Show Ramsay v. Book Ramsay?

[rosehustle1]

He's still plenty bad, but yes indeed, he has been toned down.

For instance he didn't put the iron born on wooden stakes and line the road with them.

It also seems a tiny bit less misogynistic to hunt a former girlfriend ( who is fully clothed) presumably at Myranda's insistence, vs. hunting a random nude woman about every week or so, with 20 guys on horseback, and where the chase ends in a flaying. The latter seems much more vicious and misgynistic to me imo.

Also, "Reek" doesn't look that much different from a slimmer Alfie Allen.

They definitely should have made Alfie look closer to Reek in the books. I think that is part of why the torture he went through doesn't seem has obvious to Sansa. Give him the grey hair and make it look like he is missing teeth. They should have had visible marks on his body. I think this would have made the scene when Sansa sees him for the first time much more tragic and also terrifying for her. Then from that point on, she would know that she is marrying a person even more terrible than Joffrey and could have changed her tactics for handling the situation. I mean, that dinner scene would have been completely different. She would have definitely used her courtesy as armor after seeing what Theon looked liked in that situation.

[Alayne's Shadow.]

There is no logic in keeping (F)Arya locked up in the books either as his claim derives from hers. Why doesn't Roose in the books make sure that everyone sees (F)Arya all the time? You can't say she is locked up because she is Jeyne because according to the Boltons she is Arya Stark of Wintefell.

And everyone knows she's not Arya though. Since the Lords are staying in Winterfell, there's a real sense of danger about leaving Jeyne Poole trotting around. Her eyes are brown. She almost revealed her real name to the spearwives. They can't keep up the charade everyone's prettending to believe if Jeyne reveals herself. They used Theon as legitimacy.

Sansa doesn't have that problem. It's quite the opposite, actually.

[Primalsplit]

They definitely should have made Alfie look closer to Reek in the books. I think that is part of why the torture he went through doesn't seem has obvious to Sansa. Give him the grey hair and make it look like he is missing teeth. They should have had visible marks on his body. I think this would have made the scene when Sansa sees him for the first time much more tragic and also terrifying for her. Then from that point on, she would know that she is marrying a person even more terrible than Joffrey and could have changed her tactics for handling the situation. I mean, that dinner scene would have been completely different. She would have definitely used her courtesy as armor after seeing what Theon looked liked in that situation.

What is this courtesy armor you are talking about? Does it have anything to do with Sansa?

[Seaworth'sShipmate]

This might be one of my favorite show!Ramsay scenes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWoJqxEiJeY

This one is made fun of a lot, but I liked it because Ramsay seemed the most human in it. Not "sympathetic" or "understandable" just believable, somewhat interesting person.

In every other scene after this one he just seems like an evil cartoon character with not a ton of depth. Also, I don't know what the costume/make up people did, but he looks a lot uglier and scarier in this scene, with paler skin and sallower cheek bones. I wish they kept that look for season 5.

[boojam]

They definitely should have made Alfie look closer to Reek in the books. I think that is part of why the torture he went through doesn't seem has obvious to Sansa. Give him the grey hair and make it look like he is missing teeth. They should have had visible marks on his body. I think this would have made the scene when Sansa sees him for the first time much more tragic and also terrifying for her. Then from that point on, she would know that she is marrying a person even more terrible than Joffrey and could have changed her tactics for handling the situation. I mean, that dinner scene would have been completely different. She would have definitely used her courtesy as armor after seeing what Theon looked liked in that situation.

Well Alfie does a good job of looking a acting haggard , but some grey streaks in his hair would have been easy to do.

[GeorgeIAF]

Both versions are really good, can't separate one from the other.

[Channel4s-JonSnow]

Well Alfie does a good job of looking a acting haggard , but some grey streaks in his hair would have been easy to do.

I think Alfie does a great job of looking like a homeless shell of a human being.

