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The Great Hunt


Jaxom 1974

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Mods, I couldn't find the old thread, though I did look...please merge if you want...

Okay, I said I was going to give book 2 a go after re-reading EotW. Well, The Great Hunt certainly is better. More happened in the first 50 pages than all of book 1. There are hints of the actual overreadhing plot to the story. More to the Aes Sedai than meets the eye (though we obviously knew that anyway, it's still nice to have some specifics).

I'm still having issues with most of the main characters as none of them are as of yet sure of anything. Who they are, what they want to be, how people react to them. It's the minor charcters that I'm enjoying thus far...Hurin the sniffer, the river boat captain, people like that. Thank goodness I know this series goes on forever, because right now, Rand is one of the most difficuly heroes to actually like. "Woolheaded" indeed.

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Ah, yes...the whining bit. I remember reading TGH and wanting to yell at him "DEAL WITH IT" at least once (too much denial on his part). But ask yourself...would you whine in his position? I'm not really trying to make a smart-ass point or anything, but if I found out I was responsible for the world's safety and existence, I'd look around and say "You serious....? Oh hell...are you SURE it's not someone else?"

But Rand is probably one of the more interesting heroes I've come across. Unlike some other heros, he's not quick to adapt to the whole "savior" role. It takes time.

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If Rand didn't "whine" about it, it would have been horribly dumb. Rand and his buddies in this book are very well characterized.

I mean, seriously, if your Rand you've got to remember, someone just essentially "proved" to you that you are the Anti-Christ. You have come to usher in the end of the world and are a reviled and hated figure ALREADY.

SPOILER: startish of TGH
Shit, even your friends are avoiding you now. That was one of Jordan's best bits. When Rand tells Perrin and Mat, it's not "Oh, cool, let's have an adventure!!!", it's "Wow ...... <backs away slowly> ..... How about that. We can .... <backs away more> we can still be friends. Yeah. ...<runs for it>.".

TGH is the best of the "traditional quest style" books that start the series off.

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If you like The Great Hunt better than The Eye of the World, definitely stick with the series. Even though the third book is a step backwards, the overriding plot only gets richer and the secondary characters only get more interesting. Eventually the plot gets too rich, and the characters become too overwhelming, but that's another story.

I've been doing some rereading this summer and I realized that these books, rather than being great for their plot and pacing, are perfect books to get lost in during the summer. The pace is so leisurely, and the plot so complex, that it's the perfect series to read on the beach for hours and tune out from the real world. They're not exactly page-turners, but you can still easily get lost in some of the later volumes.

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Rand is a 19-20 year old young shepherd from the back of beyond. The only thing he has had to fight off is wolves from the sheep. He's now been told he has to save the world, destroy it and fight the greatest evil in the land. I think his reactions are normal.

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I mean, seriously, if your Rand you've got to remember, someone just essentially "proved" to you that you are the Anti-Christ. You have come to usher in the end of the world and are a reviled and hated figure ALREADY.

Anti-Christ? Nah. More like the opposite. When people think of Anti-Christ, they think of some evil leader that wants to rule/destroy the world (for some reason...). But I see your point.

Rand has to save it, but break it in order to do so. He has to destroy their way of live and make them see what's coming. He needs to give the world that slap in the face so it can stop worrying about their petty fuedalisms and start worrying about the fact that the Destroyer is breaking free to...you know...destroy. And on top of that, he has to DEFEAT Shai'tan.

That being said, Rand is one of the best Messianic figures I've read in fantasy. As soon as his friends find out, they want to run for the hills, unlike in other books in which they'd stay and probably talk about how they're gonna stick with him 'till the end or something like that. That's good storytelling.

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I'm actually also reading TGH right now, and I have to join the chorus of Rand-defenders. This is a case where it's actually appropriate to have some angst / whining.

I assume it's ok to post spoilers from EOTW? Oh what the hell...

He can channel and has been told that he's the Dragon, which means that, more or less he's destined to go mad, 'break the world' be hated by everyone and his existence is a sign that the world as he knows it is about to end, imminently. People are going to want to hunt him down and kill or 'gentle' him. And he has, apparently, what amounts to the devil in person whispering doubts in his ear.

SPOILER: Don't read this unless you want horrible spoiler of horribleness for later on in the series

I know it's really Ishamael, but at the moment as far as anyone is aware it's actually the dark one himself

-Poobs

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If you like The Great Hunt better than The Eye of the World, definitely stick with the series. Even though the third book is a step backwards, the overriding plot only gets richer and the secondary characters only get more interesting. Eventually the plot gets too rich, and the characters become too overwhelming, but that's another story.

I've been doing some rereading this summer and I realized that these books, rather than being great for their plot and pacing, are perfect books to get lost in during the summer. The pace is so leisurely, and the plot so complex, that it's the perfect series to read on the beach for hours and tune out from the real world. They're not exactly page-turners, but you can still easily get lost in some of the later volumes.

I feel that the third book was the best of the series and had the best worldbuilding of any of his books. The true impact of Rand's charachter and the implications of him being savior/destroyer are really brought to life in this one. The end sequence is also fantastic.

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Eventually the plot gets too rich

reserving a bit of judgment until the corpulent female cantillates, this is probably correct. i look at WoT as a sack of overripe fruit at this point, whereas it was not quite ripe in the first few books; soon it will be rotten; the fruit flies are already circling.

