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Why did Mace besiege Storm's End?


LordPathera

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Ashford routed Robert's force and forced him North, But instead of sending a strong force in pursuit, Mace camps his whole army outside of Storm's End and doesn't send any aid to the Targaryens.



I'm not aware of any resentment between the Reach and Aerys, so Mace's action appears to be a grand example of strategic incompetence/in-adaptability. Surely he didn't need to camp all of the Reach's strength outside of Storm's End? The Reach can field a total force of up to 100,000 troops, why not send 20 or even 30 thousand of that strength northward after Robert and the rest of the Rebels? Or better yet with only half of that total strength, camp 10,000 outside of Storm's End while the other 40,000 goes north to fight the Rebellion?



Or did the Reach believe that they had more to gain from Robert's victory than a Loyalist one? Were they simply going through the motions concerning "supporting" the King? Is Mace Tyrell really that much of an idiot?


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The Tyrells were only 1/2 loyal to the Targaryens.



Besieging Storm's End and not killing Stannis was the best they could do to remain 1/2 neutral.



They were prepared for either outcome (successful rebellion & failed rebellion).

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Here is what GRRM says on the matter

The Targaryens had lost a number of battles (and had also won some), but they weren't really losing the war until the Trident and the Sack of King's Landing. And then it was lost. And sieges were a crucial part of medieval warfare. Storm's End was not geographically strategic, but it was the base of Robert's power, as important to House Baratheon as Winterfell was to the Starks. If it had fallen, Robert would have lost his home and his lands... and two of his brothers would have been hostages in enemy hands. All important chips. Also the fall of Storm's End might have convinced many of the storm lords supporting him that the time had come to bend the knee. So the castle was hardly unimportant.

Tyrell had a sizeable host, but some of his strength was with Rhaegar, certainly. Rhaegar actually outnumbered Robert on the Trident, although Robert's troops were more battle-tested. I haven't gone into the whole history of the fighting, but there was a good deal more to it than just two armies meeting on the Trident. There were a number of earlier battles, sieges, escapes, ambushes, duels, and forays, and fighting in places as farflung as the Vale and the Dornish Marches.

What should also be noted is the incredibly poor leadership and communication of the Loyalists. There were 4 Hands of the King during the War, Aerys didnt leave Kings Landing and Rhaegar had disappeared bringing the lord Commander of the Kingsguard and the most famous Knight in the Kingdoms with him. There was no clear leadership and Aerys had punished Lords who failed him(Connington and Merryweather) so Mace, once given the objective of taking Storms End, was unlikely to give up on that.

When Rhaegar left Kings Landing he was confident of winning, as he tells Jaime things will be different when he returns. His arrogance in himself and prophesies resulted in ignoring the extra troops he could have summoned from Mace.

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It was actually a really smart move.

He wasn't taking any risks or losing men, but Aerys' couldn't have accused him of doing nothing because technically he was doing something. If Storm's End falls, awesome. If not, he was still a loyalist. And unlike most of the other Great Houses, the Tyrells survived the war practically unscathed, without losing any significant titles or family members (except for that obscure cousin Quentyn Tyrell, but if you ask me anyone called Quentyn in asoiaf is better off dead)

I mean, the dude spent the war feasting with his homeboys while everyone else was fighting and dying. If that's not smart I don't know what is

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Kind of off topic but Does anyone else think mace actually isn't a complete buffoon but rather competent because his Roberts rebellion strategy is pretty good rebels win he surrenders without any real complaints against him and loyalist win he beats Robert and sieges his brothers out I smell a handship.

His wotfk strategy is fine too team up with well liked politically skilled likely decent warrior renly for a marriage prestige tyrells at court and a very happy third son.

I know olenna is meant to be the brains if the family but I don't know if I can buy the great oaf if high garden usually deferring to her good judgement if he is a massive oaf.

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It was actually a really smart move.