[thehandwipes]

This might be one of my favorite show!Ramsay scenes: https://www.youtube....h?v=dWoJqxEiJeY

This one is made fun of a lot, but I liked it because Ramsay seemed the most human in it. Not "sympathetic" or "understandable" just believable, somewhat interesting person.

In every other scene after this one he just seems like an evil cartoon character with not a ton of depth. Also, I don't know what the costume/make up people did, but he looks a lot uglier and scarier in this scene, with paler skin and sallower cheek bones. I wish they kept that look for season 5.

Agreed, Roose and Ramsay worked really well together in season 4. That was a great climax to the season 4 arc.

Season 5 was just a disaster.

[Seaworth'sShipmate]

Agreed, Roose and Ramsay worked really well together in season 4. That was a great climax to the season 4 arc.

Season 5 was just a disaster.

Correct. And As for the Ramsay/ Roose thing I don't know why it was a disaster. The scenes they had weren't awful, they just weren't really that deep or interesting at all, and Ramsay perhaps just seemed so silly.

I actually don't think its that absurd on its face for Sansa to be in Winterfell, married to Ramsay. It seems a logical choice for show producers with limited airtime/money. I think it actually could have worked if done correctly.

I was disappointed that Sansa didn't really learn or grow from her experiences with Joffrey and Lysa. I was looking forward to her "playing" Ramsay a bit more, and turning him on Myranda. Id argue that even more disturbing than Sansa's rape would be Sansa feigning interest and desire for Ramsay and then being horrified disgusted with the whole business afterward. There would have been far more tension, and fear among the audience for Sansa being found out.

[of man and wolf]

Hard to go by the books to the T with this character because what he is in the books cannot be shown on the tv without making this a horror film.

Iwan though is doing great imo.

[LatrineDiggerBrian]

Correct. And As for the Ramsay/ Roose thing I don't know why it was a disaster. The scenes they had weren't awful, they just weren't really that deep or interesting at all, and Ramsay perhaps just seemed so silly.

I actually don't think its that absurd on its face for Sansa to be in Winterfell, married to Ramsay. It seems a logical choice for show producers with limited airtime/money. I think it actually could have worked if done correctly.

I was disappointed that Sansa didn't really learn or grow from her experiences with Joffrey and Lysa. I was looking forward to her "playing" Ramsay a bit more, and turning him on Myranda. Id argue that even more disturbing than Sansa's rape would be Sansa feigning interest and desire for Ramsay and then being horrified disgusted with the whole business afterward. There would have been far more tension, and fear among the audience for Sansa being found out.

It would've been ridiculous and not believable if Sansa was able to get the upper hand on Ramsey. She did what she could and her character has grown over the years. But if you're expecting her to become the second coming of Baelish and out wit the Bolton's all of a sudden, that seems more like the plotting of a fairy tale not Game of Thrones.

[Marcus Agrippa]

It was all bad. Season 5 was really bad story telling. I would give it star wars legacy bad. The characters didn't move, the shows ending felt empty and muted. Nothing seemed to connect and everything was under explained. Dorne was the worst of it but the north was just as bad. Essos was the only half decent area while KL was largerly subpar.

[Bobby b's bobby]

It was all bad. Season 5 was really bad story telling. I would give it star wars legacy bad. The characters didn't move, the shows ending felt empty and muted. Nothing seemed to connect and everything was under explained. Dorne was the worst of it but the north was just as bad. Essos was the only half decent area while KL was largerly subpar.

Some of the wall was okay the olly needs to be in every scene nod stare and react to everything being about as subtle as God I don't even have anything to put here it was that bad And melisandra needing to flash and hump Jon cause she only knows boobs not her visions can get Jon on her side but hardhome was okay slynt was okay bar olly bring me my sword (why not edd fetch block) it's a line pepole like cut just cause. Some of the gilly and sam stuff was alright some was ass and stannis and sansa in wf was pretty much all crap.

