Group Read-a-thon-along: The Worm Ouroboros

[Zap Rowsdower]

[quote]Voting is Over! The book chosen is "The Worm Ouroboros."

The Worm Ouroboros, according to Amazon.com runs at around 445 pages. It can be found [url="http://www.sacred-texts.com/ring/two/index.htm"]here[/url] and also [url="http://manybooks.net/titles/eddisoneother060602051.html"]here [/url]in a multitude of different formats. There is also a free audiobook version [url="http://www.archive.org/details/WormOuroboros"]here[/url] for people with fast internet connections.

From Friday, March 27th to Friday April 3rd we will be reading the chapters:

V. King Gorice's Sending
VI. The Claws of Witchland
VII. Guests of the King in Carce[/quote]

Many months ago, within the Goodkind threads, a group of boarders commenced reading one of the Yeard's cinder block sized novels. As they progressed through the text, they would post periodic reports detailing their thoughts on the characters, plot, and the writing style of the author. I took part in this activity and I was surprised to find that it made reading Goodkind an atypically enjoyable experience.

I propose another such group reading activity. Think of it as an online book discussion club. I wish to gather three, four, or more boarders and commence reading a specific book. Once a week, after reading an agreed upon number of chapters, the boarders will forgather in this thread and post their opinions on the material. Anything and everything, as long as it is connected to the agreed upon book, is fair game for discussion.

This is all for fun. I'm sure that, you, like me, don't want to spend any money on this which is why I propose that the book we choose will be in the public domain and available for free on the internet.

I understand that many of you people are quite busy. I am in a similar situation. That is why I would want to pick a book and a reading schedule that would require a very minimal investment of time. In other words, even the copyright on [i]War and Peace[/i] has long since expired, I really don't have the inclination to its thousand plus pages off of my computer screen. Any book longer than 500 pages if off the table, unless someone can come up with an uber good reason. Something in the 200 to 300 page range would be ideal. I want something where we can each spend a couple of hours a week reading and hopefully finish off in a month or two. 400 pages, is again pushing it but I might consider it if someone can articulate an argument in its favor.

The book should be available in English, since that is the language most of the boarders are able to use, even if it isn't their first language.

When you recommend a book, I would like (but I won't demand), you choose something strange, fantastic- something, in other words, that is off the literary beaten path. Think of this as hunt fore a rare and elusive species of bird! I don't want to go on safari in order to spot pigeons! I want that has a low likelihood of being read by those who participate. I want us all to experience thrills, chills, and surprises! This is a time to broaden your literary horizons.

Having dispensed with the preliminaries I request that if you are interested in participating, you post on this thread. Include in your post:

A. A simple affirmative stating that you want to take part.
B. A book or a list of books that you think meet the criteria I posted above. Please post a little info about the book(s) or the author in order to help the rest of us decide if this is something we want to read.

I want to get at least 3 other people, besides myself, to participate. This is to ensure that our weekly discussions will be productive and informative and it isn't just an echo chamber of 2 people.

If I can get enough people willing to participate, I will post a Master List containing the books you have recommended. Once we have the list, we will vote on a book, and, since this is a democracy, whichever book gets the most votes wins (though if we have a long list of books, we might have to have a runoff election).

Once we pick the book then we can agree upon how many pages/chapters we want to read each week.

Once that is accomplished, we can commence reading!


Since these boards are pretty dead on the weekends, you have until [b]Wednesday March 18th to join, and to post a list of books. [/b]

[Zap Rowsdower]

[b]This Post is Reserved for the Participant List and the Master Book List[/b].

Participants:

Bellis
Blue Roses
Maia
MinDonner
Shield
The Pita Enigma
Wildfire
Vrana
Yerman
Zap Rowsdower

Muttering Bill (provided he can find a hard copy of the chosen book)
Trisekle(will participate as school work allows)
wolverine (will participate depending on which book is chosen)

[b]Master List Final Version[/b]

Atlantis: The Antediluvian World by Ignatius L. Donnelly

Case of the 16 Beans, The, by Harry Keeler

Castle of Otranto, The, by Horace Walpole

Don Rodriguez: Chronicles of Shadow Valley by Lord Dunsany

House of the Vampire, The, by George Sylvester Viereck

Insidious Dr. Fu Manchu, The, by Sax Rohmer

Kwaidan: Stories and Studies of Strange Things by Lafcadio Hearn

Humbugs of the World: An Account of Humbugs, Delusions, Impositions, Quackeries, Deceits and Deceivers Generally, in All Ages, The, by P.T. Barnum.

