Sleipnir1102 Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 So Tywin made Tyrion marry Sansa so the Lannisters could claim Winterfell and the North. But after Joffrey is poisoned, Tyrion's arrest and Sansa's disappearance, the Lannisters lose that claim correct? Looking back at the Tyrion/Sansa marriage, it got me thinking, would a House Lannister of Winterfell with Tyrion as its lord actually survive? It would be purely Lannister dominated, the child would a Lannister and the lion banner would fly over Winterfell. All the Northerners hate the Lannisters, except for the Boltons. Would a Lannister regime over the North work or was that a massive political error on Tywin's part? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry the Hair Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Chances are someone would've poisoned Tyrion's wine and a Manderly or an Umber would've then married Sansa and take over the North. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Tyrion rapes Sansa.Sansa gets pregnant.Sansa gives birth to a child.Tywin kills Sansa.Tyrion takes child to WF.Someone kills Tyrion.The end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twenty of House Goodmen Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Zero percent chance it would've worked. The Lannisters would never be accepted as the overlords to any region outside of the West. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trigger Warning Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 The child would take the name Stark to placate the northern nobility, their inheritance would come from Sansa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Make Shadowbabies Not War Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 On the information Tywin had, it was a good enough bet. The biggest problem with this plan is, of course, the same problem with Ramsey being Lord of Winterfell. Rickon would turn up, and Manderly's son would eventually come home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blow My Horn Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Tyrion not consummating the marriage renders the claim void. Maybe Tywin's machinations to marry Tyrion into the Stark family is similar to how Lann the Clever originally took over CR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweetgirl205 Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 It has long been said this series reflects British history. If it is true, than the Lannisters hold the title to Winterfell. If Sansa is indeed the heir, and she is an attainted traitor to the crown, the crown, therefore has the right to seize her property. It is the property of King Tommen at this point, held by that blistering boil known as Ramsay.Will they get it back? Probably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MistressofWhisperers Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Chances are someone would've poisoned Tyrion's wine and a Manderly or an Umber would've then married Sansa and take over the North. This... Tyrion rapes Sansa. Sansa gets pregnant. Sansa gives birth to a child. Tywin kills Sansa. Tyrion takes child to WF. Someone kills Tyrion. The end. and/or this. Tywin knows nothing about northmen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimJames Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 While this could work, it would be risky. First they would need to depend on Bolton Support, and would need to bring their own Lannister-Loyal soldiers to garrison Winterfell. It would help if Tyrion's son is raised to act like a Northman. Even so it will be generations before the North ever truly accepts a Lannister Lord, and Tyrion will need constant aid from the Westerlands for it to work.And this doesn't necessarily have to involve Tyrion raping Sansa. He could just do what Khal Drogo did to Daenarys: make it enjoyable enough for her that she goes along with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MistressofWhisperers Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 While this could work, it would be risky. First they would need to depend on Bolton Support, and would need to bring their own Lannister-Loyal soldiers to garrison Winterfell. It would help if Tyrion's son is raised to act like a Northman. Even so it will be generations before the North ever truly accepts a Lannister Lord, and Tyrion will need constant aid from the Westerlands for it to work.And this doesn't necessarily have to involve Tyrion raping Sansa. He could just do what Khal Drogo did to Daenarys: make it enjoyable enough for her that she goes along with it.No way, would she ever willingly sleep with the uncle of the guy who killed her father, mother, and brother. Leave aside the fact that he's a disfigured dwarf, it doesn't matter how "talented' he is and, really that's only played up on the show, no way Sansa goes beyond resigning herself to it. She would never enjoy it nor would she consent to it if he gave her a choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimJames Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 No way, would she ever willingly sleep with the uncle of the guy who killed her father, mother, and brother. Leave aside the fact that he's a disfigured dwarf, it doesn't matter how "talented' he is and, really that's only played up on the show, no way Sansa goes