Which character do you think the show has left out will be the biggest mistake by D&D for not including them?

[The Mountain That Flies]

Arianne... the Dorne storyline became so fucked without her.

It's funny, because when I first read the books I didn't care much about her, but seeing what happens when the Dorne storyline falls apart without made me miss the Princess.

I also really miss Strong Belwas and Lady Stoneheart. The former added humor and fun to Dany's storyline and really would have helped this last season (though they probably would have killed him off), and the latter's reveal in Storm is one of my favorite moments of the series.

[imaginepageant]

Arianne.  If only because their handling of the Dorne storyline was so badly received that it will go down as That Thing We Never Talk About in the fandom.  Had they kept Arianne instead of giving her role to Ellaria and the Sand Snakes, the Dorne arc, even sans Quentyn and the fAegon plot, would've made much more sense.

[Kontarek]

Arianne.  If only because their handling of the Dorne storyline was so badly received that it will go down as That Thing We Never Talk About in the fandom.  Had they kept Arianne instead of giving her role to Ellaria and the Sand Snakes, the Dorne arc, even sans Quentyn and the fAegon plot, would've made much more sense.

I disagree. Dorne was shit because it was shit, not because Arianne was cut. I seriously doubt that that one change would've made up for the monumental incompetence it took to fuck up Dorne as badly as they did. I honestly would've preferred them to just break from the books and keep Oberyn alive if tanking things this hard was the alternative.

 

OP: Jon Connington and fAegon. I suppose they might still work fAegon in there somehow, but it's looking almost certain that JonCon is out. Very disappointing. We need more badass gay gingers on television

[Blackwater Saint]

Gerold Dayne would be an excellent addition.  With the Viper dead, Trystane is a poor substitution as a young swashbuckling Dornishman.

[Vermoulian]

He's clearly not vital to telling the story, but I thought they threw away an opportunity when they wrote out Vargo Hoat.

[HairGrowsBack]

13 hours ago, Vermoulian said:

He's clearly not vital to telling the story, but I thought they threw away an opportunity when they wrote out Vargo Hoat.

I wanted to hear him say "thappireth"

[WhitewolfStark]

On 8/5/2015 at 11:12 PM, imaginepageant said:

Arianne.  If only because their handling of the Dorne storyline was so badly received that it will go down as That Thing We Never Talk About in the fandom.  Had they kept Arianne instead of giving her role to Ellaria and the Sand Snakes, the Dorne arc, even sans Quentyn and the fAegon plot, would've made much more sense.

Except, Quentyn is the entire motivation behind Arianne's arc. Adapting her without Quentyn would've been like getting the Ellaria we got, but renamed Arianne.

I think they were smart. If they weren't going to have Quentyn, cutting Arianne makes sense.

Perhaps they could have changed things so that Trystane and Quentyn were merged, which would've made a bit more sense and added a sense of tension and politics to Dorne. I'd have gladly sacrificed a Sandsnake for an Arianne (there were three Sandsnakes and only two of them made an impression anyway). And meanwhile if Arianne is back, Ellaria could have been supporting Doran from behind the scenes as a twist.

Added scene: a distressed Ellaria meets with Arianne who mentions that she doesn't agree with her father, but there might be another way to get justice for Oberyn. Arianne approaches her father and mentions crowning Myrcella as Queen, per Dornish law. Doran tells her to forget such an idea, that Myrcella is Trystane's betrothed and she will be a fine Princess of Dorne (him meaning as Trystane's wife, but Arianne and the audience interpreting it as Doran favoring Trystane as his heir).

We see the whole Trystane/Myrcella relationship as it is.

We see Arianne meeting with the two Sandsnakes (Tyene and Obara, since Nymeria was forgettable last season) and Ellaria and shares her suspicion that her father seems to be planning to go against centuries of Dornish law and naming Trystane, her younger brother, as his heir because he's betrothed to Myrcella, Obara suggests that they kill Myrcella and reveal Doran's weakness to all of Dorne and start a war with the Iron Throne for that. Ellaria holds reservations when it comes to killing and makes a similar speech to the one she says in the books, but the Sandsnakes appear to "win her over" by reminding her of Oberyn's death.

