThe_Canals]

When does Dany torture people?

[CatOfThe_Canals]

Cersei might have killed Melara because she liked Jamie right?

Cersei and Jamie don't just go "I hate you!" then leave. Jamie isnt the same man after losing his hand so Cersei has no use for him.

Arya watched her father get his head chopped off, hunted pigeons through city streets, get picked up by a Night's Watch full of rapists and killers, gets carried off by an outlaw gang, and seen her friend chopped damn near in half.

You are oversimplifying all these situations.

I agree. Especially Arya. She was never a "noble" like Sansa.... I think you can tell from her first POV that she is so much cooler than that. Almost every connection she has to that world is murdered, violently.

[Good Guy Garlan]

I agree about Cersei. She went from 0 to 60 in terms of paranoia, and lost a bunch of IQ points because the plot needed it. And yes, Maggy's prophecy is an incredibly lazy plot device

I also have some issues with Asha's characterization. In aCoK, she's all "fuck yeah, Ironborn! I always wanted a castle! Let's screw the northerners over!" and then in aFfC she's out of nowhere pushing for an alliance with the North and aiming for peace. That transformation happened ahead of its time, because it should've ocurred after she was captured by Stannis' forces and realized the evil of the Old Way when talking to the She-Bear

Also, 9 year old girls can murder other girls. Didn't you hear about the Slenderman incident?

[Mad Madam Mim]

Cersei's implied murder of Melara is just not credible. For a FEMALE child of NINE to kill another FEMALE friend unprovoked is just something that doesn't happen, especially over something so trivial.

Clearly you have not witnessed pre-pubescent girls at a One Direction concert.

[Kiporman]

I agree about Cersei. She went from 0 to 60 in terms of paranoia, and lost a bunch of IQ points because the plot needed it. And yes, Maggy's prophecy is an incredibly lazy plot device

I also have some issues with Asha's characterization. In aCoK, she's all "fuck yeah, Ironborn! I always wanted a castle! Let's screw the northerners over!" and then in aFfC she's out of nowhere pushing for an alliance with the North and aiming for peace. That transformation happened ahead of its time, because it should've ocurred after she was captured by Stannis' forces and realized the evil of the Old Way when talking to the She-Bear

Also, 9 year old girls can murder other girls. Didn't you hear about the Slenderman incident?

Off topic;

Why do everytime I hear about Slenderman, I also hear Markiplier voice in my head singing "I want Slenderman to be my frienderman / and we'll take a road trip in the slendervan"?

On Topic;

I agree. Actually, there are quite some inconsistent characterizations in the series. For some (male) examples, take the Kingsguard; after Barristan is dismissed, the five of them (Arys, Boros, Mandon, Meryn and Preston) laugh at him. However, when we enter A Clash of Kings, Mandon is very stoic and Arys is pretty much a nice guy who values the kingsguard (and so, should probably hold some respect for Barristan). It makes little sense that they would laugh with the others considering these things, but hey, it happened!

[Mal Malenkirk]

When does Dany torture people?

Not personally, of course. Through her employment of the Shavepate.

She directly orders the torture of the Winseller's daughters and indirectly endorse the torture of hundreds of other people while the Shavepate is hunting for the SoH in the early part of the insurgency.

Until the point where she finally ordered him to stop sytematically torturing every lead they had because they were getting swamped in obviously false confessions that were getting them nowhere. I always felt that this was Martin taking a shot at the USA's use of torture in the war of terrorism, amongst other things.

[The Reckoner]

I believe in the Shavepate.

[dread pirate davos]

I believe in the Shavepate.

I.believed in Harvey dent, never again.

[Salafi Stannis]

The troll queen returns!

[RandomUser191]

I agree about Cersei. She went from 0 to 60 in terms of paranoia, and lost a bunch of IQ points because the plot needed it. And yes, Maggy's prophecy is an incredibly lazy plot device

but how do we know she wasn't (at least slightly) paranoid during the first 3 books (or even before)? she wasn't a POV before AFFC.

also... to me it DOES make sense that she "looses her shit" after her father's death. i think that while tywin was alive, he had been her safe bubble. if she happened to screw something up, her father would fix it. plus... i believe that after tywin's death, she tought to herself "now's my chance, since he can't hold me back anymore".

[SevenSighsCertified]

I agree with RandomUser191. Everything about Cersei's plot line makes perfect sense to me... just my two cents.

As for Dany, I believe she has the crazy. I think he does intend to write her that way. It comes across in a very insidious way. If I'm close in any way, that is. I don't think Crazy Dany = Evil Dany either, for good measure.

[Rawhead]

Dany torturing people and Dragon visions gives off the impression of mental illness, but not sure if Martin is actually intending to go down that route.

Nah, pretty much all leaders condone torture in this series (and in real life too). It's a political reality and fact of life that people are going to get tortured in a Medieval themed fantasy land, and it doesn't look like Dany is torturing people solely out of innate cruelty either.

[Dofs]

I agree about Cersei. She went from 0 to 60 in terms of paranoia, and lost a bunch of IQ points because the plot needed it. And yes, Maggy's prophecy is an incredibly lazy plot device

She became paranoid after Joffrey's death and due to Tyrion. She was not that much afraid of Tyrion before FFC so her becoming so paranoid does make perfect sense. But she did not lose IQ points. She did make an impression of a quite smart woman when she was seen from other POV in the first 3 books. But after analyzing all her actions in these books with knowing what happens in FFC, it becomes quite obvious that she was always this dumb and she was just checked by Tyrion, LF and Tywin before.

[Elessar]

Obvious troll OP is obvious.