Your Random ASOIAF/TWOIAF/D&E Opinions, Confessions and Dirty Secrets, NUMERO CINCO

[Lord Davos Baratheon]

It's technically on the show, but Bob's quote in reference to Lyanna "And 7 Kingdoms couldn't fill the hole she left behind" always makes me laugh. How big, exactly, was her... um... hole?

It's technically on the show, but Bob's quote in reference to Lyanna "And 7 Kingdoms couldn't fill the hole she left behind" always makes me laugh. How big, exactly, was her... um... hole?

Lol!

[Lord Davos Baratheon]

I did not realize Abel and the washerwomen were Mance and the spearwives until like way after I read that part. Afterwards when I realized I was like wow duh. How did I not catch that. This is my guilt ridden confession.

Same here.

I must say, it made me feel pretty dumb afterwards.

[Good Guy Garlan]

Here's a confession: for ages I'd put Davos in my top 5 characters, but I've recently came to the realization that the reason I love his chapters so much was more because of Stannis and less about Davos. Basically, I was a Stan stan in self-denial.

I still think Davos is awesome though, but Stannis is definitely a more complex/gray character (how I like them), and has since taken up Davos' spot in my top 5.

[KhaleesiPhD]

My first read-through of the books, I pretty much skipped a lot of the chapters on the Iron Islands, and then realized how much I missed during my second read-through. Oops.

I also hate to admit this, but I actually liked the shows version of how Dany deals with the head Nobles in Mereen versus in the books... threatening to burn people with her dragons is just so much more badass than making noble children her cupbearers! Even if the cupbearers are supposed to represent that she is kindhearted and whatever.

[Lady Dyanna]

And legitimize the dim captain's daughter possible bastard as his heir?

Edited to fix an omission.

Nah. I'm still not convinced he doesn't have his "man bits." ;)

[Fat Mac]

Here's a confession: for ages I'd put Davos in my top 5 characters, but I've recently came to the realization that the reason I love his chapters so much was more because of Stannis and less about Davos. Basically, I was a Stan stan in self-denial.

I still think Davos is awesome though, but Stannis is definitely a more complex/gray character (how I like them), and has since taken up Davos' spot in my top 5.

One of us, one of us

[Lord Wraith]

Working on a theory that Lewyn Martell's paramour was actually Olenna Redwynne. Also that Marwyn the Mage is their secret bastard sent to the Citadel to hide his identity. I am still working on the full theory but this is part of the TLDR section.

Brief version L + O = M

1. LeWYN is a MARtell, hence Mar+wyn = Marwyn. Many historical Martells also have names starting with the letter M. Also Olenna’s first born son is named Mace. Also Luwin is the first Maester introduced in ASOIAF.

2. Marwyn’s two most trusted students are Leo Tyrell and a Sarella Sand daughter of Oberyn Martell. Also Pate who is likely Jaquen the faceless man. 2/3 his students are lying about their identity.

3. Lewyn is known to have a paramour but this has been kept a closely guarded secret, likely meaning someone of high birth. It isn’t common knowledge and isn’t recorded in the White Book of the Kingsguard. There is no mention of a bastard which would be an even more closely guarded secret.

4. Olenna is betrothed to Daeron Targ at 9. It is broken off when she is 18 and she doesn’t have Mace till she is 28. That is a lot of time for an affair. She claims that Luthor wasn’t unskilled in bed meaning that she might have had lovers before Luthor.

5. Marwyn bears shares several physical characteristics with Mace Tyrell, Olenna’s first born.

6. Marwyn is often associated with the letter M: Maester, Mage, Mastiff, Magic, Mirri Maz Dur etc.

7. Several associations in the novels point to him being their son (see spoilers)

8. Several hints that Marwyn is working with the Martells. Sarella, Oberyn’s time at the Citadel, and the fact that Doran doesn’t trust Maesters.

9. The Strangler poison was used by Olenna to kill Joffrey. The secrets of this poison are known to the Maesters. Marwyn would have been easily able to get the poison. Maester Cressen attempted to kill Melisandre with the same poison.

I know its tinfoil but the full version will go far more indepth, tell me what you think.