Malleus Maleficarum by Heinrich Kramer and Jacob Sprenger

Monk, The, by Mathew Gregory Lewis

Moon Pool, The, by Abraham Merritt

Newton's Sleep by Daniel O'Mahony

Plotting in Pirate Seas by Francis Rolt-Wheeler

Riddle of the Sands, The, by Erskine Childers

Vathek by William Thomas Beckford

Worm Ouroboros, The, by Eric Rücker Eddison

[Zap Rowsdower]

[quote name='Triskele' post='1718140' date='Mar 13 2009, 00.25']I'm certainly not against this...though Zap, I'm still trying to figure out your methods...[/quote]

I have only madness and no methods.

If you or anyone else have any recommendations on how I can better organize this thing then I would be happy to hear you out. :cheers:

[Zap Rowsdower]

A. Since I posted the original topic, I think it can be taken for granted that I will participate, assuming enough people show interest.

B. OK, here are some books that I think might make be interesting reads:

1. [i]Malleus Maleficarum[/i] by Heinrich Kramer and Jacob Sprenger. According to wiki the '...title is Latin for "The Hammer Against Witches." [The Malleus Maleficarum]is a famous treatise on witches, written in 1486 by Heinrich Kramer and Jacob Sprenger, two Inquisitors of the Catholic Church, and was first published in Germany in 1487. The main purpose of the Malleus was systematically to refute arguments claiming that witchcraft does not exist, refute those who expressed skepticism about its reality, to prove that witches were more often women than men, and to educate magistrates on the procedures that could find them out and convict them.'

I've always been interested in reading this book. My desire to read it was probably kindled after hearing it referenced in a multitude of B-Movies where the main antagonist was a witch or warlock. I've actually tried to sit down and read the blasted thing only to be defeated by utter boredom. Like me, you might first think that a book instructing you how best to battle the forces of darkness would be awesome, and like me, you would be wrong. Sample the prose in this passage:

[quote]At first it may truly seem that it is not in accordance with the Catholic Faith to maintain that children can be begotten by devils, that is to say, by Incubi and Succubi: for God Himself, before sin came into the world, instituted human procreation, since He created woman from the rib of man to be a helpmeet unto man: And to them He said: Increase, and multiply, Genesis ii, 24. Likewise after sin had come into the world, it was said to Noe: Increase, and multiply, Genesis ix, 1. In the time of the new law also, Christ confirmed this union: Have ye not read, that he who made man from the beginning, Made them male and female? S. Matthew xix, 4. Therefore, men cannot be begotten in any other way than this.

But it may be argued that devils take their part in this generation not as the essential cause, but as a secondary and artificial cause, since they busy themselves by interfering with the process of normal copulation and conception, by obtaining human semen, and themselves transferring it.

Objection. The devil can perform this act in every state of life, that is to say, in the matrimonial state, or not in the matrimonial state. Now he cannot perform it in the first state, because then the act of the devil would be more powerful than the act of God, Who instituted and confirmed this holy estate, since it is a state of continence and wedlock. Nor can he effect this in any other estate: since we never read in Scripture that children can be begotten in one state and not in another.

Moreover, to beget a child is the act of a living body, but devils cannot bestow life upon the bodies which they assume; because life formally only proceeds from the soul, and the act of generation is the act of the physical organs which have bodily life. Therefore bodies which are assumed in this way cannot either beget or bear.

Yet it may be said that these devils assume a body not in order that they may bestow life upon it, but that they may by the means of this body preserve human semen, and pass the semen on to another body.[/quote]

In case you couldn't tell, or maybe fell asleep halfway through that passage, they're talking about [b]DEMON SEX!!!![/b] How can you make [b]DEMON SEX!!!![/b] boring? I don't know, but the morons who wrote this book certainly found a way.