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Maybe I'm not making myself clear. While I don't have issues with the issues Rand faces, it almost, at times, feels like too much self pity/whining/loathing on Jordan's part for him. Right now, where I'm at in the book, I don't get any sense that the character is going to try to deal with his problems, let alone be capable of doing so. That makes him hard to read at times. Right now.

I know enough of the series in general to hang in there and suck it up myself, but midway through his second book, Jordan's not creating main characters I can root for easily. But he's also created a world that I feel is worth the exploration of. (Even though I'm occasionally having issues keeping track of the various characters. Is there a good cheat sheet run down of who's who somewhere?)

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There's Encyclopaedia WOT which has full character listings and stuff, as well as chapter summaries and all sorts. But you'd have to be VERY VERY careful to avoid spoilers. A note of warning : the character pages, as well as having a basic description of the characters list, chronologically every chapter that character appears in along with a very brief summary of that character's goings on in that chapter. The chronological (in universe) nature of the descriptions can provide spoilers for stuff that happened earlier but is revealed later which you can read unintentionally. Especially stuff about characters' pasts and stuff that happens in the prequel.

-Poobs

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I loved TGH. It's still one of my favorite WOT books, despite the existence of TSR and LoC (my other faves). Then again, I liked TEofW as well.

TGH broadened the world and made the overall complexity of what was really happening clear without bogging us down like later books would. It is also full of great scenes, which I won't describe even in spoiler text (mostly because I can't do them justice, and I don't have time). The ending alone makes the entire book worth it, but that isn't to say that the rest of the book isn't great, because it is.

Read away, and enjoy.

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Maybe I'm not making myself clear. While I don't have issues with the issues Rand faces, it almost, at times, feels like too much self pity/whining/loathing on Jordan's part for him. Right now, where I'm at in the book, I don't get any sense that the character is going to try to deal with his problems, let alone be capable of doing so. That makes him hard to read at times. Right now.

There is also the point that *a lot* of people are trying to push Rand in various directions at this point. Basically everyone is trying to use him for something, Rand has serious problems with that. At a certain point he realizes that if he doesen't want to be manipulated he's going to have to set things in motion himself. At this stage he still thinks running away is an option.

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Brilliant book. Absolutely adore the series. If (when?) a film adaptation is made, I'll be in the cue. I would seriously pray that they not balls it up, but if I'm ever going into any film feeling optimistic, it'd be for one of the WoT ones.

Now that I think of it, I have a ASoIf tattoo already; I might need to add a WoT one, and properly fan-boy myself. :D

/splurge

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I know enough of the series in general to hang in there and suck it up myself, but midway through his second book, Jordan's not creating main characters I can root for easily.

The question is... does he need to? Many people would (incorrectly) say that WoT is a black and white story. While I think that is blatantly untrue, one also has to consider that WoT is breaking out of the mould where the main characters are easy to like. Sure, there are some. Initially Perrin is easy to like, later its Mat.

But every character has foibles that make it tough to glorify or hero worship them. And while their growth makes these issues less important and makes it possible for the reader to be involved in their stories, the growth is slow. I'd say the characters grow into their roles very realistically. No sudden readiness to save the world. And, I suspect, no absence of flaws and issues when the time does come to save the world.

Sometimes, I wonder if this is why Jordan's characters get all that bile thrown at them. They aren't cool. At all. And that hits too close to home.

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I feel that the third book was the best of the series and had the best worldbuilding of any of his books. The true impact of Rand's charachter and the implications of him being savior/destroyer are really brought to life in this one. The end sequence is also fantastic.

I agree, the third book is one of the best in my mind as well.

As for The Great Hunt, all I have to say is Ingtar gets one of the best momments in the book, probably in my personal top 5 in the series.

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I am rereading the entire series at the moment, I am up to Winter's Heart.

SPOILER: spoilers!
And Jesus Fuckin Christ I have forgotten how goddam annoying Elayne Trakand is... She is Cersei with half the brains and less maturity than Myrcella/Sansa.

As for the main characters Mat was always likeable.

Yeah he gives Rand the Cold Shoulder for most of the Great Hunt, but that half that is the Dagger and when the Portal Stones go nuts and show them a bunch of alternate timelines. He is very very persitant that he would never betray Rand.

Perrin on the other hand goes from likeable to me pretty much despising him by Knife of Dreams.

There are characters flaws and there is just shit thats annoying beyond belief.

Rand's endless whining about Women, "I can't kill women" wah wah wah, not even when they are 3000+ year old inhuman psychotic evil bitches who are about to kill 2 women you like. Or the woman who tries to steal the Sun Throne while he is captured by Elaida's Aes Sedai, she murders people including her maid and so he punishes her but she hangs herself and Rand decides that was all his fault she was a weak nasty piece of crap. Mind you the other 2 do this aswell just not as much as Rand.

Perrin and his whining about the Axe are another one, wah wah wah the axe the axe its so evals. So I will just run about braining people with a smith's hammer cause apparantly thats different and better.

Jordan over did the character flaws and ended up with massively flawed characters, several of which just suck.

I have to come to the conclusion he should have stuck to the 5 from Edmond's Field as main PoV through the entire series plus the guest povs he likes to use.

At the very least not having to read Elayne Trakands annoying thoughts would vastly improve the series.

But yes I loved the Great Hunt, Ingtars last stand is a great moment. Knife of the Dreams had several moment which were nearly as good. The Golden Crane and Mat dancing around the Seanchan with pure tactical brilliance.

edited by Xray to conceal spoilers

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