[Good Guy Garlan]

One of us, one of us

E-ro's indoctrination finally bore fruit

[LordStoneheart]

I'm done with theories.

[King of the Bastards]

The Mystery Knight is full to bursting with little mysteries and so in my last reread I couldn't help but to think that there are hints to John the Fiddler/ Daemon and Alyn Cockshaw being gay. For one there is Daemon massaging Dunks neck and his obsession of him (I know he had this dream, but still) and Cockshaws jealousy of Dunk that is just a bit too much to just be about being a Kingsguard (besides there are 7 places to fill, so actually no reason for Alyn to worry even if Dunk would become one). IMO the Fiddler has similarities to Renly, too. The way he talks to everybody with a laugh and his cordially nature.

So Daemon (I'm too lazy type everything, so just the important parts):

About going to the Wall:

- "Would that I could join you. You could show me the way." ... "I suppose not... though you might be surprised at what some man can miss."

A little later:

- "Alyn was seeking for me, and I did not care to be found. He grows tiresome when he drinks, does Alyn. I saw you slip away from that bedchamber of horrors, and slipped out after you." (the bedding of Butterwell and his bride that everyone was eager to see)

Following that:

- Dunk shrugged away the lordling's hand, which had begun to knead his shoulder.

- "I suppose that means I'll have to take the throne, then. I would much rather be teaching you to fiddle."

- "Wine makes all things possible, Ser Duncan. You'd look a god in white, I think, but if the color does not suit you, perhaps you would prefer to be a lord."

- "Now you mock me. A true knight would never mock his king." The Fiddler sounded hurt.

Before Dunk takes off:

"Where are you going, ser?"

"To my bed, to sleep. I'm drunk as a dog."

"Be my dog, ser. The night's alive with promise. We can howl together, and wake the very gods."

"What do you want of me?"

"Your sword. I would make you mine own man, and raise you high. My dreams do not lie, Ser Duncan. You will have that white cloak, and I must have that dragon's egg. I must, my dreams have made that plain. Perhaps the egg will hatch, or else-"

...

"Gormy," the Fiddler drawled. "Why, what are you doing in my bedchamber, my lord?"

"It is a roof and you have had too much wine."

...

"I had hoped to joust with good Ser Duncan here."

...

Peake to Dunk after the Fiddler took off:

"Here's my promise: three feet of cold steel through your belly if you speak a word of what just happened." (he could say that because he fears, that Daemon revealed himself as a Blackfyre, but then why would he let him live with this information. More plausible, he thinks Daemon was hitting on Dunk and doesn't want anyone to know of his king's preferences)

Well whatever, Imma just give you two quotes of when Alyn tries to kill Dunk (because I'm too lazy to search for the others):

"And never will. Daemon's mine. I will command his Kingsguard. You are not worthy of a white cloak."

And

"Aegon and Aemon. Wretched little bullies, just like you. When we were little, they took pleasure in tormenting me and Daemon both. I wept when Bittersteel carried him off to exile, and again when Lord Peake told me he was coming home. But then he saw you upon the road, and forgot that I existed."

Those are too extreme feelings to just be admiration or devotion for your King or friend. Plus being a Kingsguard means never having a wife or a family and only a man who has no interest in this would give up on that, and it would always bring hiom close to his secret love. And I don't believe that A & A were just cruel to them without a reason, maybe it's too much read in to this, but I can imagine that they picked on the two boys because they were different and maybe had a thing going on. Aaaand finally, maybe that was the reason why Bittersteel didn't back Daemon and didn't give him Blackfyre, but that's my crackpot theory.

Well, that has gotten longer than I thought :)

[Gibzit]

For my dirty confession:

I don't like any of the Starks.

It isn't that I hate them, I just don't really like any of them they are all just OK to me.

[Ruby Fforde]

Something entirely random and not something I'm terribly invested in:

For a while there was a lot of speculation about the tapestries that Littlefinger had Cersei send him from King's Landing, thoughts being that there was something important depicted within them. I was rereading this the other day -

Littlefinger's rise had been arrow-swift. Within three years of his coming to court, he was master of coin and a member of the small council, and today the crown's revenues were ten times what they had been under his beleaguered predecessor . . . though the crown's debts had grown vast as well. A master juggler was Petyr Baelish.