And in addition to being boring, this book is also very long- it is available free online, of course, but according to amazon.com a paperback copy of this book is 456 pages.

PROS: Even though this book is a piece of history I'm betting most people on these boards haven't read it. You can read it and learn a lot of arcane knowledge that I'm sure would be fantastic conversation starters at parties. I a witch or warlock is menacing you or you loved ones, this book will be of immeasurable help to your cause.

CONS: It is long. Because it was written by two uptight, misogynistic 15th century Catholic inquisitors it reads like it was written by two uptight, misogynistic 15th century Catholic inquisitors. In other words, it is boring.

2.[i] Kwaidan: Stories and Studies of Strange Things[/i] by Lafcadio Hearn. The author was a rather interesting character. Born in Greece, he moved to the United States and took up work as a newspaper reporter in Cincinnati. He was fired from his job after he married a black woman (interracial marriage being at that time illegal). He moved again to New Orleans where he wrote a number of news articles on the city's unique culture. He finally wound up in Japan, again doing newspaper work. His commission expired but instead of returning he took up work as a teacher, having fallen in love with the country he was assigned to report on. He spent the rest of his life in Japan, writing books about its culture, myths, and stories.

Kwaidan is a collect of Far Eastern ghost stories which Hearn translated into English. These stories served as the basis for the movie of the same name, directed by Masaki Kobayashi. Both the book and the the movie are considered to be classics.

3. [i]
The Humbugs of the World An Account of Humbugs, Delusions, Impositions, Quackeries, Deceits and Deceivers Generally, in All Ages[/i] by P.T. Barnum.

From amazon.com "P. T. Barnum's insightful review of humbugs, scams, deceits (and self-deceits) in culture, economics, entertainment, religion, medicine, and more." I simply though it might be fun to read the greatest humbug's ruminations on his fellow humbugs.

4. Speaking of humbug [i]Atlantis: The Antediluvian World[/i] might prove to be a fascinating read. From wiki "Atlantis: The Antediluvian World is a book published in 1882 by Minnesota populist politician Ignatius L. Donnelly, who was born in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania in 1831. Donnelly took Plato's account of Atlantis seriously and attempted to establish that all known ancient civilizations were descended from its high-neolithic culture."

I first learned of the existence of this book from the History Channel. The show was talking about how in the late 1800s, an Atlantis mania seized the United States and Europe, all thanks to Donnelly's book. It could be amusing to peruse the crackpot theories of yesteryear.

5. [i]The Case of the 16 Beans[/i] by Harry Keeler. I wrote about Mr. Keeler earlier in [url="http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php?showtopic=34589"]this post[/url]. I should confess that I've already downloaded the book but due to time constraints I haven't progressed passed the 3 chapter, so I shouldn't be very far ahead of everyone else.

[MinDonner]

I'd be up for this. It's pretty easy to search at [url="http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Main_Page"]Project Gutenberg[/url] for free downloadable books; from a quick title-keyword search on various topics, my favourite so far is [url="http://www.gutenberg.org/files/22033/22033-8.txt"]Plotting in Pirate Seas[/url] which looks like a super cheesy adventure romp. There is also some decent early fantasy available like Lord Dunsany, but as he's mostly short stories then that's not quite what we're looking for...

[wildfire]

I'd be interested, sounds like fun :)

[Vrana]

I'd like to join. But I do not have any good suggestions off the top of my head.

I think the most interesting of the ones suggested thus far was the one on Japan. But really, anything's fine with me, I like group readings.

[Serious Callers Only]

Do you want to use my ebook reader? Only html, txt or rtf (inside a zip or rar too) compliant:
[url="http://code.google.com/p/bookjar/downloads/list"]http://code.google.com/p/bookjar/downloads/list[/url]

[Shield]

I'm interested. I don't know any free ebooks off the top of my head though. I'll have a think.

[Bellis]

I'm in.

