Video: Elio and Linda discuss Season 5 trailer

[biosnake20]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_68S55PkAtQ

Hour long discussion.

[King Behind The Wall]

Loved that video, especially the part where Elio is visibly embarrassed when he realized he is unknowingly swindling the chair back and forth :drunk: .

On a more serious note, a lot of new information is revealed in that video. This is for the first time I have seen Elio and Linda spoiling so much stuff on youtube.

Interesting points that stood out for me,

1) They think that Benjen could be at Hardhome

2) Sansa's traumatic scene in season 5 is NOT the one that they mentioned in the Vulture video. This should put many theories on this forum to rest.

3) Sansa and Littlefinger could be the ones that are being received by the Boltons at Winterfell

4) They support the theory that Hardhome was a dry run for Doom of Valyria, and the doom was caused by the FM

5) Tristane taking Young Griff's place might mean that there is Aegon in the show and he is being secretly raised at Sunspear instead of by JonCon

[Arkash]

1) They think that Benjen could be at Hardhome

Hmmm... good one ! Interesting point !

[jbob]

5) Tristane taking Young Griff's place might mean that there is Aegon in the show and he is being secretly raised at Sunspear instead of by JonCon

That sounds like a great idea actually. Especially if Aegon is a fake and Dany is going to burn him to see if he's a Targaryen as some people have predicted she could do to Aegon.

[Darryk]

Really interesting watching them discuss this stuff. Whenever I see their videos posted I think "there's no way I'm going to be able to sit through an hour-long youtube video", then I end up watching anyway, getting completely engrossed and losing track of time.

It's kind of funny how Linda seems irritated with everything the show does, though. She's got this "silently burning with rage" expression on her face throughout the video.

[Mother of Mountains]

Trystane as Aegon is an obvious way to go if they want to show the second Dance.

Are there any images of Toby Sebastian in costume? Up till now I'd seen him as just another dark haired Dorne casting but it's interesting how much he kinda resembles Emillia. I'm trying to imagine how they'd manage the reveal, it's going to look odd if he's introduced as Trystane with his real hair and then they cram him into a silver blonde wig when he's shown to be Aegon.

[Ghosts Lunch]

The whole Trystane as Aegon idea is complicated and makes absolutely no sense at all if they are doing some kind of "lover story romance' arc as suggested, because we then have an issue of Aegon alligning with the Lannisters in effect, whereas Aegon of the books is very much intent of deposing Tommen

Simply wouldn't make any sense, Myrcellas Grandfather sacks KL, one of his chief henchman brutally murders your "mother and sister" and her own brothers are the supposed progeny of the man who usurped your grandfathers throne and killed your father

Yeah that makes sense...Just like "why did you sentence me to death" instead of "what did you do to Tysha?"...

Better off in doing away with Aegon rather than turning Trystane into him. Hopefully he just stays as a peripheral character but the show seems heavily invested in Cersei and by extension Myrcella and Tommen so...

[Ghosts Lunch]

Really interesting watching them discuss this stuff. Whenever I see their videos posted I think "there's no way I'm going to be able to sit through an hour-long youtube video", then I end up watching anyway, getting completely engrossed and losing track of time.

It's kind of funny how Linda seems irritated with everything the show does, though. She's got this "silently burning with rage" expression on her face throughout the video.

Yeah sometimes I think they need to take into account the practicalities of TV and issues with the visual medium, but ultimately their videos are where you go if you want to listen to hardcore book fans point out and get irritated with the inconsistencies starting to slowly creep in

And quite often they have a good point, eg turning Mace Tyrell who isn't as good as he thinks he is type in the books into a cartoonish buffoon etc

Good thing they clarified the "controversy" that may surround an upcoming Sansa chapter was a little overblown etc and only relates to some theories

[jbob]

The whole Trystane as Aegon idea is complicated and makes absolutely no sense at all if they are doing some kind of "lover story romance' arc as suggested, because we then have an issue of Aegon alligning with the Lannisters in effect, whereas Aegon of the books is very much intent of deposing Tommen

Simply wouldn't make any sense, Myrcellas Grandfather sacks KL, one of his chief henchman brutally murders your "mother and sister" and her own brothers are the supposed progeny of the man who usurped your grandfathers throne and killed your father

Yeah that makes sense...Just like "why did you sentence me to death" instead of "what did you do to Tysha?"...

Better off in doing away with Aegon rather than turning Trystane into him. Hopefully he just stays as a peripheral character but the show seems heavily invested in Cersei and by extension Myrcella and Tommen so...

It makes sense if his an honorable person. He is being raised to be the best kind of King, as Varys says, unless he's lying about that. In the show Oberyn did say something about how people in Dorne do not punish the children for the mistakes of the parents, or something like that.Or just simply fell in love with someone they never expected to.

