Tywin and his Stepmother

[HexMachina]

He could have but then wouldn't show how much he disapproved of his father's actions. With the walk he reminds Lannisport that Lannisters rule Casterly Rock, not whores.

She wasn't a whore. I wish people would stop referring to pretty much every woman who has sex in the novels as a whore. She was the daughter of a candle maker.

[Boarsbane]

She wasn't a whore. I wish people would stop referring to pretty much every woman who has sex in the novels as a whore. She was the daughter of a candle maker.

She had sex with Tytos for jewels and influence, sounds like she was whoring herself out to me. Either way it doesn't matter how we see but how Tywin does, and he obviously did.

[HexMachina]

Reread DWD. Especialy Kevan's thoughts about this. Everything is explained in detail.

Tywin is known to be ruthless because he is acting ruthless, not because he castamered Raynes once long ago and then was playin with pony pooping rainbow.

Because everyone is going to mistake Tywin for some kind and benevolent man if he just dismisses her/sends her away as opposed to parading her naked through the streets? That would make them forget all about the Reynes and Tarbecks? I think not. And just because Kevan think it was necessary/right doesn't mean we should. Kevan was a yes man. Anything Tywin did was fine by him

Edit: Boarsbane, she was not a whore. She didn't sell herself. Tytos took her as his mistress (his choice) and then began showering her with gifts.

[Boarsbane]

Because everyone is going to mistake Tywin for some kind and benevolent man if he just dismisses her/sends her away as opposed to parading her naked through the streets? That would make them forget all about the Reynes and Tarbecks? I think not. And just because Kevan think it was necessary/right doesn't mean we should. Kevan was a yes man. Anything Tywin did was fine by him

Edit: Boarsbane, she was not a whore. She didn't sell herself. Tytos took her as his mistress (his choice) and then began showering her with gifts.

She had a choice too, Tytos Lannister isn't going to force anyone into being his mistress and she surely knew how rich the Lannisters are so she no doubt expected to be well compensated, which is obvious with the way she just helps herself to Tywin's mom's jewels and clothes. A lot of people use the word 'whore' as a derogatory name for women but I'm using it literally, she sold her body to Tytos for wealth, she is a whore.

[HexMachina]

She had a choice too, Tytos Lannister isn't going to force anyone into being his mistress and she surely knew how rich the Lannisters are so she no doubt expected to be well compensated, which is obvious with the way she just helps herself to Tywin's mom's jewels and clothes. A lot of people use the word 'whore' as a derogatory name for women but I'm using it literally, she sold her body to Tytos for wealth, she is a whore.

No she isn't. No more than Missy Blackwood was a whore, or Casella Vaith, or any other Lords' mistress. Receiving gifts during a relationship doesn't make one a whore.

[Rhaegar Jaime Tyrell]

She wasn't a whore. I wish people would stop referring to pretty much every woman who has sex in the novels as a whore. She was the daughter of a candle maker.

What he did was cruel but it was necessary to send a message.

She wasn’t a whore. If she was just a whore/gold digger, he would have been more lenient. She was manipulative, power hungry and undermining Tywin’s reputation in Casterly Rock and the Westerlands.

After his father died and he returned to Casterly Rock from King’s Landing, Tywin found his father's mistress trying on one of his late mother's gowns and taking her jewellery.

Tywin learned that while he was away that his father's mistress dominated Tytos utterly, ordering about the household knights and dismissing servants and helping herself to his late wife's jewellery.

That would annoy most people. The sentimental value of these items is enormous.

On top of that a woman you barely know starts running Casterly Rock and lording it over people. You don’t think the other lords and ladies would think the Lannister are weak and therefore Tywin is weak.

Not only was she acting above her place in society, she was bringing shame on his family name.

Tywin had her stripped naked and forced the sobbing woman to walk the streets to confess to every man she met that she was a thief and a harlot before banishing her from the Westerlands.

What do you want him to do?

[TerrorVoid]

Because everyone is going to mistake Tywin for some kind and benevolent man if he just dismisses her/sends her away as opposed to parading her naked through the streets? That would make them forget all about the Reynes and Tarbecks? I think not. And just because Kevan think it was necessary/right doesn't mean we should. Kevan was a yes man. Anything Tywin did was fine by him

Edit: Boarsbane, she was not a whore. She didn't sell herself. Tytos took her as his mistress (his choice) and then began showering her with gifts.

I repeat. Reread Kevan's POV. Not his opinion. But motivation for WoS.

Yes. If you show weakness, you lose your ruthless reputation. If you are being ruthless once, but after that you are nice and sweet guy, who will forgive anything, you want be considered ruthless.

What he did was cruel but it was necessary to send a message.

She wasn’t a whore. If she was just a whore/gold digger, he would have been more lenient. She was manipulative, power hungry and undermining Tywin’s reputation in Casterly Rock and the Westerlands.

After his father died and he returned to Casterly Rock from King’s Landing, Tywin found his father's mistress trying on one of his late mother's gowns and taking her jewellery.

Tywin learned that while he was away that his father's mistress dominated Tytos utterly, ordering about the household knights and dismissing servants and helping herself to his late wife's jewellery.

That would annoy most people. The sentimental value of these items is enormous.

On top of that a woman you barely know starts running Casterly Rock and lording it over people. You don’t think the other lords and ladies would think the Lannister are weak and therefore Tywin is weak.

Not only was she acting above her place in society, she was bringing shame on his family name.

Tywin had her stripped naked and forced the sobbing woman to walk the streets to confess to every man she met that she was a thief and a harlot before banishing her from the Westerlands.

What do you want him to do?

Forgive her and let her go.

[Rhaegar Jaime Tyrell]

I don’t see why Tywin should forgive the mistress, she wasn't repentant and he wanted revenge In the world of Westeros, I could understand that.

