Why can't a weirwood heart tree take root in the Eyrie?

[moonshield]

Hello!

I am currently doing my first re-read and also have been following this board for some months now. So, with all the hidden meaning and foreshadowing throughout the books I was wondering, if anyone has an idea if theres a deeper meaning in the fact that Eyrie's Gardeners fail at planting a heart tree in the Eyrie?

The wiki quote:

The Eyrie in the Vale of Arryn contains a godswood but no heart tree^. It is more garden than godswood, as the ground is too thin and stony for a weirwood to grow. Instead, there is a statue of a weeping woman at its center.

 In the book it says they brought soil to the Eyrie for it to take root, without avail. So, the ground is too thin and stony, yet, if they brought up soil, why not just bring more soil. This could of course just be a random occurrence. But I've read to much in the last few month to think that ;o

For example what I am curious about is, if BR knows of anything about what going on the Eyrie? I dont remember Sansa, Cait or Tyrion mentioning any ravens up there as well. So maybe the Eyrie is somewhat of a blindspot for BR? I might be wrong, it might not mean anything at all, for all I know it might just be too cold there. But maybe someone has a great idea for about what it could mean

 

 

[Durran Durrandon]

The symbolism doesn't bode well for a Sansa, but of course she has already left the Eyrie. For the reason you mentioned I think it must be a blind spot fur BR and the OG in general. That's why I don't think the Ghost of HH's vision of Sansa slaying a giant in a caste made of snow could be referencing her ripping Robyn's doll's head off, though that must certainly foreshadow the real meaning.

[Lord Ravenstark]

Symbolism? Northerners are not supposed to go South. Physically? Weirwood requires a deep soil, really deep.

[purple-eyes]

 i think this is just a way to show us how tall the location is. 

Rememner heart tree is a deciduous tree? 

It is not very realistic that this tree will grow on a super high mountain peak. (Six thousands feet high?) it is not just about the soil, also the climate. 

Grrm wrote many magics, but for plants, he seemed to try to be more real. 

 

 

Hello!

I am currently doing my first re-read and also have been following this board for some months now. So, with all the hidden meaning and foreshadowing throughout the books I was wondering, if anyone has an idea if theres a deeper meaning in the fact that Eyrie's Gardeners fail at planting a heart tree in the Eyrie?

The wiki quote:

 In the book it says they brought soil to the Eyrie for it to take root, without avail. So, the ground is too thin and stony, yet, if they brought up soil, why not just bring more soil. This could of course just be a random occurrence. But I've read to much in the last few month to think that ;o

For example what I am curious about is, if BR knows of anything about what going on the Eyrie? I dont remember Sansa, Cait or Tyrion mentioning any ravens up there as well. So maybe the Eyrie is somewhat of a blindspot for BR? I might be wrong, it might not mean anything at all, for all I know it might just be too cold there. But maybe someone has a great idea for about what it could mean

 

 

I think this is just a way to describe how high the location is. 

It will be unrealistic that a heart tree will grow 

[Lord Ravenstark]

 i think this is just a way to show us how tall the location is. 

Rememner heart tree is a deciduous tree? 

It is not very realistic that this tree will grow on a super high mountain peak. (Six thousands feet high?) it is not just about the soil, also the climate. 

Grrm wrote many magics, but for plants, he seemed to try to be more real. 

 

 

I think this is just a way to describe how high the location is. 

It will be unrealistic that a heart tree will grow 

Well, they grow on tundra. And work as access terminal to the whole world information.

[Ygrain]

I don't think it's just matter of depth - what if all weirwoods are interconnected underground? The problem then would be the mass of rock on which Eyrie is built. 

[VenezuelanLord]

the thing about the weordwoods is that they have deep roots, stupidly deep, so in a mountain said roots couldn't. Possibly grow, at least not at the top, but there's. Possibly other godswood in the vale, there's more vale than just the eerye

[Municipal Engines]

Besides, the Eyrie was built by very Faith of the Seven Arryns. Why would they want to plant a weirwood tree? Could they even? I imagine it involves a little something extra to get those magic trees to grow.

[moonshield]

 

It is not very realistic that this tree will grow on a super high mountain peak. (Six thousands feet high?) it is not just about the soil, also the climate. 

Grrm wrote many magics, but for plants, he seemed to try to be more real. 

I thought about that as well, but then again, there are heart trees north of the wall, and I guess there it's about as cold or even colder than on top of the mountain, although that's of course not the only factor when you want to grow a tree . Additionally, in my understanding there IS a godswood in the Eyrie, which (arguably) means that trees can grow there.

Anyway, thanks for your ideas and interpretations, it was just something that caught my attention.

[purple-eyes]

I thought about that as well, but then again, there are heart trees north of the wall, and I guess there it's about as cold or even colder than on top of the mountain, although that's of course not the only factor when you want to grow a tree . Additionally, in my understanding there IS a godswood in the Eyrie, which (arguably) means that trees can grow there.

Anyway, thanks for your ideas and interpretations, it was just something that caught my attention.

the high mountain climate is not just coldness. 

It is also short of oxygen. 

People can live mostly well in coldness, but we have many people who would get big trouble in high mountain area. 