That right there establishes Dorne with a tad more complexity, interest, and intrigue than just "kill the Princess".

A scene of tension between Arianne and Trystane could be added here as Arianne comments on how fond Trystane is of Myrcella, and establish some backstory between the two and confirm the merging of Trystane and Quentyn's characters by perhaps mentioning that the reason the two siblings aren't close is because he was fostered with the Yronwoods. And Trystane can bring up that he had to pay for Uncle Oberyn's rash mistakes, and that he won't be so foolish as to lose his head. Establishing that while Trystane may be in love with sweet Myrcella, he does have a brain, and explain why Doran would consider sending him to King's Landing. It also unknowingly establishes that there's two types of Dornish characters--those who act first and think later, and those who think first and act later, with Arianne sitting somewhere in between the two types and trying to blend the two together.

Arys Oakheart can be kept in as a minor character, and Arianne does her part by seducing Arys and poisoning him with their show-invented kiss of death idea to clear her way to getting at Myrcella, thus adding tension that Jaime and Bronn better get to Sunspear fast!

Myrcella is so in love with Trystane that she doesn't notice that Arys is missing the next day, and the attack can go similarly, with Obara and Tyene doing the attacking, while Arianne awaits with the horses. Jaime and Bronn show up per the show's invention and Aero Hotah shows up and arrests them all, with Ellaria arriving with guards to take Arianne into custody at the stables.

There's no need for the prison scene between Tyene and Bronn since the poison has already been established with Arys' death. Perhaps the scene is still there, if D&D want Tyene/Bronn so much, but the whole point of him being poisoned by Tyene is taken out. But frankly that would only be to give fanservice by showing Bronn.

Jaime & Myrcella's scene is unaltered. If D&D really want it, Ellaria's scene with Jaime can be kept, but with sincerity instead of overt falsity, if only because it drops a subtle hint that Doran is thinking about allying with the Targaryens to the viewers, but it's mostly unnecessary.

Later episode we see Ellaria and Doran sitting together with Trystane and Myrcella when Jaime comes to talk with them. Ellaria and Doran can speak to their peace in our time plans and how Ellaria, even after seeing Oberyn die doesn't want a cycle of vengeance to continue, completing her sentiments that were interrupted by the Sandsnakes before.

Later Doran meets with Arianne and the Sandsnakes like he does with Ellaria in the scene we got, and asks angrily why she disobeyed him. We get a version of the Fire and Blood scene from the books, but with better subtlety that Doran is okay with killing Myrcella so that it can free Trystane to marry Dany eventually, but it can't be done so violently and melodramatically like Arianne was trying to do. This can be achieved through metaphor, doublespeak, or what have you. Ellaria is notably not present in this confrontation and revelation, with Ellaria taking the Sandsnakes out after they re-swear fealty to Doran.

Once outside Ellaria can chide Obara and Tyene and give a hint that a true viper knows when to strike, and when to lay in wait in the grass.

We get the same kiss of death sequence, but this time with Arianne giving it to Myrcella, with what appears to be Doran's blessing. We also see Doran giving his son something for him to read once he reaches King's Landing and not before (he whispers).

Myrcella dies like show-canon depicts.

Season five ends the Dornish plot line with Trystane reading his father's letter on the ship in secret, explaining to him the circumstances and his plans for him marrying Daenerys eventually, but in the meantime to make Daenerys' path to Westeros easier by destabilizing the Lannister hold on the Iron Throne from the inside since he cannot. Trystane burns the letter. And then for Season Six can either go along that Trystane is too torn up about Myrcella's death to go along with his plans and decides to do his own thing in King's Landing--or decides to do his father's plans his own way instead of his father's way by abandoning King's Landing and heading East for Mereen and filling out something similar to Quentyn's plot line.

There. I gave a streamlined version of Dorne from the books with only a few minimally added bits and pieces, while keeping D&D's desires mostly in tact. I don't think it's the best version, but it's something closer than we got.