beyond resigning herself to it. She would never enjoy it nor would she consent to it if he gave her a choice.Tyrion and Sansa were married BEFORE the red wedding, so her brother and father are still alive. But anyway, I'm sure you remember when Khal Drogo and Daenarys Targaryen were married. The same principle could still apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abisal Posted March 31, 2015 Share Posted March 31, 2015 Tywin was planning to take Winterfell with "Ned's Grandson" AFTER Winter, at the start of Spring. That would have been 5-10 years later. At that point the Northmen loyal to the Starks like Manderly would have already clashed with the Boltons, probably leading to the deaths of many of those who were loyal to the Starks, so many of the houses of the North would probably then have had a different generation in power at the time. We know that during the long winters, like the one Maesters knew was coming, the North has HUGE death tolls and often requires to import food from the South, so Tywin would also have some control over which Lords would prosper during Winter and which ones would starve to death. Tywin's plan probably also included "Ned's Grandson" going accompanied with 10000 or so Lannister men to "help save" the North from the extremely unpopular Boltons (if they are still alive), to whom he'd shift all the blame for what happened to the Starks, Or if the Boltons have been killed by then, he probably thought he could play it as putting things back in order. "Ned's Grandson" would probably then take a campaign to drive the Wildlings who Tywin himself probably wanted to pour into the North, back to beyond the Wall, and probably build himself some following among Northern lords. The plan isn't bad, but it would indeed be ruined with Rickon turning up. However, Tywin couldn't have known that he was still alive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MistressofWhisperers Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Tyrion and Sansa were married BEFORE the red wedding, so her brother and father are still alive.But anyway, I'm sure you remember when Khal Drogo and Daenarys Targaryen were married. The same principle could still apply.Yeah and they weren't having sex before the RW either because Sansa couldn't stand him. Drogo/Dany makes me cringe because I find the consent dubious in that situation plus the idea of a woman being raped and then thinking "hey, this isn't so bad..." Ugh. It's just wrong. But, regardless, Drogo didn't represent the faction that killed Dany's family when they were married, so the situations aren't comparable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sithis Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 As many have already stated, the Northmen would never accept a Lannister as their lord. With that being said, I think Tywin intended to enforce the North's fidelity with the realm's strength after the war. Obviously he didn't foresee being murdered by his own son. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isobel Harper Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 So Tywin made Tyrion marry Sansa so the Lannisters could claim Winterfell and the North. But after Joffrey is poisoned, Tyrion's arrest and Sansa's disappearance, the Lannisters lose that claim correct? No. Looking back at the Tyrion/Sansa marriage, it got me thinking, would a House Lannister of Winterfell with Tyrion as its lord actually survive? It would be purely Lannister dominated, the child would a Lannister and the lion banner would fly over Winterfell. All the Northerners hate the Lannisters, except for the Boltons. Would a Lannister regime over the North work or was that a massive political error on Tywin's part? Maybe that's part of the "bittersweet ending?" Sansa gains control of the North, but not as a Stark, but as a Lannister? :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelittledragonthatcould Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Tyrion would have been Lord Protector but his children, if they wanted to rule Winterfell, would have been Starks not Lannisters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Lannister Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 The Lannisters disinherited Tyrion when he killed Tywin. So they disowned Tyrion's claim to the North through Sansa even if they fell madly in love and lived happily ever after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minuteman Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 Tyrion and Sansa have no emotional connection. Since splitting from the Purple Wedding neither have given the other a moments thought. Assuming one or both don't get killed the marriage can be annulled due to (1) it never being consummated (less likely) or (2) Tysha is found to be alive making Tyrion already married (more likely). There is absolutely no way this marriage will survive; not even as a sham marriage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLE Posted April 1, 2015 Share Posted April 1, 2015 I think Tywin's plan is going to go pear-shaped and what we will actually end up with is Sansa accepting the Lannister match - and putting, not a Lannister into Winterfell, but a Stark into Casterly Rock... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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