What Tywin did to Tysha was disgusting and disgraceful.

He was taking out the anger he has on Tyrion and his father on an innocent Tysha. Whose only crime is to love Tyrion.

[thelittledragonthatcould]

What Tywin did to Tysha was disgusting and disgraceful.

He was taking out the anger he has on Tyrion and his father on an innocent Tysha. Whose only crime is to love Tyrion.

Did she really love Tyrion?

The Lannisters are the rulers of the West and she was just a poor peasant without a father. I doubt she would have been able to say no to the son of the Tywin Lannister asking her to marry him.

I dont look at it as some kind of love story, its far more tragic than that. Tysha had no option, she was not in a position to tell the son and heir to the Westerlands that she would not do it. She would not know what the consequences of saying no to him would be.

The OP is right, the treatment of Tysha and his fathers paramour is more of a disdain for the smallfolk than it is of some hatred of women.

[Olligarchy]

Frankly if people feel sorry for the golddigger that was trying to steal jewelry belonging to someones mother, they've got to take a reality check. Frankly if someone tried to do that to MY mothers jewelry... well it wouldn't be pretty.

I repeat. Reread Kevan's POV. Not his opinion. But motivation for WoS.

Yes. If you show weakness, you lose your ruthless reputation. If you are being ruthless once, but after that you are nice and sweet guy, who will forgive anything, you want be considered ruthless.

Forgive her and let her go.

So you're a doormat. Good for you. :)

Most people wouldn't turn the other cheek when someone steals from them.

[Minsc]

Gotta love Lannister fanboys for all the common complaints about people following a Northern Superman Myth they seem to have a similar attitude towards their favorite with them falling over themselves to explain why Lannister monstrosities aren't that bad and are in fact needed. Because I am sure when Martin wrote those mentions he expected people to consider them morally justifiable.

[Rhaegar Jaime Tyrell]

Did she really love Tyrion?

The Lannisters are the rulers of the West and she was just a poor peasant without a father. I doubt she would have been able to say no to the son of the Tywin Lannister asking her to marry him.

I dont look at it as some kind of love story, its far more tragic than that. Tysha had no option, she was not in a position to tell the son and heir to the Westerlands that she would not do it. She would not know what the consequences of saying no to him would be.

The OP is right, the treatment of Tysha and his fathers paramour is more of a disdain for the smallfolk than it is of some hatred of women.

I tried googling ito see if Tysha knew he was a Lannister. Did she even know he was Tyrion Lannister? After meeting, how long after did they get married. He could have just slept with her instead he married. He really liked her. She may not truly loved him but she would have felt liek she won the lottery. She is a 12 year old orphan who is to marry the son of one of the richest and most powerful men in the country.

I agree Tywin's actions are a result of his disdain for the smallfolk rather than them being women. However Tywin hates smallfolk women who try to better themselves by marrying above. He's also annoyed when his sister was told to marry beneath herself

[Rhaegar Jaime Tyrell]

Gotta love Lannister fanboys for all the common complaints about people following a Northern Superman Myth they seem to have a similar attitude towards their favorite with them falling over themselves to explain why Lannister monstrosities aren't that bad and are in fact needed. Because I am sure when Martin wrote those mentions he expected people to consider them morally justifiable.

Whats the Northern Superman myth?

In the context of Westeros, I don’t see his treatment of his Dad's mistress as a monstrosity. I think Olenna Tyrell, Stannis, Robert and Rickard Stark would have done something similar if an outsider caused so much trouble and brought shame on the family.

Ned and Robb probably wouldnt have been so harsh.

[Chinoiserie]

What I would like to know is why she and Tytos never had children. Wasn't she his mistress pretty long?

But we really do not know enough about her personality if she was a nice person who loved Tytos or a scheming golddigger. In any case I doupt Tywin cared, the problem in his point of view was that her actions caused shame on House Lannister and that had to be dealt with. Kevan seemed to offended by the mothers jewelry part as well, Tywin might have been too so it could have been partially emonational responce. But it was obviously not a good thing. It seems unlikely if it was nessecary but who knows.

And I would also like to know if she was still around by the time Tywin got back from King's Landing or did he order her treatment with a letter. If it was former she was pretty foolish to stay around.

[Boarsbane]

Gotta love Lannister fanboys for all the common complaints about people following a Northern Superman Myth they seem to have a similar attitude towards their favorite with them falling over themselves to explain why Lannister monstrosities aren't that bad and are in fact needed. Because I am sure when Martin wrote those mentions he expected people to consider them morally justifiable.

How? No one is acting like Westermen are some sort of superior race like the Stark fanboys tend to with the Northmen.

[SerBert]

Lets be honest, she was an overconfident jumped up bitch who didn't know her place. She needed dealing with and Tywin did in his familiar cruel way. Just like Cersei and Marillion needed to be dealt with.

[James Arryn]

Basic generational angst.

[Lord Ser Septon Maester]

She dishonored House Lannister. Tywin did what was necessary to abate that shame.

[Lord Ser Septon Maester]

Whats the Northern Superman myth?

In the context of Westeros, I don’t see his treatment of his Dad's mistress as a monstrosity. I think Olenna Tyrell, Stannis, Robert and Rickard Stark would have done something similar if an outsider caused so much trouble and brought shame on the family.

Ned and Robb probably wouldnt have been so harsh.

Good point, any lord in Westeros with very few exceptions maybe would have done the same or worse. Hell, Stannis might have burned her and most people think of him as the good guy.

[Minsc]

How? No one is acting like Westermen are some sort of superior race like the Stark fanboys tend to with the Northmen.

No, instead we get the whole every monstrosities the Lannisters do are justified and something that every lord would do.