The purpose of life

[F The King]

I've seen some pretty heavy things discussed in this section, so I'll make another heavy topic: what is the purpose of life?

The way I see it, there are a couple of possibilities:

• Lives are a result of blind natural processes with no ultimate purpose. We serve to reproduce and die. Our existence is neutral.
  
• Lives are a result of someone or something's intention, along with the rest of the universe. We're part of a larger reality, and a larger plan. Our existence is motivated by something.
  

The first one pretty much stands alone. It's difficult to expand on it. I'm inclined to go with the first possibility. We're probably just looking to find meaning in a meaningless universe, no? It explains a lot of things pretty well, especially on the issue of death and misery. If a 2-year old dies, and one believes the first possibility, then the answer to "Why did this 2-year old have to die?" would be, "Because people die, some younger than others." No rhyme or reason. Things cause things, strictly physically speaking.

If you go by the second possibility, then more than a few issues arise. This possibility implies God. Well, why did that 2-year old die? What type of God are we dealing with? Why would God take away that 2-year old's ability to live a longer, fuller life? That 2-year old has consciousness, the capacity to feel pleasure and pain. Why? Well, from this, a few more possibilities arise:

• God created the universe along with us, but with no real plan, and has no interest in us beyond creation.
  
• God is a selfish, totalitarian being who has no trouble letting evil triumph in certain ways. People will die young and there will be misery, God will see it, and simply not care.
  
• God has a plan for every life, and takes an active role in our lives.
  

I'm sure there are more, but those are the three most basic. The first one is...well, what's the point? God exists, He created everything, and that's it? It's not much of an answer to the purpose of life. I'd dismiss that possibility.

The second one would be interesting. It would imply God does not have values as we do. I'm not quite sure what to think about that. This would also have to imply that God has a plan, but it's not all good and beautiful like we think it is. If God ignored death and misery, something like a 2-year old having its life taken away, for no reason...then that would make this God the same God as stated in the first possibility. So this God must have a plan, but His plan has nothing to do with our individual lives and experiences.

The third possibility is the one taken by most religions. God created us, and has a plan for all of us. We can connect with Him via prayer, and the things we do affect how He sees us. What about the 2-year old, though? This possibility implies that there's something positive after we die: if God took the 2-year old away for no reason, then we'd be dealing with the God from the second possibility. Obviously this is the most complex possibility, because of how much religion has stated, and how many people subscribe to this belief. I don't particularly want to go too deep into it, unless somebody else does. But I don't believe this.

This post makes it seem like I'm a firm believer in the first possibility (that life has no purpose.) But science, which is what really provides us that possibility, still cannot explain consciousness, dreams, the spirituality of music...there's something about life, if you take a step back and take it all in, that seems metaphysical.

I'm not sure if anybody is even going to respond to this topic, but just some food for thought.

[deleted01]

A very interesting topic, and I look forward to seeing some responses from some of the more intelligent boarders here.

As, honestly, I have no definitive answers to your questions. Which, of course, I don't expect to have, but I'm not even sure what I believe. I know I want to believe that we have a purpose, but I also don't believe in a god that created us all and is guiding us along some kind of plan. Definitely food for thought.

[sologdin]

we have it on unimpeachable authority that the answer is 42.

[Weeping Sore]

I'll have more to say on the inevitable parody thread, The Porpoise of Life.

[Fez]

Our only purpose is reproduction. But, while we're alive, I think its our responsibility to make sure as many people enjoy their lives as much as possible; for no other reason than the trite one that its better to be happy than miserable, and happiness requires communal effort.

And there either is no god or god was not actively involved in our creation and doesn't care what happens to us (the ineffable version of procedurally generated content).

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Existential angst. What else?

:)

[S John]

I do not have any idea. I enjoy this subject in general, though.

I lean towards thinking that there is no overall purpose or meaning. That might depress some people, but I'm not really bothered by it. It's kind of cool in some ways. Somehow I have found myself existing, so, fuck it, might as well try to have a good time and enjoy my life and the people who are sharing this rock with me. I've got my own habits and my own code that I like to live by and I think our purposeless existence is actually kind of liberating in a way. We are more free than we know. Pretty much every rule and standard we have in society is completely arbitrary and meaningless. I follow most of them, of course, they are necessary for a functioning society. And I have no desire to harm or take from another person in any way, but it kind of pleases me to know that on some level I actually can potentially do whatever the fuck i want because the rules as we understand them don't really mean jack shit.

If there is a God and a purpose to all of this, then I believe that it is on a grander scale than we are privileged to know. And that anyone who tells you that they know the mind of God is either trying to make themselves feel better and more assured about our plight -or- are recruiting for more people to contribute to the collection at church, mosque, temple or whatever. If God both existed and cared what we did, then I think he should make it clear to each person, and not through the words of ancient prophets and miscellaneous contemporary bullshit artists, just what in the hell it is that we're supposed to be doing with ourselves exactly. Otherwise I assume God's either not there, some kind of uncaring primal force, or simply an absentee father to his human children.

