Rhaegar's Plan B

[caravaggio]

Rhaegar strikes me as a smart, though obsessed, guy. We know he was at least in part worried he might not make it back from the Trident.

 

If R+L=J, then obviously Rhaegar's first plan was to raise Jon as his son, etc. However, he must have planned for the contingency that he might die and Robert might succeed in his rebellion.

 

If so, what might he have instructed the KG and Lyanna to do?

 

I don't think he would have told them to immediately try to put Jon (or Aegon) into power. He would know that if he fell, that could be a big danger to their lives at the time. Would he have had a plan to hide Jon?

 

My personal suspicion is that Ashara was part of this backup plan and that her pregnancy was a cover in case Jon had to be hidden, but I'd like to hear other ideas.

 

 

(Since everyone poo-pooed my own idea on this, I just wanted to see what other people's ideas were)

[purple-eyes]

 

We know he was at least in part worried he might not make it back from the Trident.

 

 

Did he? he seems quite confident that he will win and come back, based on his last words with Jiame. It is indeed somehow reasonable because he is a good warrior and his army is larger than Robert's.

 

About his back-up plan, I think this is what Rhaegar thought:

 

Rhaegar: (after Elia give birth to Aegon) I need the third head immediately for the greater good of this continent, I do not have time to do it in other more secret or diplomatic way, so I need to run off with that girl and make sure she gets pregnant and give birth. Then I will come back to KL and fix the possible problems. I know there will be some problems (like her fiancee or brother), but nothing will be too big. 

 

Then he heard about the war, but he waited for a few months to make sure Lyanna is indeed pregnant (you know, first three months thing). 

Then he went to the war. He told KG to guard Lyanna. He thought he will win and then he will go back to pick up Lyanna and their new baby. 

He was so sure about the victory that he did not even bother to send his own children to DS (they can keep Elia only as the hostage which is already enough).Even before the Trident, he thought he will win so he told Jiame he will come back and do something to depose his father (maybe make Lyanna a queen or something like that too).

 

But unfortunately he underestimated Robert and his warhammer.

 

That is why KG stayed there for a very long time. Because Rhaegar did not have a back-up plan. He just said he will be back after a while and ask KG and Lyanna wait for him. Otherwise they probably already transported Lyanna to somewhere else a couple of months before the birth (just like Rhaegar's mother)

 

Rhaegar is smart but he is also arrogant and proud. He did not think he will lose. 

[The Mountain That Flies]

Did he? he seems quite confident that he will win and come back, based on his last words with Jiame. It is indeed somehow reasonable because he is a good warrior and his army is larger than Robert's.

Yeah, Rhaegar seemed pretty certain he was coming back. I doubt he really had a plan B, if he was the kind of guy to think in terms of contingencies he wouldn't have just run off with Lyanna without telling anyone in either family.

[purple-eyes]

Yeah, Rhaegar seemed pretty certain he was coming back. I doubt he really had a plan B, if he was the kind of guy to think in terms of contingencies he wouldn't have just run off with Lyanna without telling anyone in either family.

 

Exactly. Of course he knew there will be some issue with Lyanna's family and Robert, but he thought nothing will be a big deal. 

So he does not have a plan, he just want to make sure there will be a baby firstly and then he will think about how to deal with the problems. 

He probably thinks it will be easier to fix the problems after he and Lyanna gets a new born baby. Then other people will have to accept the reality. Then he can just do something to compensate Stark and Robert. 

[GtrGbln]

 

Rhaegar strikes me as a smart

 

Okay I gotta stop you right there. Starting a civil war because you left your wife for a teenage girl is not smart. Sitting out half the war you started, a war where the fate of your entire dynasty is at stake is not smart. Standing toe to toe with Robert Baratheon in his prime is not smart. 

 

So enough about how freakin' smart Rhaegar was already.

[Liz Stark-Targaryen]

1. This thread is doomed to end badly. I suspect all R+L=J threads outside the pinned one (where the regulars don't condone nonsense) will be a mess until new canon is released, and even that might not do the trick.

 

2. We don't even know Rhaegar's Plan A yet. Readers think we've uncovered every possibility, but we might not have.

[purple-eyes]

1. This thread is doomed to end badly. I suspect all R+L=J threads outside the pinned one (where the regulars don't condone nonsense) will be a mess until new canon is released, and even that might not do the trick.

 

2. We don't even know Rhaegar's Plan A yet. Readers think we've uncovered every possibility, but we might not have.

 

Rhaegar's plan A is to have a new child (third dragon head) with the woman he loves at any cost. isn't it?

I thought at least this is clear. 

[Liz Stark-Targaryen]

 

Rhaegar's plan A is to have a new child (third dragon head) with the woman he loves at any cost. isn't it?

I thought at least this is clear. 

 

 

I don't think it is. I think GRRM's holding a few cards close to his chest.