Oh, he was clever. He did not simply collect the gold and lock it in a treasure vault, no. He paid the king's debts in promises, and put the king's gold to work. He bought wagons, shops, ships, houses. He bought grain when it was plentiful and sold bread when it was scarce. He bought wool from the north and linen from the south and lace from Lys, stored it, moved it, dyed it, sold it. The golden dragons bred and multiplied, and Littlefinger lent them out and brought them home with hatchlings.

...and an idea occurred to me that perhaps he actually wanted to alter them somehow / add something to them that wasn't there before?

I don't know, probably not, it was just an idle musing.

[Attitude]

I never liked the bran chapters when he was traveling to 'behind' the wall, up until he arrived there. At some point I was thinking about literally skipping them. At that point I hated that it was his final chapter.

I never liked the brienne chapters.Well, they weren't my favorites really. I guess I missed a lot of references there (I've read here and there that she killed some people we've seen before.. but since their names weren't mentioned I never realised this).

I don't like Aegon. It feels way to much as a filler, just like the next one:

The Quentyn storyline felt like BS. Why was it even there?

I liked the Daenerys chapters the second most (my fav's were Jon's).

I would've loved a 'hound' POV.

I don't like UnCat.

Basicly, I would've preferred that the story started with all the POV's 'at the same time' and not just introducing them here and there. At this point, it sometimes felt like GRRM made some shit up, just to fix some mistakes he made earlier.

[Good Guy Garlan]

snip

Oh,yeah, the Fiddler totally wanted to hit that. I confess that I fucking love the Fiddler, by the way. One of the best antagonists of things ASOIAF.

Another confession: you know how people say Feast and Dance get better for them on re-reads? For me it's actually the opposite, and it spills over into chapters I used to like. For example, in my latest re-read, I hated Davos' chapters in Dance with a passion. The first couple of them I found absolutely disposable, and the bizarre decision to end his storyline halfway through the book is infuriating. Manderly lifts those chapters a bit, but he can only do so much.

[Mrs.Grumpy]

The Mystery Knight is full to bursting with little mysteries and so in my last reread I couldn't help but to think that there are hints to John the Fiddler/ Daemon and Alyn Cockshaw being gay. For one there is Daemon massaging Dunks neck and his obsession of him (I know he had this dream, but still) and Cockshaws jealousy of Dunk that is just a bit too much to just be about being a Kingsguard (besides there are 7 places to fill, so actually no reason for Alyn to worry even if Dunk would become one). IMO the Fiddler has similarities to Renly, too. The way he talks to everybody with a laugh and his cordially nature.

So Daemon (I'm too lazy type everything, so just the important parts):

About going to the Wall:

- "Would that I could join you. You could show me the way." ... "I suppose not... though you might be surprised at what some man can miss."

A little later:

- "Alyn was seeking for me, and I did not care to be found. He grows tiresome when he drinks, does Alyn. I saw you slip away from that bedchamber of horrors, and slipped out after you." (the bedding of Butterwell and his bride that everyone was eager to see)

Following that:

- Dunk shrugged away the lordling's hand, which had begun to knead his shoulder.

- "I suppose that means I'll have to take the throne, then. I would much rather be teaching you to fiddle."

- "Wine makes all things possible, Ser Duncan. You'd look a god in white, I think, but if the color does not suit you, perhaps you would prefer to be a lord."

- "Now you mock me. A true knight would never mock his king." The Fiddler sounded hurt.

Before Dunk takes off:

"Where are you going, ser?"

"To my bed, to sleep. I'm drunk as a dog."

"Be my dog, ser. The night's alive with promise. We can howl together, and wake the very gods."

"What do you want of me?"

"Your sword. I would make you mine own man, and raise you high. My dreams do not lie, Ser Duncan. You will have that white cloak, and I must have that dragon's egg. I must, my dreams have made that plain. Perhaps the egg will hatch, or else-"

...

"Gormy," the Fiddler drawled. "Why, what are you doing in my bedchamber, my lord?"

"It is a roof and you have had too much wine."