[AmassedFX]

That sounds like a great idea actually. Especially if Aegon is a fake and Dany is going to burn him to see if he's a Targaryen as some people have predicted she could do to Aegon.

Would Oberyn have been in the know in regards to this secret Sunspear plan? If so, it would be odd given his words whilst fighting the Mountain, although I guess he could still be irate that he killed Elia and her daughter still.

[ni2tre]

The whole Trystane as Aegon idea is complicated and makes absolutely no sense at all if they are doing some kind of "lover story romance' arc as suggested, because we then have an issue of Aegon alligning with the Lannisters in effect, whereas Aegon of the books is very much intent of deposing Tommen

Simply wouldn't make any sense, Myrcellas Grandfather sacks KL, one of his chief henchman brutally murders your "mother and sister" and her own brothers are the supposed progeny of the man who usurped your grandfathers throne and killed your father

Yeah that makes sense...Just like "why did you sentence me to death" instead of "what did you do to Tysha?"...

Better off in doing away with Aegon rather than turning Trystane into him. Hopefully he just stays as a peripheral character but the show seems heavily invested in Cersei and by extension Myrcella and Tommen so...

The idea is that Trystane thinks he is Doran's son, he doesn't know he's a Targ. That way he would learn about it in E9 in a "Fire & Blood" speech after Doran sends Myrcella away.

There are other mild inconsistencies (which can be explained tbh) but this is not one of them.

[Polo]

I cant remember where I read it, but I heard the Trystane/Myrcella romance is really mostly Myrcella being really into Trystane, and he not caring all that much for her. I can see that, I'd prefer that, as it reminds me of Quentyn not really wanting to marry Dany, but rather wishing he'd stay and "kiss one, or both of the Yronwood girls".

[Making the Eight]

I think it's very interesting that they mentioned the possibility of Littlefinger maybe arranging an alliance of sorts with the Boltons by having Sansa marry Ramsay. I think this could work in a lot of ways and would be very intriguing to say the least.

Obviously we know Littlefinger was the one keeping and grooming Jeyne Poole in the books then turned her over to the Lannisters, and by extension the Boltons, as "Arya". So why not skip all of that muddled mess and just send the actual Stark girl that apparently everyone knows is alive and have her marry Ramsay to give the Boltons claim to Winterfell. This could make for some great interactions on the show and would help streamline everything to get people closer together like it needs to be done. I certainly wouldn't be opposed to this if it were to happen.

[Colonel Green]

So why not skip all of that muddled mess and just send the actual Stark girl that apparently everyone knows is alive and have her marry Ramsay to give the Boltons claim to Winterfell.

Because she's already married, a wanted regicide, and it makes no sense for them to hand such a valuable person over to the Boltons?

[jbob]

Would Oberyn have been in the know in regards to this secret Sunspear plan? If so, it would be odd given his words whilst fighting the Mountain, although I guess he could still be irate that he killed Elia and her daughter still.

Yeah, I see your point. But it's not like he'd want everyone to know Aegon is alive so he'd be smart enough to deliberately say children instead of child. And he still wants revenge for his sister and niece. But even if Aegon is alive it's still horrible what happened to him in a way so Oberyn is getting revenge for that. And killing the Mountain is weaking the Lannisters for whatever future war is expected.

But of course Doran could've lied to him as well to keep him from doing something or saying something rash. Depends on where Oberyn was at the time I suppose.

[clair de lune]

Oberyn wanted to raise Dorne for Viserys; likely Doran didn't keep him apprised of the Aegon stuff. But I'm pretty sure Doran doesn't know about Aegon.

[Ghosts Lunch]

It makes sense if his an honorable person. He is being raised to be the best kind of King, as Varys says, unless he's lying about that. In the show Oberyn did say something about how people in Dorne do not punish the children for the mistakes of the parents, or something like that.Or just simply fell in love with someone they never expected to.

Would Oberyn have been in the know in regards to this secret Sunspear plan? If so, it would be odd given his words whilst fighting the Mountain, although I guess he could still be irate that he killed Elia and her daughter still.

The idea is that Trystane thinks he is Doran's son, he doesn't know he's a Targ. That way he would learn about it in E9 in a "Fire & Blood" speech after Doran sends Myrcella away.

There are other mild inconsistencies (which can be explained tbh) but this is not one of them.

Issue with this is I can understand if they are wanting to streamline Trystane and Aegon, but in terms of narrative it is basically a version of Lyanna's brother taking her child (a secret Targ) and raising him as his own following Roberts revellion (assuming R+L=J of course), and then we have some newly introduced characters where Elia's child (a Targ) has secretly been handed over to her brother (Doran) following Roberts rebellion....practically the same

These Dornish characters are newly introduced mid-series (same with Aegon in the books btw), if there is a slow build arc over the entire series to reveal R+L=J this hypothetical change pretty much takes the heat out of any such arc regarding R+L=J

I think it's very interesting that they mentioned the possibility of Littlefinger maybe arranging an alliance of sorts with the Boltons by having Sansa marry Ramsay. I think this could work in a lot of ways and would be very intriguing to say the least.