I'm not sure if saying it's episode 1 2 and 3 is harsh or not I'd say yes but maybe not

[Aemon's counsel]

This might be one of my favorite show!Ramsay scenes: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWoJqxEiJeY

This one is made fun of a lot, but I liked it because Ramsay seemed the most human in it. Not "sympathetic" or "understandable" just believable, somewhat interesting person.

In every other scene after this one he just seems like an evil cartoon character with not a ton of depth. Also, I don't know what the costume/make up people did, but he looks a lot uglier and scarier in this scene, with paler skin and sallower cheek bones. I wish they kept that look for season 5.

It's one of the few Ramsay scenes I like, too. It's a scene with only 'villains' in, but they don't smash us over the head with indicators that they're villains - they just seem like a father and a son sorting out their family legacy. And Ramsey seems almost vulnerable, for once, as opposed to the unstoppable machine of ingenious evil that he is in his other scenes. It was a rare instance of subtlety in the show, and it was great.

And yes, there was definitely something that made Iwan look different and scarier than usual in that scene. (Possibly it's the lighting - Iwan doesn't get a lot of outdoors, daytime scenes.) His costume made him look more formidable, too - I think that's the only time we've seen him in a cloak and other thick, 'outdoors' clothing, and those clothes bulked him up a bit and made him seem more imposing. (And, well, anything would make him look scarier than he looked in his S3 hobbit hoodie costume. I really don't know what they were thinking with that particular wardrobe choice - had they decided that, because he was a bastard, he would be dressed in scruffy commoner clothes, only to change their minds for S4 and dress him more like a Northern noble?)

I don't think I've heard of the scene being made fun of before. Why do people make fun of it?

[The Amun Ra]

It's one of the few Ramsay scenes I like, too. It's a scene with only 'villains' in, but they don't smash us over the head with indicators that they're villains - they just seem like a father and a son sorting out their family legacy. And Ramsey seems almost vulnerable, for once, as opposed to the unstoppable machine of ingenious evil that he is in his other scenes. It was a rare instance of subtlety in the show, and it was great.

That's exactly why I prefer TV Ramsay (and also Roose). Book Ramsay is a complete monster and probably solely existing for that reason. TV Ramsay is still sadistic and evil but this scene actually shows that he is just a person. I like the fact that TV Ramsay is an experienced fighter and also pretty intelligent so he actually has some "qualities". I also liked that they omitted idle threats he keeps throwing all the time (something about cutting Lady Dustin's tits and flaying someone alive and making him eat his own skin...)

[John Doe]

Show Ramsay looks like a Hobbit.

[The Stannis Inquisition]

I think I prefer show Ramsay, he makes me chuckle. Book Ramsay is like an ogre, as someone described before.

What is more cliché - a monstrous ogre or a psychopath with charisma?

Both have been done before. A lot.

[Marcus Agrippa]

Some of the wall was okay the olly needs to be in every scene nod stare and react to everything being about as subtle as God I don't even have anything to put here it was that bad And melisandra needing to flash and hump Jon cause she only knows boobs not her visions can get Jon on her side but hardhome was okay slynt was okay bar olly bring me my sword (why not edd fetch block) it's a line pepole like cut just cause. Some of the gilly and sam stuff was alright some was ass and stannis and sansa in wf was pretty much all crap.

I'm not sure if saying it's episode 1 2 and 3 is harsh or not I'd say yes but maybe not

Hard home is the one of the two episode's I liked of the season. Four actually was pretty decent despite the whole barristan ordeal. It was pretty much equal to star wars 1 2 3. It's a shame because ADWD had some really good set up for everyone.

[Wavey Sauce]

Book Ramsay is so so so so so much worse.

But with the show Ramsay and that rape scene with Sansa, it can be hard for show only watchers to picture how in the heck he could be worse then that

[KingStoneheart]

I think the reason they don't show the full extent of his hunts is because imagine how many feminists would freak out if he done that in the show on several occasions