He wasn't taking any risks or losing men, but Aerys' couldn't have accused him of doing nothing because technically he was doing something. If Storm's End falls, awesome. If not, he was still a loyalist. And unlike most of the other Great Houses, the Tyrells survived the war practically unscathed, without losing any significant titles or family members (except for that obscure cousin Quentyn Tyrell, but if you ask me anyone called Quentyn in asoiaf is better off dead)

I mean, the dude spent the war feasting with his homeboys while everyone else was fighting and dying. If that's not smart I don't know what is

Yep, it was a chaotic situation, and he created an island of stability for himself in the calm of a siege. The Reach borders the Stormlands, so he had easy access to supplies and reinforcements, his host was large enough to deter attackers with all the fighting north (and apparently some in the Dornish Marches), and no matter what happened, he could get away with either not having done enough harm to merit malice from Robert should he win, and having sided and aided the royalists should they win. If Storm's End fell, he'd have bargaining chips to deal with Robert, or prizes to hand over to a grateful Aerys.

It was a great place to be for him, when you consider how risky all the other options were.

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I know olenna is meant to be the brains if the family but I don't know if I can buy the great oaf if high garden usually deferring to her good judgement if he is a massive oaf.

I don't think she is being entirely truthful. She is talking to Sansa after all, Sansa who is sick of the nest of vipers that is Kings Landing where she cant trust anyone.

They are trying to get Sansa to marry Willas, as like the Lannisters they want a chance of having the North, so Olenna plays up how different they are than the Lannisters and schmers of the Royal court. That Mace is a bumbling fool with no hidden agenda would be pretty tempting to Sansa after dealing with Cersei, Tyrion, Joffrey, Varys, Littlefinger and Tywin, and constantly being on her guard.

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I don't think she is being entirely truthful. She is talking to Sansa after all, Sansa who is sick of the nest of vipers that is Kings Landing where she cant trust anyone.

They are trying to get Sansa to marry Willas, as like the Lannisters they want a chance of having the North, so Olenna plays up how different they are than the Lannisters and schmers of the Royal court. That Mace is a bumbling fool with no hidden agenda would be pretty tempting to Sansa after dealing with Cersei, Tyrion, Joffrey, Varys, Littlefinger and Tywin, and constantly being on her guard.

That makes sense though doesn't she also talk down renly in that meeting and say it was maces idea to go along with renly against what she making him seen a little power hungry much like the lannisters. Then again she could of argued in favor of renly and just be saying anything to Sansa to get the north or at least a good chance at it.

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I don't think she is being entirely truthful. She is talking to Sansa after all, Sansa who is sick of the nest of vipers that is Kings Landing where she cant trust anyone.

They are trying to get Sansa to marry Willas, as like the Lannisters they want a chance of having the North, so Olenna plays up how different they are than the Lannisters and schmers of the Royal court. That Mace is a bumbling fool with no hidden agenda would be pretty tempting to Sansa after dealing with Cersei, Tyrion, Joffrey, Varys, Littlefinger and Tywin, and constantly being on her guard.

That makes sense though doesn't she also talk down renly in that meeting and say it was maces idea to go along with renly against what she making him seen a little power hungry much like the lannisters. Then again she could of argued in favor of renly and just be saying anything to Sansa to get the north or at least a good chance at it.

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I've always thought that Mace was acting in line with orders from high up during RR, e.g after Ashford he could have wanted to pursue Robert and could have ended the rebellion easily since he greatly outnumbered him and had defeated him with just the vanguard, but I think it was a matter of the Hand of the King Jon Connington stepping in and taking over since at the time he wanted to get all the glory by killing Robert and Mace probably got assigned the siege of Storm's End by Jon Con because the siege was a task of honor just like Cersei gave him that same honor after she chucked him of the council.



He probably stayed in the Stormlands because he wasn't reassigned by either the king or his various hands. It seems Aerys and co saw Robert as the main threat from the beginning and hence Aerys could have wanted a large force making sure that Robert's homeland was strangled and that Stannis or any rebels couldn't recruit from the Stormlands, I could imagine Aerys being petty by just wanting to sh*t on the Baratheon backyard. Mace holding the region "hostage" was a crutch for Aerys just like having Elia and Jaime in Kingslanding. Probably thats why Rhaegar never thought of recalling him.



