Shouldn't others have figured out R+L=J

[Lord_Tyrell]

Really, everything just seems way too damn suspicious for someone else to have not figured it out even without being told. Think about it, 3 Kingsguard, which include the Lord Commander and Rhaegar's best friend the Sword of the Morning, are there protecting Lyanna Stark and not with Prince Viserys or seen anywhere else during the events of Robert's Rebellion. Ned then returns Dawn and Ashara Dayne jumps to her death, which really Ashara could be the only remote conclusion for Jon's mother if Ned is the father since he immediately returns North and wouldn't have had time to really stop off everywhere else he's been. Plus I doubt Ned saw Ashara within 9 months of what transpired at the Tower of Joy, so they must have lied about Jon's age by a few months in order to pull it off.

So with all of this, it seems to me that someone else should have figured this out, in particularly Tywin and Varys. Tywin is a shrewd and calculating man who didn't want to risk the Targaryens rising again after all he's done. I think he'd notice 3 of the Kingsguard being killed by honorable Ned Stark and his men and think there was something highly suspicious about it. The Kingsguard being there with Lyanna Stark instead of Viserys is a big red flag in all of this. Judging from the conversation Ned had with the Kingsguard, neither beat around the bush on what is up those stairs and Ned was clearly tipped off by someone on where they were and what he would find when he got there.

Varys though I don't think would have bought for an instant Ned's story, and think that Robert's comment with dragonspawn and Tywin's previous massacres as reasons for protecting Jon as his bastard. Granted I actually do think Varys has figured it out, as has Benjen. As for other smart people, I don't think LF or Jaime figured it out due to their arrogance and happiness that Ned Stark had a bastard son. Tyrion I think was too young to really give it any thought. Aemon I would say figured it out, but if that were the case, I think he would have said something about it to Sam on his deathbed instead of obsessing over Dany.

Clearly Tywin didn't discover it since Jon actually reached puberty, but surely someone else has had this epiphany. Who else would have discovered it?

[Isobel Harper]

ADwD, The Lost Lord:

"No man could have asked for a worthier son," Griff said, "but the lad is not of my blood, and his name is not Griff. My lords, I give you Aegon Targaryen, firstborn son of Rhaegar, Prince of Dragonstone, by Princess Elia of Dorne … soon, with your help, to be Aegon, the Sixth of His Name, King of Andals, the Rhoynar, and the First Men, and Lord of the Seven Kingdoms."

Maybe there are a few that do know.

[Knight Of Winter]

Why do you assume that 3 KG being at the TOJ was public knowledge? How would e.g. Tywin know where exactly Arthir, Gerold and Oswell were during last few months of the war?

[The Wolves]

I do wonder how nobody thinks that Lyanna could have had a kid with Ryaegar while kidnapped for over a year, and Ned popping up with a bastard.

But people in Westeros are dumb.

[ManderlysPies]

Why do you assume that 3 KG being at the TOJ was public knowledge? How would e.g. Tywin know where exactly Arthir, Gerold and Oswell were during last few months of the war?

Its public knowledge Ned killed Dayne, Bran thinks about early on. Plus when Ned comes back and says Lyannas dead, I killed Dayne and oh, here's my bastard, someone must surely suspect something.

[Lord_Tyrell]

Why do you assume that 3 KG being at the TOJ was public knowledge? How would e.g. Tywin know where exactly Arthir, Gerold and Oswell were during last few months of the war?

He knew eventually, especially since it was open knowledge he killed Arthur Dayne. Hell Cersei knew about this, so Tywin certainly did.

[the falling squirrel]

I read this first as "Shouldn't Others..." :)

[anonnyscouse]

This has always been my major gripe about R+L=J, it makes no sense that no-one could figure it out. The only person who seems stupid enough to take Ned's Wylla story at face value is Robert, everyone else would have been suspicious.

[Jon Dovahkiin Snow]

It was more common to have a bastard then. It was UNcommon for someone with such high birth to actually acknowledge one and take him in and raise him. For Ned to actually admit and acknowledge Jon may have made people believe him right then and there and not given it too much thought after that.