And yes, some trees and flowers, but those which are good for that environment. 

Even on the snowy peak there can be some plants, but not a tall deciduous tree with a lot of leaves. 

 

[Durran Durrandon]

the high mountain climate is not just coldness. 

It is also short of oxygen. 

People can live mostly well in coldness, but we have many people who would get big trouble in high mountain area. 

And yes, some trees and flowers, but those which are good for that environment. 

Even on the snowy peak there can be some plants, but not a tall deciduous tree with a lot of leaves. 

 

Well, I imagine the problem of thin air would be the same, but CO2 would be the factor. Sorry for being pedantic .

[Universal Sword Donor]

I thought about that as well, but then again, there are heart trees north of the wall, and I guess there it's about as cold or even colder than on top of the mountain, although that's of course not the only factor when you want to grow a tree . Additionally, in my understanding there IS a godswood in the Eyrie, which (arguably) means that trees can grow there.

Anyway, thanks for your ideas and interpretations, it was just something that caught my attention.

When Sansa describes the gardens, she doesn't mention any trees. IIRC there were statues and bushes with some flowers and that was it.

[Taenqyrhae]

It's because of altitude.  It's why the old pre-pact kings of the First Men would entomb their kings above the tree line, so the Children would not be able to steal their spirits through the weirwood trees.  The First Men used to be able to talk with the bones of their dead, and I think the Dustins still can, but most have lost that art once their started joining the Old Gods in the weirwood network.

This has some interesting implications - are there any tombs in the Eyrie where there might be spirits that Bloodraven has no access to?  Or any bones in the sky cells from prisoners who died but didn't fall out?  I don't know how to get any descendants of the First Kings to the Eyrie to access them, though who's to know where Barbrey Dustin ends up over the next couple of books.

[Beorn Snow]

When Bran sees the life of a weirwood-tree he sees a bloodsacrifice at the beginning. 
In AFFC Brienne notices weirwood saplings growing in the riverlands ... but should we be surprised after all the amount of blood spilled?
Maybe, just like the dragon-hatching, by the time the Arryns wanted to get a Godswood people had forgotten how to make them grow?

I know it´s a crackpot. But it fits on my head.

[Durran Durrandon]

It's because of altitude.  It's why the old pre-pact kings of the First Men would entomb their kings above the tree line, so the Children would not be able to steal their spirits through the weirwood trees.  The First Men used to be able to talk with the bones of their dead, and I think the Dustins still can, but most have lost that art once their started joining the Old Gods in the weirwood network.

This has some interesting implications - are there any tombs in the Eyrie where there might be spirits that Bloodraven has no access to?  Or any bones in the sky cells from prisoners who died but didn't fall out?  I don't know how to get any descendants of the First Kings to the Eyrie to access them, though who's to know where Barbrey Dustin ends up over the next couple of books.

Can you source any of that for us? I am very interested. I feel like I missed this whole talking to bones thing.

[Durran Durrandon]

When Bran sees the life of a weirwood-tree he sees a bloodsacrifice at the beginning. 
In AFFC Brienne notices weirwood saplings growing in the riverlands ... but should we be surprised after all the amount of blood spilled?
Maybe, just like the dragon-hatching, by the time the Arryns wanted to get a Godswood people had forgotten how to make them grow?

I know it´s a crackpot. But it fits on my head.

Very cool, I missed that.

[Light a wight tonight]

A lot of good points. Why would the Arryns haul soil up to the Eyrie for the purpose of growing wierwoods that they don't care about? And even so, wierwoods seem to be a sort of community that's somehow connected through their roots, which couldn't penetrate all that rock. Any wierwoods growing at the Eyrie would be stunted parodies of the real thing.

[Balerion's Whiskers]

Bloodraven doesn't need weirwoods to see. He told Bran that he too, would learn to see beyond the trees, so he isn't blind in the Eyrie.

"A weirwood will live forever if left undisturbed. To them seasons pass in the flutter of a moth's wing, and past, present, and future are one. Nor will your sight be limited to your godswood. The singers carved eyes into their heart trees to awaken them, and those are the first eyes a new greenseer learns to use … but in time you will see well beyond the trees themselves."

[TheSovereignGrave]

A lot of good points. Why would the Arryns haul soil up to the Eyrie for the purpose of growing wierwoods that they don't care about? And even so, wierwoods seem to be a sort of community that's somehow connected through their roots, which couldn't penetrate all that rock. Any wierwoods growing at the Eyrie would be stunted parodies of the real thing.

The same reason that Harrenhal and the Red Keep have Godswoods. It probably became more of a cultural thing over time; the castles of the nobility were expected to have a godswoods because tradition. Even if some of those "godswoods" are just gardens with a fancy name and no weirwood tree.

I don't think it's solely the rock though; the altitude likely has something to with it was well. After all, even Casterly Rock has a weirdwood; it's just a twisted, runty thing.

[Farstrider]

Symbolism? Northerners are not supposed to go South. Physically? Weirwood requires a deep soil, really deep.

Yes, very deep.  In some ways, they are all connected, perhaps through an underground river that functions as the backbone of the network, with each tree a node in that network.  Alright, enough geeking out here, but you get the idea.