All that said, there have been a couple of narrow misses in my life where I could have easily been killed if not for a bit of luck. Makes me kind of wonder if maybe I DO actually have a purpose that is yet unfulfilled and that's why I'm not a dead man, but after a while I tend to chalk that feeling up to the mind coping with a brush with non-existence. So I guess I'm about 80% 'eh, fuck it' and about 20% 'well... maybe'.

[Liffguard]

Whatever you want it to be.

[Elder Sister]

I'm a Christian, so I do believe there's a purpose to my life. I'm not sure I always know what I'm supposed to be doing, but one big thing I know that I'm supposed to be focused on is helping others. I fall miserably short most days, but I still make the effort.

I have spent most of my life being a cynical ass. It's only in the last several years that I've realized how much time I've wasted by being judgmental and snarky and jaded. I try really hard to remind myself that most people are doing the best that they can, that most people are basically good, and that in the end, all I'm supposed to be doing is being kind to people and trying in my small corner of the world to make it a better place.

I'm much happier with this mindset, even though my personal life has sort of imploded in the last several months. It's okay. I just try to listen to good music and be nice to folks. :)

[S John]

I try really hard to remind myself that most people are doing the best that they can, that most people are basically good, and that in the end, all I'm supposed to be doing is being kind to people and trying in my small corner of the world to make it a better place.

I pretty much share this conclusion even though I come at it from a different angle. It sounds cynical to say that you suspect there is no real purpose, but I don't think I am a cynical person. I'm an optimist if anything and I like most people.

[Elder Sister]

I pretty much share this conclusion even though I come at it from a different angle. It sounds cynical to say that you suspect there is no real purpose, but I don't think I am a cynical person. I'm an optimist if anything and I like most people.

I would definitely say you're an optimist from what little I know of you. And you have excellent taste in music. :)

Seriously, though...life is much easier when I remind myself that what others think of me is none of my business; it's what I think of other people that matters. Maybe I'm deluded, but I'm just much happier when I have this mindset.

[Starkess]

I think the meaning of life is to find meaning in life. Here we are, what magical, lucky creatures! Make the most of it. Honestly, that doesn't bother me in the least. I don't think that my existence being merely an "accident" diminishes it.

(Now how I feel about the details of actually living life, well, "life sucks and then you die", guess you just deal with it the best you can.)

[Prince of the North]

Well, that pretty much sums up my thinking on the subject (and I agree about finding it interesting).

I believe...

...there is no overall purpose or meaning.

And that means...

...we are more free than we know.

I believe our lives truly are what we make them (with the caveat that, of course, we don't exist in a vacuum) and that is very freeing.

Funny you should mention brushes with death. My closest brush with death resolved me to finding out if there really was anything there with that special someone I thought there may be something with. Strange how seeing your life flash before your eyes clarifies what really matters and what doesn't. After that experience something like possible rejection wasn't nearly as daunting. Never knowing would have been infinitely worse ;)

[Lany Freelove Cassandra]

I don't think there is a purpose

but the one we give it.

[sologdin]

at this moment, am eating turkish figs, reading JG ballard, and listening to shostakovich no. 10. that's purpose enough.

[Altherion]

It's not a question that can be answered (well, not unless something radically changes and we suddenly get much, much more insight into the nature of existence than we currently have). However, I'd like to point out that there are many more alternatives than are mentioned in the original post. Here's a famous example that does not actually require the existence of a God: this could all just be an extremely sophisticated simulation, the logical extension of a fully immersive video game. In that case, there is intent to the universe and the death of the 2-year old is simply the outcome of rules that keep things interesting. It's also not as much of a tragedy as it appears to us: in many of our crude simulations (i.e. video games), we accept that some fraction of starting scenarios will be nearly unplayable and the player will just have to start over from scratch.

[Wicked Woodpecker of West]

Maybe there is a purpose. Maybe there isn't.

Anyway we can't change or create it.

• Lives are a result of blind natural processes with no ultimate purpose. We serve to reproduce and die. Our existence is neutral.

But sir we do not serve. There is no one to be served. Things just happens. Some folk reproduce, some not because of stuff of their brain and conditions of enviroment.

Why would God take away that 2-year old's ability to live a longer, fuller life?

Because one Breivik was fuckin' enough.

It would imply God does not have values as we do.

I'm quite sure that if God exists, his values are different than values of most mudmonkeys.

[Free Northman Reborn]

Personally, if you can look at your two-year old daughter's smile, and not believe that there is a greater meaning to life, then I think you are mentally ill.

And to those who say that is just my selfish genes talking, screw you.

[Gears of the Beast]

Whatever you want it to be.

To expand, there isn't some objective, authoritarian purpose (I can never understand people's desire to live under a divine dictatorship) but that doesn't mean there is no purpose/meaning to life. It's your life do with it what you will, find meaning where you can.

To quote Nietzsche in Thus Spoke Zarathustra:

"This—is now MY way,—where is yours?" Thus did I answer those who asked me "the way." For THE way—it doth not exist!

[Liffguard]

Personally, if you can look at your two-year old daughter's smile, and not believe that there is a greater meaning to life, then I think you are mentally ill.

And to those who say that is just my selfish genes talking, screw you.

I really don't see how that follows. You love your daughter therefore life has an objective purpose? I think we're missing a step. And anyone who doesn't agree is not just mistaken but mentally ill? We're definitely missing a step there.