[purple-eyes]

 

 

I don't think it is. I think GRRM's holding a few cards close to his chest.

He may hold a few cards about some minor things such as: why Rhaegar ran away to TOJ in Dorne? how Ned knew they were there? How was Arthur dayne killed by Ned and Reed? What happened with Ashara? etc. 

But one thing for sure is Rhaegar indeed loves Lyanna. And another thing for sure is that he wanted to have a child with her (no matter for what reason, love or prophecy). 

I feel like there is no any doubt that R+L=J at this moment either. 

[GtrGbln]

 

Rhaegar's plan A is to have a new child (third dragon head) with the woman he loves at any cost. isn't it?

I thought at least this is clear. 

 

Yeah thats speculation. So don't take it for granted it would be "clear" to everyone.

[GtrGbln]

But one thing for sure is Rhaegar indeed loves Lyanna. And another thing for sure is that he wanted to have a child with her (no matter for what reason, love or prophecy). 

 

That is not for sure that is a fan theory. 

 

Lots of people who frequent this site need to learn to tell the difference.

[purple-eyes]

 

Yeah thats speculation. So don't take it for granted it would be "clear" to everyone.

 

Right, it is not published like this. But it looks so solid and firm, and I can not even argue with that (although I do wish it is not true) ........

[Dorian Martell]

He had no plan B. He most likely didn't think his dad would do what he did, the way he did. He seemed more concerned with prophecy than governance. He probably figured that with him, 4 of the king's guard and a larger army than the rebels he would be victorious  

[purple-eyes]

 

That is not for sure that is a fan theory. 

 

Lots of people who frequent this site need to learn to tell the difference.

 

yeah, I do understand it has not been published in canon. So there is a theoretical possibility that it can be wrong. 

But this is something like "1+1=2, 2+1=3, 3+1=4, then 4+1=?"

Nobody wrote a 5 there, but we all know it will be a 5 there. 

[purple-eyes]

He had no plan B. He most likely didn't think his dad would do what he did, the way he did. He seemed more concerned with prophecy than governance. He probably figured that with him, 4 of the king's guard and a larger army than the rebels he would be victorious  

 

you are right. I totally agree with you.

But I remembered there was 3 KG with him. The other 3 are in TOJ.

[GtrGbln]

But it looks so solid and firm, and I can not even argue with that (although I do wish it is not true) ........

 

First of all I don't know were you're a but in the U.S. you can argue with anything you like with anybody so as far I'm concerned go to town. 

 

Secondly, its only that solid to those who believe it. I have personally neither read nor seen anything that leads me to believe what we're told in the book should be doubted. The clues point to R&L being Jon's parents but thats it. This whole they were in love or married idea is not supported in the text. I'm not necessarily disagreeing but its pure fan speculation whether it turns out to be right or wrong in the end. Maybe they were maybe not either way the books haven't given us any info that supports that. You don't have to be in love to make babby.

 

P.S. sorry for the snappishness earlier.

[Dorian Martell]

 

you are right. I totally agree with you.

But I remembered there was 3 KG with him. The other 3 are in TOJ.

Oops, typo 

[purple-eyes]

 

First of all I don't know were you're a but in the U.S. you can argue with anything you like with anybody so as far I'm concerned go to town. 

 

Secondly, its only that solid to those who believe it. I have personally neither read nor seen anything that leads me to believe what we're told in the book should be doubted. The clues point to R&L being Jon's parents but thats it. This whole they were in love or married idea is not supported in the text. I'm not necessarily disagreeing but its pure fan speculation whether it turns out to be right or wrong in the end. Maybe they were maybe not either way the books haven't given us any info that supports that. You don't have to be in love to make babby.

 

P.S. sorry for the snappishness earlier.

 

But Rhaegar died with Lyanna's name on his lips! Not his wife, not his mother, not his daughter, not even his possible future daughter!

I can not figure out another explanation if this did not indicate his love........

This one is a very firm proof. 

[GtrGbln]

 

yeah, I do understand it has not been published in canon. So there is a theoretical possibility that it can be wrong. 

But this is something like "1+1=2, 2+1=3, 3+1=4, then 4+1=?"

Nobody wrote a 5 there, but we all know it will be a 5 there. 

 

Wow I guess this why they say never apologize on the internet. Yeah not the same thing not even close. 

 

A better analogy would be looking at x+y=5 and declaring y must be three because despite there being other possible solutions you knew it was 3 before you even looked at the problem. Hymn and haw all you like but you have no textual evidence to support your idea. 

[GtrGbln]

But Rhaegar died with Lyanna's name on his lips! 

 

What is that even supposed to prove? Just because his last thought was of her doesn't mean he didn't kidnap and force himself on her repeatedly. In fact him being obsessed enough with her to kidnap her in the first could explain that just as neatly.