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I just heard that Brandon Stark had Two bastards


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Normally, when it comes to reality, my mentality is "The most boring answer is usually the most accurate" -- my own little spin on Occam's Razor -- but this isn't reality. This is fantasy. If it's not exciting, someone isn't doing their job right.



Let's stop going for the most mind-numbing alternatives. I'm not saying to go for super exciting crackpots with no evidence, but likewise, let's not go for things so horribly dull they'd feel like a huge let-down after such huge buildup as Jon's parentage had.


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ok here is my point if Brandon Stark and Ashara Dayne son is Jon Snow why was the big serect? Why not Ned tell just tell truth? Cat is not fool she must have know that Brandon screw around please answers.

That is the point. If Jon Snow is the son of Brandon Stark and Ashara Dayne, then there is no reason to keep it a big secret. However, in the books, it is a big secret, which points to Jon NOT being the son of those two.

Remember Apple Martini's litmus test for Jon's parentage: If X and Y are Jon's parents, was it necessary to keep that fact hidden? If not, then X and Y are probably not Jon's parents. (It works for the singular as well.)

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Brandon didn't Bone ashara. he would never do that to ned. he's going to drag his wolfblooded self to king's landing because of the dishonor shown to his sister and house but he's perfectly fine with breaking ned's heart? I doubt it.

i'm not going to take selmy's word, no matter how much I love the guy, He was in love with ashara and for all intents and purposes ned would have ended up with her had Brandon lived.

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  • 4 weeks later...

ok here is my point if Brandon Stark and Ashara Dayne son is Jon Snow why was the big serect? Why not Ned tell just tell truth? Cat is not a fool she must have know that Brandon screw around please answers.

I can't take credit - i read a comment somewhere about exactly this, and I think this is a perfect answer (although B+A=J to me seems much less likely than R+L=J)

If Ned let Cat know that Brandon Stark(whom Cat was head over heels with) had hooked up with Ashara Dayne, that would potentially have enraged the Tully's toward the Starks which would've been a huge issue. Correlates with how enraged the Freys were when Robb covertly hooked up with Jayne/Talisa

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If Ned let Cat know that Brandon Stark(whom Cat was head over heels with) had hooked up with Ashara Dayne, that would potentially have enraged the Tully's toward the Starks which would've been a huge issue. Correlates with how enraged the Freys were when Robb covertly hooked up with Jayne/Talisa

The problem is Robb married Talisa/Jeyne.

Brandon did not marry Ashara Dayne, so his kids would be bastards.

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How is Ned (the man Cat is married to) having a bastard better than Brandon (a man who Cat never married) having a bastard? How on earth would telling the latter make Cat angrier than the former? And if it were wise to keep a secret early on, why not tell Cat later on - once she had started loving Ned? Does anybody honestly think Cat, at the time of GOT, would have been more upset with Jon being Brandon's bastard as opposed to Ned's?


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Brandon didn't Bone ashara. he would never do that to ned. he's going to drag his wolfblooded self to king's landing because of the dishonor shown to his sister and house but he's perfectly fine with breaking ned's heart? I doubt it.

i'm not going to take selmy's word, no matter how much I love the guy, He was in love with ashara and for all intents and purposes ned would have ended up with her had Brandon lived.

Sorry but where is the proof Ned wanted to marry Ashara? There is none

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May be Brandon had some bastards (at least he tried hard). When asked about it George said that may he 'made snow' in the North, but he said that he left no son, but the two alternatives are not mutually exclusive. Barristan said that Ashara had a stillborn daughter and a possible father is a Stark. But even if it is true what is the importance of this bastards? Possibly none.



And is hard to believe that Jon is son of Brandon and Ashara. No makes sense that Ned lied to keep this secret. This almost ruined their marriage, the boy was despised by Catelyn his all life and all because she though that he was a bastard. If he were presented like a Brandon's bastard, even Cat hating it, he would be better treated.


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Jon is younger than Robb. Robb was conceived after Brandon died. Therefore Jon cannot be Brandon's son.



Since Jon didn't come into the picture until AFTER Ned and Cat were married, Brandon having a bastard would not have been a problem with the Tullys as the alliance between the families was sealed and Cat married the brother who didn't play around. Can't punish Brandon when he's already dead anyway.



Brandon actually could have fathered a child with Ashara, but that child would be older than both Jon and Robb. Ashara's child is said to have been a girl, but we don't know that it's true, or when the child was born, or if there even was a child. We know she was dishonored, but that does not automatically mean she got pregnant. And quite frankly there was another known hound dog at the Harrenhal tournament. *cough, Robert, cough*



The ONLY reason for Ned's silence is that Jon is Rhaegar's son, or he thinks that Jon is Rhaegar's son. There is no other reason not to tell Cat at least.


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Normally, when it comes to reality, my mentality is "The most boring answer is usually the most accurate" -- my own little spin on Occam's Razor -- but this isn't reality. This is fantasy. If it's not exciting, someone isn't doing their job right.

Let's stop going for the most mind-numbing alternatives. I'm not saying to go for super exciting crackpots with no evidence, but likewise, let's not go for things so horribly dull they'd feel like a huge let-down after such huge buildup as Jon's parentage had.

You don't find that making Jon the son of Rhaegar Targaryen instead of Ned Stark as the book says rather... mind numbing, super exciting, and huge? I.e, everything you said that Jon's parentage shouldn't be if R+L=J isn't true?

R+L=J is a perfectly fine theory. But why the double standard for any other explanation? It's not like it's the only theory out there, and to this day it's still just a theory and is not canon. Jon is Ned's son until otherwise stated. R+L=J is an alternative theory to the book's canon. Any alternative to R+L=J is not an alternative to canon, it's an alternative to an alternative.

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What makes you say that?

There are theories about Brandon being with both Ryswell sisters and fathering Domeric prompting Roose to allow his murder by Ramsey. As far as timeline is concerned, that is at least possible while Brandon fathering Jon Snow is impossible unless he has done it posthumously.

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