Also the in key battles the royalists outnumbered the rebels, even at stoney sept Jon Con had the numbers and at the trident Rhaegar had the numbers so there wasnt that much need in getting Mace. You have to consider that Royalists were led by men who saw Robert as just a"prize" or "trophy" both Jon Con and Rhaegar wanted Roberts head for themselves, Jon saw it as a way to win Rhaegars heart and the heart of the king and council, whilst Rhaegar saw Robert as a way to start his reign a way to sway the Lords to get behind him as king, the fact that Rhaegar and Jon were so short sighted and focused only on bobby b's head is the reason why they lost their battles



Mace's role was vital and probably appreciated greatly by the Royal side in RR and I think people who call Mace lazy are sort of being harsh. Mace did more than just sit on his arse, he made sure the king was in control of the south territories (Dorne, Reach and Stromlands)


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Ashford routed Robert's force and forced him North, But instead of sending a strong force in pursuit, Mace camps his whole army outside of Storm's End and doesn't send any aid to the Targaryens.

I'm not aware of any resentment between the Reach and Aerys, so Mace's action appears to be a grand example of strategic incompetence/in-adaptability. Surely he didn't need to camp all of the Reach's strength outside of Storm's End? The Reach can field a total force of up to 100,000 troops, why not send 20 or even 30 thousand of that strength northward after Robert and the rest of the Rebels? Or better yet with only half of that total strength, camp 10,000 outside of Storm's End while the other 40,000 goes north to fight the Rebellion?

Or did the Reach believe that they had more to gain from Robert's victory than a Loyalist one? Were they simply going through the motions concerning "supporting" the King? Is Mace Tyrell really that much of an idiot?

And yet, you forget that we are also not aware of any interest Mace may be defending by siding with Aerys?

By laying siege to Storm's End, he both seems to be taking the Targ side in case they win, and has only a small skirmish with Robert's vanguard if Robert wins. By bending the knee to Ned, instead of to Stannis, Mace also avoids negotiating with the guy he has been starving for the past year. Mace goes home, his army and lands nearly untouched by war, and without losing his standing in either position. Frey and Lannister and Greyjoy picked a side at the end of the war, Dorne was forced to side with the Targs, but the Reach spent the war hedging it's bets. In either a Loyalist or a Rebel victory, the Reach ends as of the start of the war, without losing anything. That by itself is an important objective, especially when one of the rebel armies is trying to work his way through the Reach to link up with the others.

Really, Mace is by now the single most powerfull lord in Westeros, the Hand of the king and with a queen for a daughter. Why are people constantly taking Olenna's word that he is an idiot when she has the single achievement of being played by Littlefinger to her name? Do people really think that Mace can't contorl his armies? Three armies under the commands of Mace, Garlan and Tarly by order of size, and the Redwyne fleet, all operating in thier own fronts. Tarly securing the eastern Riverlands, Redwyne taking Dragonstone and heading to confront the Ironborn, Garlan re-directing his army from taking Brightwater Keep to re-taking the Shield Islands, and Mace leaving a token force to siege Storm's End against the same size of garrison (if not larger), while taking the largest army to defend his daughter against the power of the Faith Militant if need be. Say what you want, but the guy is by no means a fool, nor is he incapable of operating on several fronts.

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Kind of off topic but Does anyone else think mace actually isn't a complete buffoon but rather competent because his Roberts rebellion strategy is pretty good rebels win he surrenders without any real complaints against him and loyalist win he beats Robert and sieges his brothers out I smell a handship.

His wotfk strategy is fine too team up with well liked politically skilled likely decent warrior renly for a marriage prestige tyrells at court and a very happy third son.

I know olenna is meant to be the brains if the family but I don't know if I can buy the great oaf if high garden usually deferring to her good judgement if he is a massive oaf.

Yep. Have had that line of thinking myself for a while.

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