Most people probably weren't even thinking twice about it, or at least not relating it to Lyanna. They were probably just shocked that Ned Stark could do such a thing, not looking for alternate reasons for the child being brought there.

This is all what I assume at least.

[Blackfish Tully]

Why would Tywin Lannister give a second thought about Ned Stark's bastard? Bastards are a common thing in Westeroes , The fact that Ned Stark has one would mean nothing to Tywin and the thought that he might be Rhaegars would not even be a thought . If Jon had silver hair then that would be totally different but Lords having bastards during wartime is no surprise. Him bringing him to his home is strange but the Southerners would figure that some Northern thing.

[RoamingRonin]

All details aside, honorable Ned Stark coming back from the Tower of Joy with a baby should have had some people guessing Lyanna had a child by Rhaegar. The small folk and highlords gossip shamelessly. If people can speculate Jon's mother is Ashara Dayne then why not Lyanna?

[Night's Princess]

Yeah, bastards are all over the place. It's not just common but EXPECTED for a man to stray at least once, and if it results in a bastard, well then. It is unusual that Ned chooses to raise Jon (from an objective standpoint) but really it can be chalked up to his legendary honor. He made the boy, so to everyone else it makes sense he would follow through.

[Howling Mad]

Easy, people believe what they want to believe. Also this: 1) The only surviving witnesses are Eddard and his most loyal bannerman; 2) Eddard's reputation for honor allows people to believe such a dishonorable lie as fathering a bastard; 3) Jon doesn't have any external Targaryen features; 4) Given the murder of his father and brother by the Mad King who would believe that Ned would protect a Targaryen prince?

[Jon Dovahkiin Snow]

All details aside, honorable Ned Stark coming back from the Tower of Joy with a baby should have had some people guessing it was Lyanna's child by Rhaegar. If people can speculate Jon's mother is Ashara Dayne then why not Lyanna?

Because people were questioning who his mother was with Ned being the father. Lyanna wouldn't even be an option.

[EastTymor]

Yeah, bastards are all over the place. It's not just common but EXPECTED for a man to stray at least once, and if it results in a bastard, well then. It is unusual that Ned chooses to raise Jon (from an objective standpoint) but really it can be chalked up to his legendary honor. He made the boy, so to everyone else it makes sense he would follow through.

This. In the aftermath of a continental war and its attendant chaos, rumors, and misinformation, nobody is going to think twice about one bastard out of thousands. Catelyn seems to have been the only one, but Ned shut her down thoroughly.

[Rippounet]

I read this first as "Shouldn't Others..." :)

Me too. :)

Because people were questioning who his mother was with Ned being the father. Lyanna wouldn't even be an option.

Yup. Tis also why it's not that easy to guess in the books/show.

[EastTymor]

Me too. :)

Yup. Tis also why it's not that easy to guess in the books/show.

I figure the Unsullied are actually a pretty good comparison for the Westerosi public when it comes the events at ToJ. Neither of them has read Ned's PoV of what went down there, both have more pressing concerns than Jon's parents, and both see (book) events channeled through an inaccurate medium.

[The Dames do Moan]

All details aside, honorable Ned Stark coming back from the Tower of Joy with a baby should have had some people guessing Lyanna had a child by Rhaegar. The small folk and highlords gossip shamelessly. If people can speculate Jon's mother is Ashara Dayne then why not Lyanna?

bastards were conceived all the time during war, and I don't think at that point everyone knew about Ned and his honor. He was still relatively young and hadn't had time to build up his reputation yet.

I feel like after the fact if anyone thought about it, they would just think, lapse in judgment and he did the honorable thing to raise him as his own

[RoamingRonin]

Because people were questioning who his mother was with Ned being the father. Lyanna wouldn't even be an option.

Like I said, the people in the books gossip shamelessly and they have no problems coming up with all kinds of weird scenarios for other high profile events. But Ned Stark comes back from the ToJ with a baby... after Rhaegar Targaryen kidnapped/ran away with his sister... who mysteriously died...

[Pecan]

I think it helps that Jon was raised at Winterfell in the remote north, as opposed to someplace like Riverrun or Casterly Rock. Out of sight, out of mind.