Marcelo Rebelo Firqoralas Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 I gave up on Pratchett around Carpe Jugulum and The Fifth Elephant. Somewhere around there, he forgot how to be funny and started to use the series to peddle his own, unimaginative, political opinions. I liked the earlier books though, and my favourite is probably Only You Can Save Mankind, a must-read for anyone who spent e good part of their childhood trading pirated computer games with their friends. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quoth Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 Really enjoy Pratchett (Well, duh... See screen name and av...) Luv the Watch, DEATH, the Wizards (esp. the Chancellor, Ponder, and the Librarian) and the Patrician. Used to luv Rincewind but starting to tire of the "ultimate coward" thing. Took me a while to warm up to the witches. The man certainly can turn a wickedly humorous phrase. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted December 31, 2005 Share Posted December 31, 2005 I gave up on Pratchett around Carpe Jugulum and The Fifth Elephant. Somewhere around there, he forgot how to be funny and started to use the series to peddle his own, unimaginative, political opinions. God, the anti-comedic trilogy of Carpe Jugulum, The Fifth Elephant and The Last Continent is the absolute nadir of the series. Aside from these three the only recent book to have been really bad IMO is Thief of Time. I'd seriously recommend The Truth, though, as it feels like a throwback to the good old days, largely new characters interacting with a few favourites in a self-contained storyline. It's reminiscent of Moving Pictures, slightly oddly. Night Watch is good but suffers from Vimes-overload. Monstrous Regiment and Going Postal are really good as well. So I'd say Pratchett does recover some of his old form in the recent books. Don't write him off just yet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plessiez Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 God, the anti-comedic trilogy of Carpe Jugulum, The Fifth Elephant and The Last Continent is the absolute nadir of the series .... Night Watch is good but suffers from Vimes-overload. Monstrous Regiment and Going Postal are really good as well. Interesting. While Carpe Jugulm and The Last Continent were fairly poor, I thought The Fifth Element wasn't too bad ... and that Monstrous Regiment was quite awful. I'd also agree that The Truth, Going Postal and Night Watch are some of the better recent books in the series. However, looking back I don't think the series really hit its stride until Reaper Man at the earliest. The first two Rincewind books aren't much more than over-the-top sword and sorcery parodies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Naah. The series kicks into gear a bit earlier with Guards! Guards! (and I'm not a big fan of Mort, allegedly the most popular book in the series). Although I also think Small Gods, arguably the most serious of the Discworld books, is also the best. I often ponder why Pratchett has refused to write a serious novel given that this book indicates he'd be quite good at it. Although the method of despatching the main villain in Small Gods must rank as the funniest death sequence ever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
werewolfv2 Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 Thud! has been getting damn good reviews and Im about to order my copy. It also was in the top ten sellers at www.clarkesworldbooks.com 1 - Night of Knives by Ian Cameron Esslemont (Signed Limited Edition Hardcover) 2 - Anansi Boys by Neil Gaiman (Signed Hardcover) 3 - Thud! by Terry Pratchett (Signed Hardcover) 4 - The Devil Delivered by Steven Erikson (Signed Limited Edition Paperback) 5 - Blood Follows by Steven Erikson (Paperback) 6 - The Healthy Dead by Steven Erikson (Signed Limited Edition Paperback) 7 - Earthworm Gods by Brian Keene (Signed Limited Edition Hardcover) 8 - Dreams Made Flesh by Anne Bishop (Signed Trade Paperback) 9 - Terminal by Brian Keene (Signed Limited Edition Hardcover) 10 - Shadow Twin by George R. R. Martin, Gardner Dozois and Daniel Abraham (Signed Paperback) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galactus Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 I actually *liked* Carpe Jugullum. Mostly because I recognized most of the vampire references and laughed at them. "I do not drink.... Brandy." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baeraad Posted January 1, 2006 Share Posted January 1, 2006 I consider everything between (but not including) Hogfather and Night Watch to constitute a serious slump in Pratchett's writing. After that, I'd say he's recovered completely, even if his new books are not of the same type as his old ones. I guess he had said everything he could say with his old style, and it took him a while to find his new style. I did like, uh, about half of Carpe Jugulum, though. After that scene where the villagers turned on them, the tension kind of broke - after that, I just couldn't see any way that the vampires could not lose. And even before that, I felt Pratchett succeeded a bit too well in making the vampires argue their own righteousness. They almost managed to convince me that they were harmless. So for the second half of the book, I was reading with the impression that a) there was no way for the vampires to win, and it wouldn't be that much of a disaster if they somehow managed to do so. Not really a good recipe for making me concerned for the outcome... But again, the first half was kind of brilliant. I love vampires who can think. (edited because I was browsing the thread and realised I'd made some very stupid typos. D'oh) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tyrmatfrage Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 I don't get the Carpe Jugulum hate, actually. It's up there as one of my top favourite Discworld books. Terry Pratchett took the ages-old vampire cliche and gave it his own unique spin and it was fantastic, much like he did with elves in Lords and Ladies (I will *never* think of elves in the same way...) I thought that Small Gods, Hogfather and Men at Arms were the darkest books in the series, and they're Pratchett at his best, IMHO. Maybe it's the villains: Vorbis and Teatime will always be the coolest Disc villains ever (also the Auditors always give me chills for some reason, though the Auditors are kind of "broken" as effective villains after Thief of Time) I'm getting tired of Vimes, though. I love the character, but it's stretching my suspension of disbelief a little - he's, what, pushing fifty and he's a one-man army? He needs to be retired. I like how he was treated in Monstrous Regiment: he was there, but he was in the background, it was more about Polly and the rest of the gang. After The Truth I was kind of hoping William would be taking over as main character in Ankh Morpork. I just think Pratchett's running out of fresh ground with the Watch, and needs to put his attentions elsewhere. Going Postal was FANTASTIC, btw, for that very reason. The recent YA books (which, for a while, were BETTER than the main books) make me believe that Granny will be retiring and that Tiffany Aching will take over as the numero eno witch. I really hope Pratchett is heading in this direction. I love Granny, but like Vimes, I don't think there's anything "new" Pratchett can do with her character. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plessiez Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 I don't get the Carpe Jugulum hate, actually. ... Terry Pratchett took the ages-old vampire cliche and gave it his own unique spin and it was fantastic, much like he did with elves in Lords and Ladies Well, that's it, really. The basic plot of CJ is in many ways identical to that of LL. Plus, it continued Granny Weatherwax's rise from random witch (in Equal Rites) to near-unstoppable super witch. She's essentially become so over-powered that nothing really threatens her, and so no plot involving her can be all that interesting. The fact that Pratchett himself seems to recognise this (and even remark upon it in the books themselves) doesn't really fix the problem, though it does perhaps explain why it's been so long since she has had a starring role in the series. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 It is interesting how characters like Rincewind, Death, Ridcully and the UU crowd and Granny Weatherwax, once the reliable 'regular' stars of the series, seem to have faded away slightly. Only Vimes is really still making regular appearances in a starring role in the books. Even among the Watch Carrot seems to have faded out of view somewhat (maybe because he's so on the ball and such a noble character that it's actually difficult finding him something to do?) As this seems to have taken place alongside the rise in quality of the more recent novels, this is something I'm not going to complain about too much though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellegrina Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 I just think Rincewind is one of the great characters in fantasy, and I have no problem putting him with characters like Moorock's Cornelius, Zelazny's Corwin, Martin's Tyrion, Mieville's Weaver, Gaiman's Morpheus, Bakker's Kelhuss, etc. Everyone says this, and I just can't read those books because the name Rincewind makes me feel faintly ill, as if I were downwind of Foul Ol' Ron wielding several rancid dishcloshes and digesting a heavy meal of baked beans and sauerkraut! Susan Death is, with the exception of Hogfather, my least favorite main character, . She's so boarding school/Oxbridge/Civil Service fast track. Probably the nicest person you could meet, but so stiff-upper-lip and controlled that lesser mortals such as myself can't help feeling grubby and incompetent in her presence. My favourites are Vimes (though the happy families stuff is a bit - I selfishly preferred the old cynical Vimes to the middle-aged establishment figure, even if it's nice that he gets some domestic happiness. I gave up on Pratchett around Carpe Jugulum and The Fifth Elephant. Somewhere around there, he forgot how to be funny and started to use the series to peddle his own, unimaginative, political opinions. Some of that isn't so bad; it's a valid commentary on how things are and he's entitled to his political opinions. What tired me was the series of "mobile phones in Discworld", "Internet in Discworld", etc. tipping the balance too much towards the Discworld take on contemporary life, at the expense of reflections on more universal issues (think of Feet of Clay). It began to feel like he was running out of ideas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Galactus Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 She's so boarding school/Oxbridge/Civil Service fast track. Probably the nicest person you could meet, but so stiff-upper-lip and controlled that lesser mortals such as myself can't help feeling grubby and incompetent in her presence. To be fair, I think that is *exactly* the reaction he's looking for. That, and poke fun at Mary Poppins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pellegrina Posted January 2, 2006 Share Posted January 2, 2006 To be fair, I think that is *exactly* the reaction he's looking for. That, and poke fun at Mary Poppins. I'm sure you're right - it's just she's so very realistic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glorfindel Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 i've only read feet of clay. after getting into it i quite enjoyed, but would it be considered one of the better in the series, or one of the lesser books? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 Feet of Clay I'd put in the upper half of the series. A good, solid, enjoyable book. If you really liked it I'd recommend tracking down the first two City Watch books: Guards! Guards! and Men at Arms. Jingo, The Fifth Elephant, Night Watch and Thud! carry on the story of the Watch but I didn't think much of The Fifth Elephant (the City Watch, er, outside the city). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sheepslayer Posted January 22, 2006 Share Posted January 22, 2006 I think to remember that I found "The truth" quite boring, but that "Thief of time" is one of my all-time favorites. ...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkmoon Soleyfir Posted January 22, 2006 Share Posted January 22, 2006 I really like Pratchett but I didn't enjoy The last continent. As someone said above, Carpe Jugulum begins to be good only after reading one half of the book. The last 4 I don't know them yet, waiting for them to be translated. The french translation of Terry Pratchett is excellent and I don't feel the need to purchase them in english.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baeraad Posted January 22, 2006 Share Posted January 22, 2006 As someone said above, Carpe Jugulum begins to be good only after reading one half of the book. Uhm... I can't find anyone who said anything of the sort other than me, and what I said was that Carpe Jugulum is only good until you've read one half of the book, actually... Tastes differ, I guess... but I'd still be interested to hear why you felt the exact opposite way from me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Qwerty Posted March 12, 2006 Share Posted March 12, 2006 I think it's great that Pratchett can write books that are so diverse yet enthralling. Just look at us argue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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