...

"I had hoped to joust with good Ser Duncan here."

...

Peake to Dunk after the Fiddler took off:

"Here's my promise: three feet of cold steel through your belly if you speak a word of what just happened." (he could say that because he fears, that Daemon revealed himself as a Blackfyre, but then why would he let him live with this information. More plausible, he thinks Daemon was hitting on Dunk and doesn't want anyone to know of his king's preferences)

Well whatever, Imma just give you two quotes of when Alyn tries to kill Dunk (because I'm too lazy to search for the others):

"And never will. Daemon's mine. I will command his Kingsguard. You are not worthy of a white cloak."

And

"Aegon and Aemon. Wretched little bullies, just like you. When we were little, they took pleasure in tormenting me and Daemon both. I wept when Bittersteel carried him off to exile, and again when Lord Peake told me he was coming home. But then he saw you upon the road, and forgot that I existed."

Those are too extreme feelings to just be admiration or devotion for your King or friend. Plus being a Kingsguard means never having a wife or a family and only a man who has no interest in this would give up on that, and it would always bring hiom close to his secret love. And I don't believe that A & A were just cruel to them without a reason, maybe it's too much read in to this, but I can imagine that they picked on the two boys because they were different and maybe had a thing going on. Aaaand finally, maybe that was the reason why Bittersteel didn't back Daemon and didn't give him Blackfyre, but that's my crackpot theory.

Well, that has gotten longer than I thought :)

It's not a crackpot. You're %100 right on this. GRRM confirmed Daemon was gay.

And he totally wanted Dunk's D.

[Dark Lord of Stygai]

I'm done with theories.

PREACH.

I actually like LSH. The fact that there is someone - or something - out there terryfying the Freys is good news. I get that she is killing some innocents and whatnot, but I can't gather the enrgy to find sympathy for the Freys.

I found some of Bran's chapter (before he met the three-eyed crow) to be boring. My eyes would glaze while reading them and I'd have to snap myself out of it and reread them to actually take in the words.

I'll admit I'm probably one of the few who don't really like Sansa all that much. The only reason I'm really interested in her at the mo' is because of her proximity to LF, and the fact that I hope she kills him. I also don't ship Sansa and Clegane AT ALL.

I want for LF to die but not before he realizes that he has been outsmarted by Sansa of all people, especially since he thinks she's a bit of an airhead. His death would be all the more sweeter for it.

[IMNHAAO]

First of all my best wishes for your health.

.........

Have some random thoughts coming into your mind while reading?

Thought of a crazy theory but you can't prove it and just want to tell everyone?

Some lines gave you a hunch that you're certain might happen but you have no evidence?

You think X is an idiot and need to tell the world?

Fear no more. We all been there. No discussions. No evidence. Just... random thoughts.

Second of all my thanks for a chance to really show how this long wait is affecting my usually moderately normal thought processes, so here they are:

In my mind Valyrians look a lot like the Others, I keep somehow finding them in my head in a very similar place, as if they are two branches of the same tree.

I cannot shake the feeling that the Children are creepy buggers and for no reason whatsoever their songs are responsible (at least in part) for the strangeness of the seasons and the conflict between fire and ice. They might represent Nature and nature is a bitch.

The pregnant woman Bran sees asking for vengeance is Ned's mother because it's the first thing I thought when I read that part.

And I have no proof or reason whatsoever why any of this would even start to make sense. :closedeyes:

[Lost Melnibonean]

I'm done with theories.

The first step is admitting that you cannot control your addiction or compulsion.

[LordStoneheart]

The first step is admitting that you cannot control your addiction or compulsion.

As good as any description, but perhaps more like food. I used to love coming here and elsewhere for juicy steak but then the only thing available was an abundance of stale McDonalds burgers.

[SouthernIslander]

It's not a crackpot. You're %100 right on this. GRRM confirmed Daemon was gay.

And he totally wanted Dunk's D.

I finished rereading TMK last week and don't remember walking away being pretty convinced that the Fiddler was gay the first time I read it, but I definitely did this time. I don't think I picked up on the Cockshaw relationship (wonder if the name was also some kind of hint) stuff until coming here.