[Zap Rowsdower]

[quote name='MinDonner' post='1718183' date='Mar 13 2009, 03.05']I'd be up for this. It's pretty easy to search at [url="http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Main_Page"]Project Gutenberg[/url] for free downloadable books; from a quick title-keyword search on various topics, my favourite so far is [url="http://www.gutenberg.org/files/22033/22033-8.txt"]Plotting in Pirate Seas[/url] which looks like a super cheesy adventure romp. There is also some decent early fantasy available like Lord Dunsany, but as he's mostly short stories then that's not quite what we're looking for...[/quote]

I had the same thought regarding Dunsany. I would have no objection to reading a book of short stories by that author but after I a look at his bibliography I noticed a book that might suit our purposes well:

"Don Rodriguez: Chronicles of Shadow Valley" by Lord Dunsany. The gist of the plot as described by wiki 'A coming of age story set in the mythical "golden age" of Spain. The titular character is excluded from the inheritance of the family castle on the grounds that given his expertise with sword and mandolin he should be able to win his own estate and bride.' A hard copy of the book is only 188 pages so it would be a very brisk read. I've heard that Lovecraft's writing were influenced by Dunsany.

I had some time to think and I've come up with some additional ideas:

"The Riddle of the Sands by Erskine Childers." In the early 1900s, relations between England and Germany took a nosedive when the Kaiser started building his High Seas Fleet. Anti-German sentiment and invasion paranoia were reflected in a number of work of popular culture. "The Riddle of the Sands," was probably one of the most famous examples of that genre of entertainment. As I understand it, the plot of the books concerns a fiendish German plot to invade the British isles.

"The Moon Pool" by Abraham Merritt. From wiki 'Merritt's stories typically revolve around conventional pulp magazine themes: lost civilizations, hideous monsters, etc. His heroes are gallant Irishmen or Scandinavians, his villains treacherous Germans or Russians (depending on the politics of the time) and his heroines often virginal, mysterious and scantily clad.

What sets Merritt apart from the typical pulp author, however, is his lush, florid prose style and his exhaustive, at times exhausting, penchant for adjective-laden detail. Merritt's fondness for micro-description nicely complements the pointillistic style of Bok's illustrations, and often serves to highlight and radicalize the inherent fetishistic tendencies of pulp sf.'

"The Moon Pool" is about modern explorers discovering a lost world/civilization. Probably more scantily clad virgins and heroic Scandinavians than you can shake a stick at between the pages of this book.

"The Insidious Dr. Fu Manchu" by Sax Rohmer. Back in the early 20ths century, the villainous Fu Manchu was one of the great, iconic pulp villains. Over the years the evil doctor launched a number of schemes to take over the world and to destroy Western Civilization. In his film incarnations, Fu Manchu has been played by such actors as Boris Karloff and Christopher Lee.

"The Insidious Dr. Fu Manchu," is the first book in Rohmer's series. The heroic Sir Denis Nayland Smith must battle Fu Manchu and defeat the Yellow Peril.

"The House of the Vampire " by George Sylvester Viereck. I'm afraid I don't know much about this one- I think it is some sort of Victorian Gothic novel. It has something to do with a psychic vampire.

[Rumarumo]

You still interested in taking people on for this? If not, it's cool, I have work anyway ;)

[Zap Rowsdower]

[quote name='Yerman' post='1719128' date='Mar 13 2009, 18.59']You still interested in taking people on for this? If not, it's cool, I have work anyway ;)[/quote]

Sure, The only deadline I've posted so far is Wednesday next week when voting will commence. After the voting starts people can still join, but for organization purposes I won't add any books you suggest to this list since it will make things difficult if new entries are available once someone has already voted for a book.

Even after we choose the book and start reading everyone is free to participate in the thread. Even if you join late I'd be happy to hear your thoughts on the book.

[quote name='Triskele' post='1719128' date='Mar 13 2009, 18.59']I would be in only in a tentative sense. I'm in school right now and were I to manage my time perfectly I could participate but I can't guarantee that will happen.[/quote]

Sure, I completely understand. I'm thinking it would be a good idea to choose one of the shorter books that only run 200 or so pages. That way any reading schedule we agree upon won't be too taxing, timewise.