Obviously we know Littlefinger was the one keeping and grooming Jeyne Poole in the books then turned her over to the Lannisters, and by extension the Boltons, as "Arya". So why not skip all of that muddled mess and just send the actual Stark girl that apparently everyone knows is alive and have her marry Ramsay to give the Boltons claim to Winterfell. This could make for some great interactions on the show and would help streamline everything to get people closer together like it needs to be done. I certainly wouldn't be opposed to this if it were to happen.

In itself I can actually see how this makes sense from a streamlining perspective (as much as it would take some getting used to), but in terms of Sansa's narrative it would be a regression as I've said before, plus if they go through with it, it is another one of those narrative issues that has a gaping hole in it, in that Cersei is not meant to know where Sansa is but if Sansa takes over Jeyne Poole as fArya Cersei wouldn't allow it for a start and there is the Tyrion marriage issue too

The other option is to have Sansa playing fAlayne, and as Littlefingers legitimised daughter and heir to Harrenhall she can be married off to Ramsay (so there would be two legitimised bastard children who have become heirs, eg it is balanced out) to unite the Tommen loyal Riverlands and North (borrowing off a Preston Jacobs theory here tbh dare I say...). Issue with that is that Sansa can't have marriage to Tyrion annulled, but it does solve the issue of Reek recognising her and rescuing her perhaps and it would certainly be a twist the showrunners can throw at book readers! (eg Real Sansa taking the place of Fake Arya...)

This could explain why we are seeing so many Vale horsemen around, Vale Lords wouldn't let her out of her sight knowing she is Sansa Stark, both because she is an asset for the same reason the Lannisters/Tyrells/Littlefinger has a cold war over her but also to somewhat protect her from the notorious Ramsay, having Vale/Arryn troops in Winterfell may be a good substitute for the Manderly's, after all thnks to Neds fostering the Arryns have loyalty to the Starks and this links in with the pilot etc and they can be opposition to Frey forces in Winterfell and prospective defectors to Stannis.

No evidence of Arryn Generals though...

[Beric175]

I think fAegon is just gone from the show because Dany is the slayer of lies and the mummer's dragon will be defeated so ultimately in the Dany vs fAegon fight it looks like she's the foregone winner...why do we need fAegon again?

I think the Brienne/Podrick stuff could have to do with them overhearing Black Walder and/or Lame Lothar Frey at the Inn at the Crossroads talking about RW-related issues, such as common people being generally sick of the Freys and so maybe Brienne might want to avenge Catelyn? If both groups end up getting captured by the BWB+ Blackfish there are all the references to the Riverlands/RW subplot that we need.

Jaime is a stand-in for Oakheart imo because we're actually invested in Jaime as a character at this point so tht makes it easier to introduce Dorne. Books 4 and 5 generally don't manage to make me care about the POVs in the Dorne/Ironborn subplots because I didn't know Oakheart well enough as a character, nor did I care about a self-pitying, mysogynistic war criminal like Victarion Greyjoy.

The Sansa stuff looks interesting and new. Looking forward to that, lthough to me it makes no difference whether Theon rescues Jeyne or Sansa because in both cases it's someone he knows. Could the traumatic Sansa scene Turner talked about in season 5 then have to do with the Reek chapter in which Ramsay forces him to get Ramsay's wife aroused if the Theon/Sansa plot get merged?

They forgot Arya arriving at the HoB&W and picking up Needle.

Dany and Tyrion are broadly speaking keeping close to the book storylines. I guess at some point Jorah kidnaps Tyrion and Varys goes off to kill Kevan (who is back in the show alongside Lancel)

I think the Cersei flashback will probably be more of a dream sequence, not a real flashback.

[Ghosts Lunch]

I think fAegon is just gone from the show because Dany is the slayer of lies and the mummer's dragon will be defeated so ultimately in the Dany vs fAegon fight it looks like she's the foregone winner...why do we need fAegon again?

I think the Cersei flashback will probably be more of a dream sequence, not a real flashback.

It'll be the Prologue for the series IMO

[Making the Eight]

Because she's already married, a wanted regicide, and it makes no sense for them to hand such a valuable person over to the Boltons?

Haha details details. I was thinking more along the lines of what Ghosts Lunch said about her being married off to Ramsay while posing as fAlayne and Littlefinger's heir to Harrenhal. Obviously there are several things the show-writers would have to change/work around, but we know they're not afraid to do that. Needless to say, I'm excited to see where her storyline goes.