Jaime L Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Yeah, it makes an already bad trade worse, for sure. So short-sighted. I didn't get that move when they made it. There's something to be said for patience. As the Warriors have shown. It's interesting to me the two most likely teams to meet in the Finals were defined by the Love trade. And as the season evolved, even before this injury, I started feeling like the team that did the trade would come up short to the one who didn't because of defense. Otherwise Cleveland and Golden State have been like mirror images to me in terms of style of play. These are the two kings of spacing in a league where everyone is moving that way. They'll both happily rain down 25 3's a game on opponent and bad shots to anyone else are good shots by them. And man, in retrospect, could you imagine if Golden State had given up Klay Thompson AND Draymond Green? They certainly wouldn't be the title favorite right now, I can say that much. And at the time I thought they should have done the deal. Yeah so, uh, my bad. Didn't realize we were talking a DPOY candidate and the best two-way 2 guard in the league. Golden State really had the perfect offseason in terms of the moves they made and the moves they didn't. And the perfect season has followed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Tiger Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Yeah, it makes an already bad trade worse, for sure. So short-sighted. I didn't get that move when they made it. There's something to be said for patience. How exactly? What does Wiggins add to Cleveland that you really need? Love had rebounding and outside shooting. What does Wiggins have other than defense? He could add offensive firepower but Cleveland already has plenty of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 And it is yet another trade that helps the East look like the JV conference. How exactly? What does Wiggins add to Cleveland that you really need? Love had rebounding and outside shooting. What does Wiggins have other than defense? He could add offensive firepower but Cleveland already has plenty of that.As you said, he could add offensive firepower and great defense, both of which you cannot have too much of. He is also getting better, unlike Love. And unlike Love, he is ridiculously underpaid because he's still on his rookie deal, so you could bring in a $12 mil/year free agent to help out as well. And Love has only one year left on his deal, and while the Cavs simply assumed he'd resign, Love was quite clear that he hadn't decided. PLUS, Love had made it clear that he wasn't resigning in Minnesota, so the TWolves had no choice but to trade him for the best offer they could get. The Warriors and Cavaliers were by far the most serious bidders, and then the Warriors dropped out. Nonetheless, the Cavs stuck with their incredibly generous trade, in spite of seemingly bidding against themselves. AND as if all that wasn't enough, it wasn't Wiggins for Love, it was Wiggins + Bennett + Miami's first round pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Tiger Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Even if Love goes I don't see this trade having a vast impact on Cleveland's future. Im sorry, but other than his athletecism and the amount of minutes he plays as a rookie, nothing truly impresses me about Wiggins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime L Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 How exactly? What does Wiggins add to Cleveland that you really need? Love had rebounding and outside shooting. What does Wiggins have other than defense? He could add offensive firepower but Cleveland already has plenty of that. Love is unquestionably more useful this year. Wiggins could provide some perimeter D and be useful as a poor man's Wade on offense. He's not a good enough shooter yet to be a classic 3 and D guy. But in terms of what Cleveland needed, they're probably ok with Smith/Shumpert filling that need for them and Mosgov to cover up Love's big-time flaw though for the price of losing any future flexibility. If they're not good enough this year, how will they get to be good enough? Kinda a risky all-in gamble on this season. Also in 2-3 years, Wiggins could be a legit superstar. Guys like that are never made available. And Wiggins ascension would have directly offset Lebron's inevitable decline. If things broke right could have been a legit 5-7 year window as the title favorite or just about. Now probably more like 3 years or so and that's assuming Love re-signs or they find someone as good. It's hard to say to Lebron to be patient when he's still in his prime and who knows what the future brings but I think it'll prove to be short-sighted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Tiger Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Love is unquestionably more useful this year. Wiggins could provide some perimeter D and be useful as a poor man's Wade on offense. He's not a good enough shooter yet to be a classic 3 and D guy. But in terms of what Cleveland needed, they're probably ok with Smith/Shumpert filling that need for them and Mosgov to cover up Love's big-time flaw though for the price of losing any future flexibility. If they're not good enough this year, how will they get to be good enough? Kinda a risky all-in gamble on this season. Also in 2-3 years, Wiggins could be a legit superstar. Based on what? Look I am not asking this to mock you or anything, im truly not, but people often say "This guy COULD be a superstar, that guy could be that?" but he could just as easily turn into the next Tyreke Evans, a guy who's only notability is his flashy game and the fact that he was brilliant in comparison to the other rookies. I honestly don't think Cleveland will have THAT big of a problem replacing Love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slurktan Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Dwayne Casey fun:Today in his post season interview Casey talked about how it was hard to run a system with 5 wings for playing time then said this nugget, "The guy I feel for is James Johnson. He's probably the most talented player on our roster." In case you were wondering James Johnson was the guy the Raps brought in to play defense against bigger guys like Joe Johnson and Paul Pierce. Casey refused to play him any significant minutes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Tiger Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Wait, Joe Johnson is still in the league? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manhole Eunuchsbane Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 He is also getting better, unlike Love. And unlike Love, he is ridiculously underpaid because he's still on his rookie deal, so you could bring in a $12 mil/year free agent to help out as well. And Love has only one year left on his deal, and while the Cavs simply assumed he'd resign, AND as if all that wasn't enough, it wasn't Wiggins for Love, it was Wiggins + Bennett + Miami's first round pick. Couldn't have said it better. This was a bad trade before the injury. If Love ends up sitting out the rest of the way, or being ineffective, it becomes a disastrous trade. They mortgaged the future for a championship now. Minus the championship, and what are you left with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 Count me in on the bad trade camp.ESPN just announced that Love is out for the semis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sperry Posted April 27, 2015 Share Posted April 27, 2015 If Love leaves in the offseason, which I think he will, it is a historically bad trade, in the running for worst ever. Wiggins is an athletic freak who plays great defense and shows a lot of promise on the offensive end. He has potential superstar written all over him, and his floor is quality starter and elite defensive stopper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calibandar Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 If Love leaves in the offseason, which I think he will, it is a historically bad trade, in the running for worst ever. That injury could have huge repercussions for this year and going forward. If Love is out for a month and the Cavs fail to win the East, I think the odds that Love walks away go waay up. And then Lebron is left in Cleveland with just Irving. Now, that's a great duo for many years to come, but that isn't going to cut it against the best in the West, and it's going to hurt that much more to see Wiggins lighting it up. That injury could potentially change the entire NBA landscape. I don't think Kevin Love will leave though. I would be hugely surprised by that, and I think the odds of that happening are poor.It's one thing to not be LeBron's best buddy. It's quite another to finally play for a team that can win rings, with the best player in the world, and leave that team and all the chances that you'd leave behind. I don't believe he will do that. He will stay. It's also that he doesn't have the great alternatives. The Lakers and the Celtics? Not that attractive a proposal I think.That said much could change in the summer so more options may open up, but I still don't think something would trump what he can do with the Cavs. On another note, I was watching Spurs vs Clippers the other night.Things that stood out? Kahwi Leonard can be phenomenal. Great shooting, great defending, reliable, best player on the team really. Definitely top 10 in the NBA.Chris Paul, awesome. This was a really good game to see why people think he's such a fantastic player. Incredible skill set.Finally, Blake Griffin and DeAndre Jordan's atrocious free shooting. That was not the first time I have seen DJ air-balling his free throws. Ridiculous that he's so bad at. A defensive monster and a good player to watch, but really when he goes to the line I just cringe. Similarly, Griffin shoots very very poorly as well and it's odd that he too is not able to improve this aspect of his game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramsay B. Posted April 28, 2015 Author Share Posted April 28, 2015 Way to lay an egg Bulls, that 4th quarter was fucking brutal. Missed lay-ups, whining after every non-call and Rose settling for those line drive 3's. Michael Carter-Williams killed us.J.R.Smith 2 game suspension, Perkins a 15k fine and Olynyk 1 game(for what it's worth). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biter Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Wait, Joe Johnson is still in the league? Joe Johnson is still playing in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A Prince of Dorne Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 The Cavs best hope now lies with Milwaukee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 How much longer until Game of Thrones' season finale and the board returns to a semblance of stability? :tantrum:The Bucks are giving Chicago a series, but I don't think they can win the next two. If Cleveland does beat the Bulls without Love... Won't that just reinforce the Love trade as unnescessary and overpriced? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime L Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Based on what? Look I am not asking this to mock you or anything, im truly not, but people often say "This guy COULD be a superstar, that guy could be that?" but he could just as easily turn into the next Tyreke Evans, a guy who's only notability is his flashy game and the fact that he was brilliant in comparison to the other rookies. I honestly don't think Cleveland will have THAT big of a problem replacing Love. He's almost definitely one of the 5 most highly regarded prospects of the last decade and he looks clearly to be one of the 5 best athletes in the NBA right now. Tyreke Evans was a pleasant surprise as a rookie though wasn't too shocking he never really improved upon it as he was never seen as a surething. If this isn't Wiggins worst season I think a lot of people will be stunned by that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maithanet Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 I don't know what is going on with the Hawks or the Bulls. I expected Atlanta to split in Brooklyn and that boring series would mercifully end in 5. But instead they lost both road games, and at times looked really outplayed. In spite of being 2-2, I still can't really believe this team would lose to the Nets, but it is amazing that they can't put away such inferior competition. Atlanta won 60 games this year by consistently trouncing teams just like the Nets! And the Bulls. I didn't see any of the game, but I thought for sure they would take care of business in Chicago and get ready for Cleveland. Instead, 3-0 has turned into 3-2, and they're going back to Milwaukee. Maybe this time some actual Bucks fans will show up? While it would take a miracle for the Bucks to actually pull off this upset, I don't understand why they're even still playing. Man the East is terrible. I thought once the playoffs started that the Bulls, Hawks and Cavs would demonstrate how much better they were than the rest of the conference. Instead it's the suddenly injured Cavs and "why didn't they play like this before?" Wizards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhom Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Just got a push notification that Love is unlikely to return for the playoffs.Bummer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime L Posted April 28, 2015 Share Posted April 28, 2015 Instead it's the suddenly injured Cavs and "why didn't they play like this before?" Wizards. Can't speak to what's going on with the Bulls and Hawks. Haven't watched enough of those series except to note Milwaukee has, hands down, the weirdest roster of any playoff team I've ever seen. I think Nets-Hawks has largely been on NBA TV which says all it needs to about public interest in that series. The Wizards are as genuinely baffling as everyone else. I mean they broke out an offense for the playoffs they had virtually never used during the regular season, moving Paul Pierce (or Uncle Drew Gooden) to the stretch-4 and making use of Otto Porter's 3 and D skills at the 3 creating spacing with a lineup and that just dominated the Raptors when it was on the court. It was so immediately successful the question was why hadn't Wittman used it before now? Was he really saving it (and Pierce), and hiding Porter, to unveil it with devastation the second the playoffs started? The fact Simmons (jokingly) compared him to Keyser Soze is a stunning turnaround for a guy who doesn't know which way is up on his white board. There's no way you're keeping your optimal strategy on the DL all season as you bumble your way to the 5th seed in a shitty conference. Did he finally catch the Warriors on TNT or something? Maybe he finally got cable. Or getting that white board figured out really freed up his mind to pursue larger basketball strategies. Watch it all fall apart next round but I'm going enjoy this one moment where seemingly the rest of the Eastern Conference, except the Wizards, are falling apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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