[Zap Rowsdower]

[quote name='Serious Callers Only' post='1718874' date='Mar 13 2009, 13.57']Do you want to use my ebook reader? Only html, txt or rtf (inside a zip or rar too) compliant:
[url="http://code.google.com/p/bookjar/downloads/list"]http://code.google.com/p/bookjar/downloads/list[/url][/quote]

Thank you, very kind of you. But, if you don't mind, could you explain how I would go about using that reader? Are there any special installation instructions? Do I need to download all the files there? I'm sorry but I'm somewhat of a technological ignoramus.



Another book that I thought of for the List:

"The Worm of Ouroboros," by Eric Rücker Eddison. According to Wiki "The Worm Ouroboros (1922) is a heroic high fantasy novel by Eric Rücker Eddison. The book describes the protracted war between the domineering King Gorice of Witchland and the Lords of Demonland in an imaginary world that appears mainly medieval and partly reminiscent of Norse sagas.

As an early and ambitious high fantasy, The Worm Ouroboros is often compared with J. R. R. Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings (which it predates by 32 years). Tolkien read The Worm Ouroboros, and praised it in print.

Whereas Tolkien invented a backdrop of cultures, histories and languages, in The Worm Ouroboros the prose style is central. It is arguably one of the more convincing examples of mock-archaic high diction; as a translator of old Norse sagas and a connoisseur of medieval and Renaissance poetry, Eddison had the required scholarship.

While Eddison relishes exotic personal and place names, he seems to have given little thought to plausible etymology and consistency, unlike Tolkien's layers of invented languages. On the other hand, Tolkien's prose style may seem pedestrian in comparison to Eddison's. However, Eddison's use of archaic words makes his text far less accessible to readers unwilling to take the time to look up the words."

It sounds like an interesting book, but the main problem I see with it is that it approaches 500 pages. I doubt we'll choose this book for the group reading due to the length, but I just wanted to throw the name out there in case anyone out there likes high fantasy and would like to give the book a whirl.

As a reminder, Wednesday the book voting will begin. Hopefully we can wrap that up by Friday and begin the group reading. I will cast a vote as well but I'll reserve my vote until everyone else has voted so I can break any ties that occur. I don't want to delay this thing for a runoff election.

[Muttering Bill]

I'm in, provided that I can find a paper copy of the selected book(s) in one of my local shops (because I refuse to read a whole book off of a computer screen).

I don't have anything to add to the list now.

[wolverine]

I would definitely be interested but it would depend on the book to be read.

[Serious Callers Only]

[quote name='Zap Rowsdower' post='1720478' date='Mar 16 2009, 02.34']Thank you, very kind of you. But, if you don't mind, could you explain how I would go about using that reader? Are there any special installation instructions? Do I need to download all the files there? I'm sorry but I'm somewhat of a technological ignoramus.[/quote]
you download a release (last one), unzip to a directory and double click on one Bookjar.jar file (i don't have a installer yet - pure laziness).

A window will open, and then you can click the keyboard letter (o)
to open a filechooser or dragn'drop a file on the reader. The file can be a rtf, html, htm or rtf file, and it can be compressed in a zip or rar.
If you want a version that has text to speech i have it too (working on another with a better voice).

And huh, if you're going to read poetry, its probably best not to use this, since it tries to reformat un-punctuated paragraphs.

[Shield]

[quote name='Zap Rowsdower' post='1720478' date='Mar 16 2009, 02.34']"The Worm of Ouroboros," by Eric Rücker Eddison.

.[/quote]


Now that would work for me seeing as I bought a print copy of the book ages ago and have yet to entice myself to read it. However judging by the density of the print, and the "quaintness" of the language, I can imagine this would be a hellish read off the screen

[The Pita]

I would like to participate.
"Newton's Sleep" by I Really Don't Remember Who. can be found as a free e-book.
"Batman: The Long Halloween" Again, don't remember the author
"From Hell" by Alan Moore.
Just what I have and haven't read yet.

[Serious Callers Only]

[quote name='Shield' post='1721025' date='Mar 16 2009, 17.15']Now that would work for me seeing as I bought a print copy of the book ages ago and have yet to entice myself to read it. However judging by the density of the print, and the "quaintness" of the language, I can imagine this would be a hellish read off the screen[/quote]

Huh, that why you use a screen reader. To increase the font size. If i read everything with the tiny font that books use i would already be blind (3000+ books later).