[Drogonthedread]

I think without knowing the whole story and how series ends. ..I believe this question can't be answered. .

We do not know what happens whereas the show runners do ..

Its my belief if we have had the books the backlash on the show would have been much less and lots of omissions and changes would have made sense if we knew what happens before hand 

[Magnar of Skagos]

They should have just cut Dorne all together. There was nothing redeeming about that entire plotline all season.

[Count Balerion]

Maybe Mandderly. In the books Dorne, while far better than in the show, isn't what I would call brilliant; but the North/Theon is, and part of that brilliance is the tension between the Northerners and the Frey/Bolton crew. That's lost in the show. Sansa in WF could have been so much better.

[lordstewie]

i think

dorkstar, manderly , val and faegon

[Le Cygne]

On 1/25/2016 at 5:26 AM, HairGrowsBack said:

I wanted to hear him say "thappireth"

That would have been good.  

[Mistress of Lemon Cakes]

I think cutting both Arianne and Lady Stoneheart will have big ripple effects down the road.

 

I would have probably been fine with Ellaria taking on Arianne's role if they had at the very least kept the Queenmaker plot rather than the murder plot we got. They could have even still killed Myrcella in the end if they absolutely felt it was necessary, but instead just made it an accident. It would have been a considerably simplified plot and I doubt anyone who has read the books would have been satisfied with it but it certainly would have been better than what we got.

 

Aside from wanting to recapture some of the success they got with Oberyn, I don't understand why they even bothered with Dorne. Every single character from Dorne could drop off the face of Planetos going forward and it would not effect the larger plot on a whole in the least bit.

[Lord_Ravenstone]

I think cutting Aegon and Lady Stoneheart were the biggest mistakes. 

Now i understand that Aegon brings him with him a whole new cast but with some tweaks to the material you can make it work. 

Combine JonCon and Harry Strickland, leave Duck in and cut the rest.

 Aegon will still be fake but also have him know that he's fake but also state out loud that he's Illyrio's son and Varys' nephew.

 

[Ruhail]

Aegon and JonCon 

[sj4iy]

None.  I haven't missed any of the secondary or tertiary characters cut from a book series that have literally hundreds of them.  In my opinion, it makes the story unwieldy and does not translate to television.  The show is already pushing the boundary by having as many characters as they do in the first place.

And even if there's a part where I didn't think the show handled things well, it doesn't mean that adding in more characters would have fixed it.

[A Bong of Ice and Fire]

Aegon, because Varys's motivations aren't convincing to me without him.  But I think he may still show up.  

[Lord_Ravenstone]

On April 5, 2016 at 7:15 AM, sj4iy said:

None.  I haven't missed any of the secondary or tertiary characters cut from a book series that have literally hundreds of them.  In my opinion, it makes the story unwieldy and does not translate to television.  The show is already pushing the boundary by having as many characters as they do in the first place.

And even if there's a part where I didn't think the show handled things well, it doesn't mean that adding in more characters would have fixed it.

You can cut characters and add the more important ones in. 

For instance cut everyone in Dorne except for Arianne, put Aegon , JonCon and Duck in. Now you cut 5-6 bad characters and put in 4 compelling characters in and tied in Varys' and Illyrio's storyline well

 

[Lord_Ravenstone]

On April 5, 2016 at 7:15 AM, sj4iy said:

None.  I haven't missed any of the secondary or tertiary characters cut from a book series that have literally hundreds of them.  In my opinion, it makes the story unwieldy and does not translate to television.  The show is already pushing the boundary by having as many characters as they do in the first place.

And even if there's a part where I didn't think the show handled things well, it doesn't mean that adding in more characters would have fixed it.

Honestly having so many characters breathes life into the world. I hate it when the story is concentrated on like the same 10 people when it's supposed to be an epic fantasy story.

I sometimes feel the show is kinda empty without the rest of characters.

[Richard Writhen]

To date, Arianne and LS. Future: probably Victarion. Loves me some Victarion.